Lotus/Proton are the engineering/technology provider to this plan. For them, the risks are limited but the deal is potentially very rewarding. First they export Gen2-Campro to China and they find a partner willing to invest in Hybrid/electric tech. They might get their first customer for Campro/EVE and -why not- even export it to the US.

But as I said this is only pure speculation based on what is known of the ZAP/Youngman JV. time will tell.

bigfish, your comments continue to be very entertaining, i remember you posting just a few weeks back, that this whole china-proton deal is a hoax, and it will never happen, so what do you have to say about that now?
————-

To the best of my knowledge, I never said “china-proton deal is a hoax” or the like or something implied the same. Care to pinpoint which comment(s) from me that have such thing from PT Blog “Statistics” section: -

http://paultan.org/stats/?stats_author=BigFish

Otherwise, I consider your statement is without justification, or “you have memory problems”, or aheem, you are “big mouth talk at your whim and fancy”!

First Lotus is developing on electric car for ZAP. The car is based on the APX design and should feature advanced batteries from ABAT of China.
http://www.zapworld.com/electric-vehicles/electric-cars/zap-x

Zap is very small company with a very “average” management and I don’t believe its pockets are deep enough to bring this car to the market. Meanwhile this project might be very profitable to Lotus. Basically they are being paid to develop a very exiting 100% electric car. They will gain a lot know how and prove once again that they are one of the finest car engineering company.

Anyway, in recent development Zap and Youngman have etablished a joint venture company “to manufacture electric and hybrid vehicles”. The head of this joint venture is Albert Lam (former CEO of Lotus Engineering).

Here is an interesting quote from the bio of Mr. Lam on Zap website:

“Mr. Lam recently stepped down from his position as CEO of Lotus Engineering to pursue new business opportunities between Lotus, its parent company Proton, and one of its key clients in China, Youngman Automotive Group. Mr. Lam was responsible for bringing Youngman, ZAP and Lotus Engineering together for a joint venture to develop, manufacture and market electric and hybrid luxury coaches, buses, trucks and passenger cars.”
http://www.zapworld.com/node/19

Well, Youngman has very exiting plan and I think the EVE hybrid is not very far from China’s road.

“They suppose to enter china long time a go, very sleepy & too slow la, but anyway ok la to clear old stock. Now P1 recognize no need to xport to europe
anymore coz their car low quality, may be can fight with china car.”

for a start, i think its unaccurate to talk about the past. i believe comments should continue from the new management onwards. who cares what proton failed to do 10 years ago? today they are doing it. thats what matters. at least we are seeing new things and they are moving faster than they ever were in the past.

also, what old stock are you talking about? the gen2 is still on sale in malaysia, as well as the UK, australia, singapore, thailand, .etc. etc. and this gen2 sold in china is left hand drive. proton’s factory is still building these cars. please talk facts and not blind speculation.

bigfish, your comments continue to be very entertaining, i remember you posting just a few weeks back, that this whole china-proton deal is a hoax, and it will never happen, so what do you have to say about that now?

January 12, 2008 @ 5:06 am

http://www.chinacartimes.com/wp-content/2007/10/arnieatyoungman.jpg
arnold the governator from usa has plans for the rebadged gen2, like the Eve Hybrid
——————————————-

wut da…..
arnold the terminator looks gen2 furiously!! terminator and EVE, nice combo in CA.

I believe.. there’s many malaysian basher here registering chinese forum and giving bad comment on proton to.. because it’s not proton really bad.. but they just hate proton in no matter what proton doing good is.
—————
ezralimm said,
January 11, 2008 @ 11:58 am

According to the link you gave, chinese people are gonna read posts on malaysian websites such as this one. Some chinese readers are going to read your comment about their country.

————-

lolipop88 said,
January 11, 2008 @ 1:27 pm

>> Ya correct so talk with low profile!!

===========

By mere “believe” many bashers registering at Chinese website and give bad comment to P1 is an easy way of use of blame shifting tactic and in the state of denial. The reverse is true for blind defenders when you observe PT Blog, the moment blog about China makes like Chery or rebadged like Naza Sutera, all blind defenders will stick their neck out with “cocky parrot” talk about “no confident”, “fugly”, low quality products, etc.

So, lolipop88 statement is correct.

Our auto industry with local output of approximate 500K units (National and CKD) is just a fraction of China total output of anticipate up to 20 millions car by 2010.

Do you think low quality can sustain 20 million car production ??????? It must be the biggest joke and liar from blind defenders.

January 11, 2008 @ 10:02 am

Dear MisterBenjo,
So how good the original part(s)? Especially those supplied by cronies vendors. Previous VW audit (before VW-P1 partnership talk collapsed) shpw 90% of the parts does not met VW quality standard!

————————————————————-

this is facts or just another rumour

———————————-
The fact on the finding from the previous TUV audit that only major OEM supplier for proton in AA rating and majority of small supplier score lower point. Of course this TUV rating was not accepted by almost the ‘reject’ supplier that it came in news their disagreement with the result.
However, when Dato Syed Zainal takeover from TM, the small supplier has been reorganized, merged and quality issue become important issue for him.
But the result from VW never make it to to public, so its hard to justify the news even base on on previous TUV audit.

—————————————————————

i know about that but focus what he said ,90%>This is only assumption and speculation….I dont believe anything but facts.

you fail to mention that there are dozens of MADE IN CHINA car models that are a rip off the design of European and Japanese that are selling at the same or lower price range than farking Proton. nobody is expecting Gen 2 to compete with Toyota, Honda, VW because Proton is simply not in that league but when competing on prices, there are other many cars that cost the same as Gen 2 in China. I find it annoying when people “get ignorant”

2) I’ve been to china four times. And i dare say that the Gen2/RCR will look pretty good compared to the cars the chinese people are used to seeing.
>>> With the price selling at RMB130K, that is too much and competitor is Japaneses/ German/ France. Price after tax could be goes up to 140K++

Link to>> http://car.autohome.com.cn/3563/list.html

3) Have you been to china? I dont think so… anyone who has been there in recent years will not call it a third world country*.
>>> I’m work at China… market is there but the price should below RMB100K. So locally assembly is a must!!

4) How do you know the Gen2 will not be competitive? I happened to ask a friend from mainland china, a Shanghainese dude, about the prices of international makes… I forgot the exact details, but the prices are about the same as malaysia. Yes, a Yaris/City/Camry is expensive in china too!
>>> Price war at China Auto market is was really hot!! Car price here is far cheaper then Msia, and Shanghai car expensive coz of tax… different province with different tariff..

According to the link you gave, chinese people are gonna read posts on malaysian websites such as this one. Some chinese readers are going to read your comment about their country.
>> Ya correct so talk with low profile!!

andyisboy said,
January 10, 2008 @ 10:27 pm
hello there:
anyone really think this car can sell in the 3rd world China? stop dreaming please
please have a look have Chinese think of this car !

_______________________________________________

1) China is a NEWLY INDUSTRIALIZED COUNTRY. It is not a third world country. They have better pay equality than malaysia FYI.
2) I’ve been to china four times. And i dare say that the Gen2/RCR will look pretty good compared to the cars the chinese people are used to seeing.
3) Have you been to china? I dont think so… anyone who has been there in recent years will not call it a third world country*.
4) How do you know the Gen2 will not be competitive? I happened to ask a friend from mainland china, a Shanghainese dude, about the prices of international makes… I forgot the exact details, but the prices are about the same as malaysia. Yes, a Yaris/City/Camry is expensive in china too!

According to the link you gave, chinese people are gonna read posts on malaysian websites such as this one. Some chinese readers are going to read your comment about their country.
—————————————————————-

Yes I agree.

_______________________________________________

1) China is a NEWLY INDUSTRIALIZED COUNTRY. It is not a third world country. They have better pay equality than malaysia FYI.
2) I’ve been to china four times. And i dare say that the Gen2/RCR will look pretty good compared to the cars the chinese people are used to seeing.
3) Have you been to china? I dont think so… anyone who has been there in recent years will not call it a third world country*.
4) How do you know the Gen2 will not be competitive? I happened to ask a friend from mainland china, a Shanghainese dude, about the prices of international makes… I forgot the exact details, but the prices are about the same as malaysia. Yes, a Yaris/City/Camry is expensive in china too!

According to the link you gave, chinese people are gonna read posts on malaysian websites such as this one. Some chinese readers are going to read your comment about their country.

define decent.

decent to a family guy: comfort/reliability/bootspace/low TCO.
decent to a sporty youngster: 0-100times/horsepower/sports suspension bla bla bla.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China_Business/IG10Cb02.html

just wonder how much Europestar RCR sales will be next year ?

————————————————————-

this is facts or just another rumour

———————————-
The fact on the finding from the previous TUV audit that only major OEM supplier for proton in AA rating and majority of small supplier score lower point. Of course this TUV rating was not accepted by almost the ‘reject’ supplier that it came in news their disagreement with the result.
However, when Dato Syed Zainal takeover from TM, the small supplier has been reorganized, merged and quality issue become important issue for him.
But the result from VW never make it to to public, so its hard to justify the news even base on on previous TUV audit.

January 10, 2008 @ 10:27 pm

hello there:
anyone really think this car can sell in the 3rd world China? stop dreaming please
please have a look have Chinese think of this car !
____

I believe.. there’s many malaysian basher here registering chinese forum and giving bad comment on proton to.. because it’s not proton really bad.. but they just hate proton in no matter what proton doing good is.

While its good for Proton to get larger markets, I can’t loose the feeling that this is not sustainable.

China is a fast moving country. They are getting more and more capitilistic and the general population gets more materialistic by the day.

Proton/Yongman, may not be the brand that the average chinese aspire to, where the more affluent may rather get European luxury marks (You can see big Audis everywhere)….. It leaves to be seen if Proton can up the ante and spit out new models faster or it will be stale news to a fast moving market.

Perhaps Yongman is betting on some latent reservation against Japanese products, but then again, the new generation would not really care what happened 50 years ago.

Wht reason may get China to buy this car?? Anti japanese car? No there is VW Bora/ Peugeot 307/ buick GM/ Hyundai Elantra..kia cerato…?

Will be another disaster to proton, same as the case many yrs ago.. sales Satria to Hungary and lastly only few units sold.. Why? coz the price is same as Mitsubishi Colt!!