January 28, 2008 @ 1:32 pm

350d, have u seen the Momo steering fitted in the passo? Even mitsu lancer steering fell more prestige… U can see the fake carbon fiber around the steering, fell a bit cheapo…”
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I don’t want to have any argument with you. But there’s no fake carbon fiber around the steering. Cheers bro

Sifu,

You should really start your own blog

Btw, why oni waja gets twin pipe? I tot Gen2 shud get that too, so that can distinguish it more than any normal CPS-less gen2, just like waja CPS from normal waja too (aside from waja 1.8)

proton campro cps is certainly more aggresive racier (top end advantage) than toyota vvt-i
because of the ‘lift’

(sorry dear forumer, i talk too much here, i leave the final say to sifu,)

honda first stage of v-tech at lower rpm ,one intake valve is almost diable or very very low, -hence torque advantage,
as for campro cps, long runner- for torque advantage,

honda second stage of the v-tech, both intake valve runs equally but at normal midrange cam lobe,
as for campro (not sure ,probally is the begining of short runner without lift actuated)

honda third stage, racier cam take place,
as for campro, short runner + lift in action, for futher hp and subtancial amount of torque,

anyway apart from 3 stage v tech, for some model honda does goes with intake resonance with variable timing and lift,(2 stage)

alfa also do have variator with tunable intake for some T spark,

so, i ll stop here,
thanks sifu
SALUTE! new Campro,

Hi everybody!

Sorry guys for the repeated posts. I thought my posts went missing.

To Proton GL:

As i have REPEATEDLY SAID, the CPS engine doesn’t come with a variable valve timing system, it only has the variable valve lift mechanism. Instead of using variable valve timing system, the CPS uses VIM which serves the same purpose: improve/increase torque of the engine. The CPS cam cover is the same one with normal Campro engine. There is no difference with the cam cover used. However, if you get a chance to see the CPS engine, u can see the solenoid actuator for the hydraulic fluid (actuator for the tappets) on the opposite site of the cam cover (opposite site of the engine, near the air intake snorkel).

Cheers!
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thanks sifu

The designs to begin with, was not bad. It was quality that people were not satisfied with. Let’s hope they have improved on these 2 models as they had in the Persona (at least in the show room units).

Engine? Don’t hold your breath. Really.

so really is cps hp/torque at second half

need more tips from sifu,

the fast cam lobe shape or profile anyway will have the valve opening and closing with its new phase/duration might as well benefit the second half of the rpm, so by nature the oppening is advanced and certain amount of overlap is there, so its as good,

(i cant help my feeling that its without vvt)

correct me sifu

if it posible campro cps in a satria neo??

Sorry guys for the repeated posts. I thought my posts went missing.

To Proton GL:

As i have REPEATEDLY SAID, the CPS engine doesn’t come with a variable valve timing system, it only has the variable valve lift mechanism. Instead of using variable valve timing system, the CPS uses VIM which serves the same purpose: improve/increase torque of the engine. The CPS cam cover is the same one with normal Campro engine. There is no difference with the cam cover used. However, if you get a chance to see the CPS engine, u can see the solenoid actuator for the hydraulic fluid (actuator for the tappets) on the opposite site of the cam cover (opposite site of the engine, near the air intake snorkel).

Cheers!

and the lift actuator is of course cant be seen,

almost like simillar to variocam plus which equvalent vvt-l ,,i guess, -but correct me…

almost 2.11 pagi now ,nite

To yippi33:

Yes, its a fuzzy logic system which uses a fuzzy logic controller to predict the possible valve timing suitable for the current conditions.

To san_j:

The CPS switches from low speed rpm lobe to high speed rpm lobe at aprrox 3800rpm. At this speed also, the VIM switches from long runner to short runner.

To atkop:

This is something about the new engine. It will use force induction system which has variable intake geometry to reduce/eliminate lag. It will be coupled with variable valve timing and cam profile shifting. It has all the ‘goodies’ that u can think of! I call this the ‘Campro Cocktail’. I just revealed to u something which i shouldn’t so please keep it low. Using a bigger cc engine nowdays is always an option due to its development cost, emission and fuel consumption issues. The system above, provides good consumption at low speed, good low end and high end torque and most importantly power only when u need it.

About the number of personel, u got me wrong. The amount i mentioned(60+Lotus) IS ONLY IN POWERTRAIN DEPARTMENT. NOT THE ENTIRE RND. The entire PROTON RND has FEW HUNDRED personels, including engineers, technicians, and support staffs from Lotus.

To Proton GL:

The actuating mechanism for the high speed lobe is similar to the Porsche’s VarioCam Plus. It has a dual function tappet where the centre tappet is for the low speed lobe and at aprrox 3800rpm, a solenoid actuator releases hydraulic fluid to the tappet and locks the high speed lobe and low speed lobe tappet together via a pin. It similar to the VarioCam Plus Variable Valve Lift Mechanism. Its similar because as u said, It was both developed by Lotus. However please bear in mind the VarioCam Plus system comes with the variable valve timing mechanism which the CPS doesn’t have. U can see the triple lobe and dual tappet mechanism in the link below from Porsche:

http://homepage.virgin.net/shalco.com/VarioCamPlus.htm

Cheers!

(lotus engineering)

it 3 lobes (as variocam plus do) , and how does the fast cam/lobe actuated,
if it actuated by tapped itself, for sure its variocam plus,

this one important key answer from sifu, if sifu clarify this, thanks,

Somehow my previous post went missing!

To yippi33:

Yes, its a fuzzy logic system which uses a fuzzy logic controller to predict the possible valve timing suitable for the current conditions.

To san_j:

The CPS switches from low speed rpm lobe to high speed rpm lobe at aprrox 3800rpm. At this speed also, the VIM switches from long runner to short runner.

To atkop:

This is something about the new engine. It will use force induction system which has variable intake geometry to reduce/eliminate lag. It will be coupled with variable valve timing and cam profile shifting. It has all the ‘goodies’ that u can think of! I call this the ‘Campro Cocktail’. I just revealed to u something which i shouldn’t so please keep it low. Using a bigger cc engine nowdays is always an option due to its development cost, emission and fuel consumption issues. The system above, provides good consumption at low speed, good low end and high end torque and most importantly power only when u need it.

About the number of personel, u got me wrong. The amount i mentioned(60+Lotus) IS ONLY IN POWERTRAIN DEPARTMENT. NOT THE ENTIRE RND. The entire PROTON RND has FEW HUNDRED personels, including engineers, technicians, and support staffs from Lotus.

Cheers!

To yippi33:

Yea, it is fuzzy logic system. It uses a fuzzy logic controller to predict output.

To san_j:

The CPS switches from low rpm lobe to a high rpm lobe at approx 3800rpm. At this rpm also, the VIM switches from long runner to short runner.

To atkop:

So this is what i can tell you: it will be a force induction system that uses a variable intake geometry to reduce/eliminate lag. This will be coupled with a variable valve timing system and cam-profile shifting (like cps). Its a combination of the best things that you can think of. I call it the ‘Campro Cocktail’. Hahahahahahaha, i just revealed to you what i am not supposed to, so please keep it low. Bigger cc engines is always an option nowdays as fuel consumption is an issue. Unlike the ’set up’ i mentioned above, it gives you good comsumption at low engine speeds, good torque at low end and high ends and the most important thing, power when only u need it. So i can say this is more economical then a bigger cc engine.

U are mistaken about the number of personel. The amount i mentioned (60+lotus) is ONLY IN THE POWERTRAIN DEPARTMENT. NOT THE WHOLE RND. The whole RND has about FEW HUNDRED personels including engineers, technicians and support staffs from Lotus.

haha, i asked questions , in order to satisfy, if not some of others, my very own curiosities. engine tech and development always baffles me. very intrigue…indeed, and so as you i presumed:-)

if you’re saying that there will not be any further development or upgrade as you said it of the cps at the moment, and proton is gearing for “another” direction, and there will not be a cps 2.0l anytime soon, i would reckon that the “another” direction is towards force induction tech by means of super charging the current cps 1.6l to simulate bigger toque characteristics as what bigger engine cc would normally behave. turbo charge system will introduced lag, which in turn not so practical to be used inside the commercial, every day road going car, imho, although dual seq turbo system will eliminate the lag, but the cost.. again.. squared 1

it makes sense, as cost of adding FI will be much cheaper compare to building up bigger displacement. though i would assumed that this is a “short term” solution, as building bigger cc is a much better way to go in the long run. a fren always said to me that there is no subs of power/torque than putting up those cc. not completely true though..

do you think that proton has enough personnel (60+lotus) in the RnD department to fairly compete in the global market with other car manufacturers? model lifecycle due for facelift or int upgrade is becoming shorter and shorter, and the push from auto giants to even shorten it is becoming quite evident, with the intro of new tech, and the latest automotive craze is, among others the dual clutch thing. amazing..what was the questions again? hmm

atkop

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You are certainly a person with many questions!!! Hahahahahaha, which is good actually. However, i can’t answer all your question so i will try to summarize and answer whichever is possible. I dont think there will be any uprgrade to the CPS anytime soon or in the future as Proton has other ‘plans’ (which i can’t reveal) for the future. This will not definitely be a Campro 2.0L. Just wait until it comes ot yea. Powertrain is a department in Proton’s RnD. It has about 40 engineers and 20 technicians. Lotus helps the deparment mostly in terms of technical help and advise. Mostly the design and new product development is done together. So both Proton and Lotus are equally involved together. The person in charge is surely a Malaysian.

CPS DOESN’T vary its valve timing. Please bear this in mind. Toyota’s VVT/VVT-I and Nissan’s CVTC does this. Wat CPS is actually, it has 3 lobes per intake valve. 1 low rpm lobe and 2 high rpm lobe. This is SIMILAR to the VTEC system but not EXACTLY THE SAME! What the VVT/VVT-I and CVTC engine does is ONLY vary the valve timing; ie advancing or retarding the valve opening. It DOESN”T HAVE the high and low rpm lobes LIKE THE CPS AND VTEC has. Hope u get this fact clear. I have explained the difference between CPS and VTEC above. PLEASE READ IT! Actually, the CPS and VTEC is in the SAME category.
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Thank you for detail explanation Si-Fu on the CPS..
It really answers my inquries on how’s the CPS really works..
Campro CPS beats other 1.6 engine from toyota, nissan & etc..
Eventhough the CPS only at the intake camshaft…

From my understanding, VTEC has 2 low rpm lobe and 1 high rpm lobe per intake valve rite? It also has the same config at the axhaust camshaft?

The VTEC will engaged on at certain rpm (example 5,200 rpm), Will there be also on CPS? If there is, what rpm it will be engage?

Please correct if I’m wrong…budak baru belajar..hehe..

Thank you for sharing, it’s very informative, at least for me. Now I have better knowledge abt CPS. Gen2 aside, I hope Proton hv better plan for Waja bcos i really look forward to its replacement.

In the VTEC the valve timing is based on presets in the ECU, as i mentioned above. The I-VTEC however can ‘inteligently’ vary the valve timing based on driving conditions, engine conditons and so on. It uses an Artificial Inteligence controller to predict to suitable valve timing. This is similar to the VVTL-I from Toyota
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Sounds like fuzzy logic..is it??

To atkop:

You are certainly a person with many questions!!! Hahahahahaha, which is good actually. However, i can’t answer all your question so i will try to summarize and answer whichever is possible. I dont think there will be any uprgrade to the CPS anytime soon or in the future as Proton has other ‘plans’ (which i can’t reveal) for the future. This will not definitely be a Campro 2.0L. Just wait until it comes ot yea. Powertrain is a department in Proton’s RnD. It has about 40 engineers and 20 technicians. Lotus helps the deparment mostly in terms of technical help and advise. Mostly the design and new product development is done together. So both Proton and Lotus are equally involved together. The person in charge is surely a Malaysian.

To shooter and everybody:

Please dont post as though U HAVE SEEN THE CPS ENGINE. If you are unsure of something, just don’t post or ASK. It simply shows that you lack knowledge. Do you know how CPS works? Have you seen a CPS engine camshaft? Dont simply provide a statement which is untrue.

CPS DOESN’T vary its valve timing. Please bear this in mind. Toyota’s VVT/VVT-I and Nissan’s CVTC does this. Wat CPS is actually, it has 3 lobes per intake valve. 1 low rpm lobe and 2 high rpm lobe. This is SIMILAR to the VTEC system but not EXACTLY THE SAME! What the VVT/VVT-I and CVTC engine does is ONLY vary the valve timing; ie advancing or retarding the valve opening. It DOESN”T HAVE the high and low rpm lobes LIKE THE CPS AND VTEC has. Hope u get this fact clear. I have explained the difference between CPS and VTEC above. PLEASE READ IT! Actually, the CPS and VTEC is in the SAME category.

VVT-I and VVTL-I is 2 different system. The VVTL-I is same with the I-VTEC system where it has high and low rpm lobes and can vary the valve timing inteligently (The ‘I’ stands for that). The difference between normal VTEC and I-VTEC is the inteligence of the system to vary its valve timing. In the VTEC the valve timing is based on presets in the ECU, as i mentioned above. The I-VTEC however can ‘inteligently’ vary the valve timing based on driving conditions, engine conditons and so on. It uses an Artificial Inteligence controller to predict to suitable valve timing. This is similar to the VVTL-I from Toyota. However the VVTL-I engine production has been stopped due to emission problems.

The VVT-I engine has the similar ‘inteligence’ system as i have explained above, but it does only that; VARY THE VALVE TIMING, live CVTC also. So the CPS IS DIFFERENT FROM VVT/VVT-I and CVTC systems and SIMILAR TO THE VTEC!

Please dont post blindly!!! CHECK UR FACTS!!!

Cheers!!!

but i like to wait for the completely new waja with bigger engine..i heard the rumour..

Waja ~ integrated signal light with side mirror is more class

Most important ~ price remain the same or lower

my opinon….
4 gen2 cps,i suggest,proton rename it as persona aeroback…
like they made at wira aeroback…
waja cps look ok but i not like the front grille..
and rear headlamps too,i prefer previous model…
but the model is not final product…must wail till it launch..
anyway,another effort from proton to produce hi tech engine..
congrate proton!

sorry off topic
if proton want release the saga RED…
i suggest they name it saga Knight…
kenangan lalu mengimbau kembali..
huhu..