Talks of some kind of business deal between Proton and Volkswagen have surfaced in the papers again, this time on a car assembly deal for passenger cars without taking up stake.
Volkswagen have already identified a base in Indonesia for the Touran MPV, but they have also been looking for a way to assembly their passenger cars here in Malaysia. Other than Proton, DRB-HICOM was also a potential partner name that came up in the past.
Datuk Syed Zainal confirmed sometime last week that Proton was indeed in talks with a foreign car company and hoped that something can be agreed upon before the end of the year. He did not mention which company this is, but in a Reuters report a Volkswagen spokesperson managed to be reached for comment and he confirmed that they were in talks with Proton. According to the spokesperson, the confirmed plant in Indonesia was not sufficient to serve the entire ASEAN market – it looks like they’re planning to come to this region in a big way!
These talks with Proton could be the reason why the reviewed NAP announcement has been pushed to the end of next month instead of being announced this month as previously indicated. “It’s a complicated matter. We cannot rush,” said MITI minister Datuk Mustapa Mohamed. Proton is of course at the center of the Malaysian automotive industry, thus most decisions will actually surround the company.
The foreign car company was referred to by Datuk Syed Zainal as potentially Proton’s “missing link”, which means the talks could extend beyond Proton being a contract assembler for Volkswagen – Proton could be asking to license or collaborate on certain Volkswagen tech such as platforms or engines, especially diesel engines!
Looking to sell your car? Sell it with Carro.
Barca, what’s all this boy girl thingy?
At the end of the day P1 prefers Mrs Palmer and her 5 daughter!!
Barca, what’s all this boy girl thingy?
At the end of the day P1 prefers Mrs Palmer and her 5 daughter!!
Barca, what’s all this boy girl thingy?
At the end of the day P1 prefers Mrs Palmer and her 5 daughter!!
good for proton good for VW
P1 Scirocco Campro Turbo?
would really like a scirocco, but i guess its wishful thinking for now. only car i like within my price range is a second hand E46 facelift BMW
Good for Proton if they agree on 49/51 JV.
Mgmt control to VW for first 3 years.
Yeah ! Waja will be Jetta and Perdana will be Passat. The end of golden era for T and H brand.
dream on dream on.
offtopic>>
proton must learn from vw.
with the Deutscher, proton must be self-confidence & have will to argue.
Forget abt the Campro Turbo …
We want the TSI & TDI engines.
Bro, I heard from BFM last week.. that VW is looking to source their part from Malaysia for their global manufacturer… I'm going to open a factory to produce something for VW soon… hhahah-dream on dream on.
i like volkswagen type 2. can they make a new version here?
so we getting Proton GTi and Proton Scirocco soon !
so, satria GTi name can be used again?
if it is workable….i suppose Jetta will be avail as CKD
maybe Passat will b avail too to serve ASEAN countries…
gd luck for us here.
more bullshit perhaps
we can only HOPE something good comes out from this, based on proton/govt flip-flopping on what possibly be THE most important and lucrative business venture for the malaysian automotive industry.
metaphorically, this is a case of a pretty girl (volkswagen) hitting on a boy (proton). what kind of a boy would be [insert desired word] enough to resist a pretty girl hitting on him, unless the boy only likes his kind, heheh.
if the boy 'jual mahal' too much, in due time, the pretty girl's better off hitting on someone else (another carmaker). you and i can only hope that [insert desired word] boy realize opportunities like this don't come often.
Govt still insisting that their pre selected crony vendors
are included even b4 negotiations starts with VW.
h0pe that this 2nd talks will come to reality 'cause its certainly benefitting for both parties..hope that the CKDs VW will be cheaper =D
Barca, what's all this boy girl thingy?
At the end of the day P1 prefers Mrs Palmer and her 5 daughter!!
Yeah yeah same recycled news ….later on we'd hear …"Proton hak milik negara " or " Mahathir against VW takeover " … Volks punyala gila talak nak pikat Proton tapi proton jual mahal sebab ada anak raja dari negeri kayangan mau dekat dia …then they liver happily everafter
Hope that there will be good news during this round table talk.
Proton needs to a world class partner and VW is the most ideal
choice since VW has already established themselves in China.
Hopefully Tun also shares the same vision to spur Proton forward.
hahahahaa….another talk??! Looks like the directors will have another round of free karipap & kopi session during meetings…
So the news that i hear before are true. Have to get more detail from my friend in Khazanah….. New era of proton will come with more batter quality import from VW.
They only need a CKDed hub in ASEAN region. Maybe Proton can shares some parts with locally vendored produced motorparts and CKDed VW passengers car at Tg malim plant, just like what perodua did to Avanza.
Think the proton vendors/suppliers will be in the negotiation table. As long as the VVIPs around dont think they reach agreement just like last time. I dont want to buy proton cars with crappy quality issue again even with VW engine or Lotus handling.
Very hard deal to negotiate there. Not sure if VW wants to share tech with Proton given Proton is the inferior car maker
Yup, who want to share high-tech technology to a lower standart company while not given a better stake or management in his company?
Is like customer being hold a gun by the seller and force him to buy but still in the end return him back without anything good…
Anyway i tot Bumi no need to take 30% stake if an oversea company invest!?! Does that Najib means it? Or it just another smokescreen…
If Malaysia wants to be a vendor-based car assembler
then they should open up this protected market.
I'm sure that other co's such as Honda/Nissan or even BMW/Merc
would set up their plant here.
With big names coming in our vendors will have to maintain or even up their QC stds besides that, volume would also ensure econ of scale & their feasibility.
Gone will be the mentality that w/o Proton,lots of jobs will be lost etc.
with NEP and bumiputera % equity definitely VW will withdraw the talk.
Even if the talk pass…
only those out dated VW models will go to Proton la, what Scirocco latest model somemore, otherwise how VW want to make money ? Germans are smart la.
so vague…
pray the best fer my beloved malaysia..
lots of ali baba co's will be sprouting out.
P1 , please cut the spin and crap talk.Action first and talk later, don't try to push your share prices again.
what the bangkok post had to say about the satria neo 1.6 cps.
http://www.bangkokpost.com/auto/autoreview/22449/…
"Don't go thinking that the extra will get you better performance from the uprated engine. Make it like this: performance is essentially the same as before, that is, flawed….Therefore, the real deciding factor for the CPS is whether you want to spend more merely for the looks …"
burp!
I want to booking proton GOLF GTI MK6 :-)
Good move. So Proton can learn how good to assemble car after this..maybe also how to produce quality parts.
off topic sori
what wrong with crony…..if they gud y cannot used crony that we know their abilities…but it other way around if its bad…i also do cronyism..it norm..u, me they,them all use crony allday, alltime..it a lie if you not
Imagine the entire NAP revolves around Proton. Is like there is little concern about the entire local automotive industry.
If I were VW, I would wait for the NAP to be announced first, then carry on with the talks. The NAP IS the missing link.
Who would want to invest their automotive business here if the only policy that the Gov will be making is against them.
Clearly this is a lack of sincerity.
Do you think by opening up the automotive sector will definitely bring the consumer price down ??? Or merely more profit to the importer…..Pusing2 rakyat Malaysia still kena tipu……..
pray hard for my Proton Golf…
Woww… would there be a Proton with a Scirocco look a like in future?
see? they (VW) still desperately need malaysia. (and proton).
If this to be happen..
indonesian will hate malaysia some more..
they will said we stole their investor..
malingsia.
hahaha
vw, please stay in there… otherwise they will flood again to our malaysia. they are too many here now.
After this 20+ years, we copied from Mitsubishi model, then changed to own design, and now back to copy from VW model. Where is all the R&D fund gone to? With this move, will G still provide R&D fund to proton, and for what? It has been 20 odd years, and we achieve nothing.
Proton just following the Australia's Holden strategy i guess. If that is the case, why should the so call protection scheme and taxing all consumers for? now where is all the $$ goes?
It is just the fishing strategy of VW. THey jsut want to say some thing, make the world look at Proton again. Then weeks after, they will tell the world again:
"We have call off the paln due to the close door policy that practice in Boleland. We concluded that Bolehland is not investor friendly."
if the vw can guide proton to produce some kind like skoda superb, it already a good deal.
1.2l engine like audi or 1.4l as at MkVI under the hood of new satria neo, perhaps.
So VW hoping to get high quality door handle and power window Made In Malaysia? Fat hope lah.
proton……kebajikan staff2, engineer2, designer tak dijaga..increment, bonus semua dah cut….mana tak semua org mau blah dr proton……!!!
Staff Proton tak dijaga?
Sebab itulah "Tun" declare half month bonus!!
Lepas dapat bonus – cabut !!!
BMpower = bodoh sombong.
You all want to loose Proton huh?..imagine when Malaysia has no more national company..you got it?..so..think again guys..our car maker just want to sell their car not 100% depends on customer demand and they want Malaysian got their own transportation..easy to go anywhere..just that..Proton want anyone to buy their share but in the same time don't want to loose the company..business matter..
Malaysia sold the most passenger cars in ASEAN that is why VW wants to assemble their cars here and probably export them to other ASEAN countries. The French are doing it with NAZA.
Automotive Jury: After 20+ years of lousy management, i think the company does not deserved any public money or tax payers money. It is just bad business, bad management. Why Proton sold most cars? It's all due to the close policy for the past 20 years. But the result and when time finally comes, produce lousy auto-product supplier (due to cronies, yet no competitive creates no quality to compete), and end of the day, lousy quality of cars, and non-innovative of car.
…maybe when/if this goes through, we will get a new P1 with old VW technology? Hey, it happended before!! ;-)
do the people who can afford a golf gti really want it ckdised? it might pull down the value of their gti's drastically
Imagine buying Proton VW….then door handle PATAH…..then most PU parts also PATAH….typical Proton cronies making tons of money….
Totally sympathise with you Elvis , my daughter's Gen2 H seat plastic recliner lever also patah and the dealer workshop said No Stock also the alternator just conveniently went kaput on expiry after 24 months .
I have never have to replace an alternator in my 30years of driving using other makes .
My sympathy goes to you too…many Gen2 owners experience the same thing. If i were you..better stand by few door handlers too, i guarantee will PATAH soon. Thanks goodness i sold mine…..
P1 is destined to doom, put anybody laaa, as advisor ka, as CEO ka, as Chairman ka……all Kayu…….U know Y…??? All of them are just jaguh kampung who knows nothing about cars, who have no passion about cars, only some guy assembling bus ( wink2 ), and some guy assembling imported parts from Daihatsu and named it P2…….no brainer dude…….
Dont expect too much on the awaited Waja Replacement Model…….it might break your heart………kah kah kah……..cars no soul = P1 , soul no cars = P2
All you P1 bashers must be expert in car-making and managing car business .. salute to you all … or talk only?
proton cannot pakai one lah…..
Proton Scirocco TDI 2.0 ?
Dream on….the Germs would like to hear more on VW Satria GTI.
haiya..just le VW take over proton la..pls la…haiya…
I don't understand the postings here. VW is in talks with Proton about contract car assembling. There are neither in talks with Proton or the gouvernment about buying a Proton share, nor will VW accept suppliers pre-selected by Proton or anybody else.
VW pays for assembling, Proton does the work, that's it.
Why they choose Proton ? Who else should they choose in ASEAN ? Toyota ? Honda ?
it is indeed true that malaysia going to give up its national car. who goin to travel by car in 2020 anyway?
the new gov want to start national aeroplane project and national submarine project. so if u want to buy aeroplan or submarine, better buy now coz after National Fly and Submerge Policy came out, imported plane and sub price will skyrocket as tax will increase 300%.
Given with level of competence of our "skilled" autoworkers, I would be hesitant if I was VW for them to get our people to put together a car.
Doesn't matter who, Proton or otherwise. The problem runs deep. From personal experience, even CKD honda's are known for shoddy assembly work.
Ever wondered why do people pay a premium for even 2nd had recon CBU imports??
Call us bashers but as a human being don't you feel frustrated after being taken for a ride for the past 20 years!!! Are Malaysians inferior citizens of the world that does not deserve a decent + safe car? Yes we are not an expert in car manufacturing & making business that does not mean that we can't voice our grievance. After all we are still proton's customer at the end of the day. We have the right to bash a company for providing us with piece of shit for the past 2 decades. I am sure me and most of the forumers here believe that Malaysians as a whole are as capable as any other race in the world in excelling in any goals we put our mind to it. Look at the Koreans 20 years ago…look at them now. If they can do it why can't we ? Cronyism & Corruption has to be factored out in Proton's case for it to develop itself.
Yeah! It is the time for Volkswagen to give the Japanese some hits… Volkswagen seems to be doing a lot of thing for their world number one… All the best Volkswagen…
Gentleman,
Being an owner of many proton models before from the days of Saga (1980's) until now, Proton Persona and Gen.2 CPS, I have one thing to say, Proton can DREAM ON! (Mimpi basah lah Proton!) I don't know why I kept on doing the same mistake over and over again? Buying Proton cars. After this, no more Proton. That's final! (Yeah right).
For as long Proton couldn't resolve a simple quality issue such as window regulator (yes, the mechanism that seems to fail instantaneously after each successful Proton car purchase), central locking which is not central, engine, suspension and transmission failure even before mileage even touches 10,000 km. Not to mention, Proton vendors who never upgrade their product quality since Proton was launched in the 1980's. My only verdict for Proton; your days are numbered.
To imagine, Proton associating itself with big names like Volkswagen? You gotta be kidding me. Even the Japs (Mitsubishi) knows Proton very well. Well, what to do, Lotus at least helped to clear the name of Proton a bit, but your quality still remains sucks, big time!
I don't mind spending 1 million ringgit on my 'kapchai' rather than 1 ringgit on your defective car!
Bro…..you have the rite to air your greivence. But some nutcase will bash you saying their Proton never have problem…maybe you are unlucky coz your Proton give so much problem etc. Well, i hope those of you who encounter similar situation to give comment also. Dont keep quiet about it…..if your Perodua also give problem…give some comments also. I dont understand those who DEFEND Proton so much. Last time when malaysian selling own brand of electrical products(MEC, remember?)…not long after close shop coz no quality. Did it affect electrical products here in Malaysia? No, rite? Same with cars too….if Proton close shop…many foreign brand will come at similar price. Dont get me wrong…i hope Proton will improve and start cleaning out cronyism from its system. We want the best from Proton…DONT SHUT YOUR EYES TO THE REST OF US PROTON! HEAR YOUR LOYAL SUPPORTERS OR PERHAPS YOUR EX-SUPPORTERS!
Proton always suck lah…even they join with VW sure they sale car expensive for rakyat malaysia..Profit first..suck until dry rakyat money…So rakyat malaysia will dream for another 50 year to drive better car…hahahaha
Haiz…the more we talk here, the more anger we are.
Hope new NAP will not favor to P1 anymore!
hai yah… talk lah. Talk until the cows come home. Unless I see some concrete agreement signed and the thing really get moving, it'll just only be talking.
:(
did i read wrongly or u guys got it wrong? it says volkswagen is looking for a hub in malaysia to assemble cars just like how toyota avanza is being assembled in perodua factory. whats up with the TSI campro and stuffs?
i really do hope instead of proton they choose DRB Hicom. look at avanza being assemble by perodua….couldnt imagine how would the end product of a continental car be coming from proton assembled by cronies partners.
we end consumers it doesnt matter where the money goes, the way i see it, how much profits proton actually made by ripping of malaysian for over 20yrs, yet malaysia car industry is still as fk up using overpriced 3rd world tech whereas those cronies have their overflowing money in oversea bank. whats the diff? i rather pay volkswagen for their quality and reputable products.
Finally! Commentators will WIDE EYES OPEN!! Finally realizing the truth!! Those nutcases hardcore about Proton, i hope your guys keep buying with your brain permanently shut down…
Koreans needed almost 40 years to develop their own engine, Proton only needed 19 years. Well done proton. Actually other makes have defects too. My niece and colleague bought one other make and both had to change their gear box just after one month. My office have two Jeeps from one make and both have many defects from the first month. My office have two Proton Wiras, no defects at all, even after 5 years.
DEAR PROTON MANAGEMENT,
HOW TO PRODUCE GOOD QUALITY CARS IN THE FUTURE IF MOST OF YOUR EXPERIENCED ENGINEERS ARE PLANNING TO LEAVE THEIR BELOVED COMPANY ASAP, CANNOT TAHAN ANYMORE…LOW INCREMENT….LOW BONUS…EVEN AFTER DECLARE PROFIT STILL NO RAYA BONUS….PITY LOR
wake up..just dream at all
i pity u loyal proton staff..
Man said,
September 14, 2009 @ 10:52 pm
Koreans needed almost 40 years to develop their own engine, Proton only needed 19 years. Well done proton. Actually other makes have defects too. My niece and colleague bought one other make and both had to change their gear box just after one month. My office have two Jeeps from one make and both have many defects from the first month. My office have two Proton Wiras, no defects at all, even after 5 years.
—————————————————————-
unbelievable! Are you Proton's management people? We are not 3 yr old kids!
i.m afraid all you guys just simply throw your own words before taking a deep research on what happened today…
just bear in your mind,the G will not support any action that will loose its related company.
think twice before commenting.save your words for our Malaysia success.
dont blame without brain
The rule of "Demand and Supply" of the world market will very soon catch up with Proton and the rest of the non-performing GLC or Government backup companies. These companies either perform or gulung tikar.
Its really weird (pelik bin ajaib), other private companies are doing much better even without government support and some more "kena cekik" darah lagi. Sebab itulah Tuhan bagi "orang-orang" nih, rezeki berkat walaupun kena tindas, meanwhile Proton sells plummeting, haunted by terrible complaints and bleak future. Bulan puasa ni, baik ambik ikhtibar.
Dear "Man said September 14, 2009 @ 10:52 pm" shall we wait for another 40 years for Proton to carry on with its 5S policy?
1) Songlap duit rakyat
2) Skim cepat kaya
3) Senang buat duit
4) Senyap buat tak tahu kalau customer complaint
and my favorite…
5) Suka hati akulah, aku Proton, orang kuat G!
Lu pikirlah sendiri!
Sincerely from the owner of Proton Persona and Gen.2 CPS (with quality issue). Anybody wants to buy my car? I'm selling it cheap, negotiable.
I think Proton should do more with Japanese car makers instead of European. Perhaps their should look again,Mitsubishi or Honda and Toyota. Even Perodua doing better than Proton?? Look at Proton Tiara? worse car ever.. a citreon copy?
pardon my ignorance, what can we research about? its obviously is all about closed door corruptions. and even if we did hav the supported evidents thru 'reserach', heck, they might throw you, me or any person out of the window of MCAA.
so why is proton still in talk with vw? what are they afraid to lose? are they afraid of losing profits or sharing profits with vw as they will not be the only one monopolies in car industry? obviously less ppl will buy proton means no more 100% profits. if says so G has no interference or involvement, we shall see how much changes does the NAP is going to take place, we shall see…
all these duty tax, import tax, wutever tax of 300% they have on cars, to feed on their greeds, thus allowing proton to make fk up cars for us rakyat. so somebody pls tell me G has no involvement with proton or perodua for that matters.
Don't waste time lah Proton.. did not even learn anything from the patnership with Mitshubishi and obviously a waste of tax payers' money. Stop the pride thingy, make good use of rakyat's money on health, education and public transport. The last thing Malaysia need is some junk national car project. Geez…
Sell your proton, buy a Kia. I'm serious, that's how bad these "Malaysian" cars are. We are a rich nation, why do we have to drive such lousy cars. Poor nations like Vietnam and the Africans like those Tanzanians actually drive better cars than us. IF the government abolish those ridiculous import duties, we will be able to buy better cars and it helps to beautify this country, giving foreign investors more confidence in our country and helping boost the economy. Proton, sell yourselves to Volkswagen which I believe given another 10 years will be able to narrow the market share gap between it and Toyota. Skoda and SEAT…look at them now…..
I bought a Persona High Line in February this year. Lets me tell you what is the problems so far.
1) When driving theres a squeaking sound coming from the back.
2)One of the fog light is not functioning after 3 months of using.
3)The radio button on the steering wheel is malfunction, instead of skipping music it goes to MUTE.
4)Those button on the driver side which control the all windows lock,it use to have light now just gone and central looking button same thing.
5)The passenger seat at the back keep fold by it self forward,it seem i cant push it to lock it straight.,, it wont bite.
6) The doors rubber panels ,attach to the A pillar turns white,that rubber is originally black.
I belief that all…if get all the problems that i can think rite now..maybe theres is more.. god forbid.
Who in Malaysia can produce bolt and nut?
Talking about P1 n this all nego, maybe its true or maybe not.. If its true, maybe its just another "talk".. Its not that simple for VW to let their tech being transferred easily especially to the "assembler" (fro this case is P1)..
And for the local vendors to supply parts to VW, its also not that easy as VW also hv their own high expectation & tech/quality requirement that local vendors/suppliers might not be even par to the level..
So its just another rumors tat may gv us another HOPE and let us just keep on HOPING & DREAMING… zzzzzz…..
Close down Proton. And that day is our second National Day. Merdeka dari Proton, penjajah dompet rakyat Malaysia.
dsm said,
September 15, 2009 @ 12:14 am
I think Proton should do more with Japanese car makers instead of European. Perhaps their should look again,Mitsubishi or Honda and Toyota. Even Perodua doing better than Proton?? Look at Proton Tiara? worse car ever.. a citreon copy?
—————————————————————–
yo,
i suggest you learn to google up more before posting offensive comments as you don't even know how on earth proton tiara existed. yes, i did take offence at your posting.
it's actually rebadged from citroen ax. citroen ax/tiara are still in use in europe.
so therefore, NO. proton tiara is NOT the worst car from proton.
i'd say, it's THE BEST CAR MANUFACTURED/REBADGED car by proton, followed by the first generation SAGA, which was rebadged from Mitsubishi Lancer Fiore.
want to know why perodua cars are good? it's because all models are rebadged Daihatsus.
proton should be an assembler like naza and NOT a manufacturer. only then we can have a peace of mind and a good car.
if you dont like proton car just dont buy it don't talk too much!
proton will know whats to do….
why buy proton and keep complain and keep on buying the brand you complain????
The Penjajah is the non Proton makes. They take their profit and our money out of the country. Thus the country may be in a deficit, that was what happen before 1997.
Sick and tired of people saying Bolehland having the most expensive car prices in the world. So what if 10,000 people lose their jobs, find another job la. All we want is a level playing field. That's the bottom line. P1 and P2 supporters could never present a proper argument when it comes to 'a level playing field'. nuff said.
Zool said,
September 15, 2009 @ 9:22 am
The Penjajah is the non Proton makes. They take their profit and our money out of the country. Thus the country may be in a deficit, that was what happen before 1997.
We sell our Proton and Perodua cars to so many countries, are we causing those countries' deficit? Did you sahur?
Eleh, easier said than done. What if you yourself lose your job and no other co employs transmission engineer? P2 Employs transmission engineer? DRB Honda/UMW Toyota employ transmission engineer? How about body design? or CAE analysis? Packaging study analysis? Clay modeller? Where to go? Sell shares? Doing plantation planning? Kena kepala sendiri tau la, Takkan Malaysia nak penuh dengan banker and salesman saja? Talking about your own pockets only.
You can curse or whatever but the co is here. If it still in planning stage we can shelve it but now it has grow to10,000 staff with 100,000 industry wide. We can kill them, but what are the substitute? Toyota Plant? Honda Plant? never in your life time unless RM1 = 0.125 USD. 1 man hr in Indonesia cost 8000 to 9000 IDR (Rp) = Rm 3 (minimal wages RM 480/month). You want this salary ka (auto is very labour intensive)? And you want your car to be tax free too? And we want best public transport as well? And free medical benefit (like in the STATES?) And we dont pay income tax like UK footballer (50%)? Dream on.
Thailand manufactures Toyotas which are then shipped to Malaysia. YET, the prices of their cars are more expensive than Langkawi which is non-tax. Any reason why after adding logistics costs, insurance costs, and whatever other costs plus the commission to sell Toyota is paid in RM instead of Baht…. and yet the price of Toyota in Thailand is MORE EXPENSIVE than langkawi? Please wake up…. without Proton Persona, Toyota would NEVER launch J – Series. Without Proton EXORA, Toyota would never give an extreme deal for Avanza and Innova. Without Proton, any foreign car manufacturer will increase their prices. They would not increase a lot but slowly over the years…. that is why in UK, it is cheaper to fly to Germany, buy a car, do all the logistics, transport back to UK than to buy a car in UK. There are NO national cars in UK. Please look at the big picture. Proton for past 3 years has improved a lot from the previous Proton under the ex-CEO. if you cannot even see this, go ahead and buy a foreign car. All the best with your so called great TOYOTA VIOS…. The car that NEVER breaks down…. great, simply great….. Level playing field? Unless we are able to think objectively, there is NO level playing field. to you, irregardless of how much proton persona has improved over wira and new MPV and new SAGA leagues ahead of the old saga, you still want to buy a foreign car. Is this called LEVEL playing field??? Please…. go test drive a VIOS, rev the engine. need not 110. Just go up to 80km / hour, listen to the noise. then go drive a Persona, do the same thing….. After that, take corners with both cars. tell me you are not scared with VIOS compared to Persona. Go over bumps with both cars. if you tell me VIOS is better, I really have nothing else to say….. all the best to you then in terms of 'level playing field' and 'objectivity'.
Malaysian:
Any reason why after adding logistics costs, insurance costs, and whatever other costs plus the commission to sell Toyota is paid in RM instead of Baht…. and yet the price of Toyota in Thailand is MORE EXPENSIVE than langkawi? Please wake up…. without Proton Persona, Toyota would NEVER launch J – Series. Without Proton EXORA, Toyota would never give an extreme deal for Avanza and Innova. Without Proton, any foreign car manufacturer will increase their prices.
Equally there are many reasons why Proton sales in Thailand in such a pittance compared to say, Toyota?
Malaysian:
Please…. go test drive a VIOS, rev the engine. need not 110. Just go up to 80km / hour, listen to the noise. then go drive a Persona, do the same thing….. After that, take corners with both cars. tell me you are not scared with VIOS compared to Persona. Go over bumps with both cars. if you tell me VIOS is better, I really have nothing else to say….. all the best to you then in terms of ‘level playing field’ and ‘objectivity’.
Why not compare Corrolla Altis with Persona or compare Vios with Saga? Talk about ‘level playing field’ and ‘objectivity’ huh?
Malaysian:
There are NO national cars in UK.
Sounds like the case of Rover? But then the UK govt refuse the public funds wastage in bail-out Rover so let the market decide the fate, unlike here where failure at any cost must be footed by public money to the point that even if you fail you still being rewarded. Open competition meanwhile is nothing but punished.
That's BolehLand: Failure, mediocrity is rewarded. But competence, quality is punished.
@dont complain – Yes I despise Proton, and I don't own a Proton. However, just like how Proton is free to rip off the Rakyats..we are free to comment on them.. if Proton is really that good, prove it in the International market; and stop ripping off the rakyats with inferior product. And tell me why the public transport is so bad? It's because they need to make it bad so that the rakyat will be forced to get an afforadable car. An affordable car = Proton in Malaysian context, with all other imports being inflated in prices. Proton = afforadable = inferior piece of junk. Hello, 3 decades already; if they're serious about making Malaysia a more livable place, fix the damn public transport system. I'd be more than willing to take the LRT/MRT, bus or whatever. Peace.
Bro Braca…have you ever own Proton Tiara? You want to buy? Plenty of Proton Tiara laying around…you can even buy at one thousand ringgit. I can let you borrow one and see want you reaction. First problem…engine overheating after first 100km, second problem…can start…cant start…can start..put second gear…..dead…again….Hey, you can even send it to the best mechanic you can find…same thing….the most problematic car ever….
Good for Proton and us too.
Malaysian
No use you waste your time defending Proton.
After spending so much on the so called R&D
and asking for incentive and tax rebates at the end of the day
all they can come up are crappy cars.
A "level playing field" is a concept about fairness, not that each player has an equal chance to succeed, but that they all play by the same set of rules. A metaphorical playing field is said to be level if no external interference such as "government regulations" affects the ability of the players to compete fairly.
Scottloeb,
How many so called specialised jobs are there ?
It's just a handful of them. Why pity them. Proton is a
public listed company and not a govt or charitable co which gives handouts.
If they are not performing then they have to be shipped out!
It doesn't mean that 10000 jobs will be lost overnight.
Proton may hv2 restructure or change their business module and be an assembler instead of a manufacturer/producer.
This is a business and the evolving enviroment warrants it.
This is called moving forward and not just sitting pretty.
While all the hoo haa going on, i'm sitting on a pile of Jetson shares.
(3 series already in pocket ,now waiting for my 5 series !!!)
Naza will be taking over Proton and soon we will see more rebadged cars
on our roads!!! Go Naza go!!!
barca:
"..i’d say, it’s THE BEST CAR MANUFACTURED/REBADGED car by proton.."
wow! are you drunk? ive seen 2 Tiara's burst in flame in front of me. I think you can also search around the net, about the tiara bursting into flames (due to various cases of fuel hose cracks/leaks). Have you seen any other proton cars burst into flames? Not to mention the impossible to find 3-nut rims :). Heck you can buy a Tiara for RM500! is that the reason you say its the BEST proton car?
For you sir, rather that buying a persona for 50K, youre better off buying 100 Tiara's. at least if your Tiara catches fire and/or breaks down, you have a damn load of spares at your disposal.
what the hell everybody keep saying proton curik duit rakayt??….kalau nk kereta besar2 berkualiti kerja la kuat beli keta besar2…jgnla takat gaji 2 3k tapi berangan nk naik merc or bimmer……kalau diri sendiri tak mampu jgn nk salahkan PROTON…..sebab org mcm korangla sampai bila2 malaysian automotive industry tak maju…!!!!
Proton has entered Thailand only for 1 year. :) Let's see after 3 years, ok?
Persona is a Segment B car, same as VIOS; albeit a higher end Segment B whereas Saga is basic Segment B. Waja is a segment C car, just like Altis. Waja is a 9 year old model, so if compared to Altis, would lose totally. Wait till they launch new Waja in 2010, then we compare with Altis, ok? As for Altis….. go and compare the previous generation and current generation…. sigh…. they used back whatever which can be used including the engine! Yet, because it is Toyota, everyone said, WOW…. NEW…. sigh…
Rover failed after it was sold off. You still did not answer me though. Why…. even with FREE competition in UK, the prices of cars in UK are still more expensive than other countries like Germany and USA? Hope to have your OBJECTIVE answer. :P
Have a nice day. Sorry, my favourite brand has been and will be Nissan. Both my wife and I do not own a Proton as at today. Later, not sure. However, I want Proton to succeed too.
Oh yeah, before I forget, UK bailed out all THOSE BANKS which caused the financial crisis… Hmm….. why not they let the banks fail or better still, let Public Bank or Maybank to buy them?? USA did the same thing. saving all their banks and all the car brands which went bancrupt, GM, Chrysler, FORD. Germany also did the same thing. Let market decide? UK, USA? Please…. stop joking. Free Market is a talk which the Developed economies preach so that they can buy up cheap companies from developing companies. As for subsidy, go and read about the UK, USA, how much subsidy they give to their plantation industry. Please wake up…… At one point, GM's share price was so low, they only need to ask for bidders, Khazanah could have bought it…..
GP:And tell me why the public transport is so bad? It’s because they need to make it bad so that the rakyat will be forced to get an afforadable car. An affordable car = Proton in Malaysian context, with all other imports being inflated in prices. Proton = afforadable = inferior piece of junk. Hello, 3 decades already; if they’re serious about making Malaysia a more livable place, fix the damn public transport system. I’d be more than willing to take the LRT/MRT, bus or whatever. Peace.
Read more: http://paultan.org/2009/09/14/volkswagen-ckd-deal…
thats is GOV issue, use the vote thats in your hand.
Hey Malaysian(1),MG Rover was a gonner cos Rover cars
did not appeal to the public in general. Whatever they produced
did not go down well. Their JV with a Chinese partner Phoenix as opposed to Alchemy/BMW also contributed to their downfall. The Phoenix group promised no retrenchment as opposed to Alchemy who wanted to close several plants .Price of their cars was not the issue there.
Doesn't this sound familiar here. So Proton,
Pls consider this as a blessing,sieze this opportunity
and make sure the proposed JV goes through.
The people in UK hv the choice on what they want.
Not in Msia where the public do not have such priviledges.
You cannot compare banks to the motor industry.
If banks went under, PB CIMB or Maybank would have collapsed too
-it had a wider global implication. And Msia is not a shielded economy.
The motor industry needs JV's and alliance and Proton will have to
change to progress!!
Elvis said,
September 15, 2009 @ 11:05 am
Bro Braca…have you ever own Proton Tiara? You want to buy? Plenty of Proton Tiara laying around…you can even buy at one thousand ringgit. I can let you borrow one and see want you reaction. First problem…engine overheating after first 100km, second problem…can start…cant start…can start..put second gear…..dead…again….Hey, you can even send it to the best mechanic you can find…same thing….the most problematic car ever…
——————————-
bro elvis,
yes, i currently own a 2nd hand year 97 proton tiara. despite initial problems after buying it, no question about it, i love the car.
if i have duit banyak, i will buy another for spare part or customized use.
tiaras which have overheating issues happen because:
1. owners expect a japanese-like car experience. this is a continental car and such, requires a different sense of ownership.
2. the car was not maintained properly or according to servicing schedule.
3. manufacturing/assembly fault.
4. no love for the car.
tiara owners who love their car know where to find the right mechanic to send for servicing.
the question now is, do YOU own a proton tiara?
proton has lotus, thus better handling, duh! screw that! we want good quality cars man. not a car with so many defects that need frequent SC visits, not a car with 3rd world tech, crappy interiors…etc.
why want to compare vois in malaysia? want not compare vios in japan for an example, you notice the huge different in specs and major equipments. and why is that? its because of the blardy tax that they have to cut cost and strip down those goodies, duh!
and why only compare to toyota engine? why not honda's engine or maybe volkswagen engine?
with proton, foreign car manufacturers still selling their cars 3 times more expensive, i dont really get your point, Malaysian.
dont understand why you compared bank industries with cars industries. subsidies in plantation against subsidies in our petrol subsidies with corruptions.
Bro Barca…no i dont own Tiara…probably wont too. Before my Iswara, a friend lend it to me, he want too sell cheap to me. Aiyoo, this overheating crap really annoying somemore the audio system the cheapest and at that time Kancil was much more reliable. I think you will have field day collecting Tiara bro…SO MANY FOR SELL AT CHEAP PRICE…Make sure you keep extra wheel also. Those 3 nuts wheels…aiyah…cannot find in shop one…Maybe you can start Tiara club…but the membership……hhhhmmmm…..how many will have fond memories of Tiara i wonder?
dont complain: Yes I agree that's a different issue all together, but can't u see this is a big conspiracy? No point having Proton that serves nothing to the Rakyat (except for some cronies).. Bottom line, Proton should just cease existence.
ignas, you too have yet to answer my question. why… is the price of VIOS in Thailand MORE EXPENSIVE than Langkawi after adding all the extra costs to ship them to Langkawi from Thailand?
Secondly, USA saved ALL their CAR COMPANIES. GM, FORD AND CHRYSLER. Not just their banks, ok?
I compare to Toyota because they sell the most cars after national cars…. Honda? Haha… oh you must mean their I-DSI engine. A SINGLE CAM engine. That's a GREAT engine!!!! :P
Good quality cars. I have one colleague, my sister and my wife's colleague having a SAGA. all three has passed one year without any issues.
I have 3 friends. One is a sales. One is a customer service. Another is an Engineer. all three, their VIOS are riddled with issues. 1) Sound from the engine. Eee……. managed to solve only after 3 visits. Now, sound is coming out from back of the car. 2) The two pillars in the interior of the car, suddenly drop off!!! Imagine the surprice because ALL three has bought their cars less than 6 months.
In terms of quality, it depends on current situation. kindly stop referring to the previous wira and saga. we already know that… yes, add gen-2 too!
3rd World Tech?? Have you even driven a 1.6 CPS before? 3rd world Tech? You are a very funny person Ignas. Very funny indeed. Crappy interiors? Yeah sure…. this so called CRAPPY interior for VIOS is the SAME one that Thailand has!!! Eventhough Thai people are paying HIGHER prices, without govt tax, they are still having your so called 'CRAPPY' interior! Have you even compared the latest interior of Waja CPS / Persona with that of VIOS? If after comparing, you still think WAJA CPS and Persona is crappy, then I know why already……. you are 'hahahahaha'. guy.
The last thing….. if the rumour is true and a Japanese top car manufacturer rebadges or takes Proton's latest MPV as their own, then I bet you would also ban that Japanese company too….. Great. full of crap.
Can't we at least give Proton a chance? Give the new CEO a chance? Give the hard working engineers who came up with new SAGA and EXORA a chance? Why are we critical only to Proton and close eyes to others?
I hate subsidies. To me, if possible, take out the petrol subsidies. We are not competitive!!!
FYI there is nothing wrong or outdated with having a single cam engine.
bro ignas,
no vios in japan…u mean belta. You should test drive vios. Their instrument inside is good and also their transmission but their suspension is very stiff. Waja suspension is better. Dunno why they like vios. Latio is better even though have torsion beam. Hmm…vios is over-priced car.
Ok..if today Proton or Perodua do not exist, can we Malaysians buy cheaper cars? I think the answer is no..
but we Malaysians have the right to demand local manufacturers to standardize all the safety features for all models..no more b, m, h line..
just difference in engine segment and transmission(manual vs auto) that's it..
all must have abs, dual airbags…because the foreigners are getting the better spec than us and their average GDP is much higher than us Malaysia who spend a large portion of our salaries on paying car loans.
I think the ministry of transport should do something about this, standardized the safety features and prohibit any new cars that do not have fully equipped features on the road. This MAY reduce fatalities on the road and according to my opinion is way much efficient than what operasi-operasi during the festive seasons.
Just my 2 cents
Taikoh,
Talk about level playing field to US now. Ask them to remove tyre import tax and ask China to remove chicken/poultry tax as well. Dont forget the US agricultural subsidies. Doha rounds, remember?
Regarding specialised jobs, If Proton being sold to VW or opel or whatever car co instead of closing them down (to serve malaysian short sightedness) the engineer can continue contribute to the development and public (and private) universities can make full use of the technology as well instead forcing the technical experts to practise/venture in non-value add. Like most student nowadays knows, to work in animation/rocket science/game design/AI/Fashion designer and such niche job you have to move to Japan/Europe/States. With Proton at least there are opportunity to retain such expertise and create more CATIA expert, even among suppliers. Maybe its not that much valuable for the public but for auto industry engineers, these jobs are like dream come true and and more technological breakthrough can be created. Are we going to be the end user till kingdom come? I'm pretty sure VW or any car company is delighted to utilise the expert at a very reasonable rates due to Malaysia's reasonable payrate compared to Japan/Korea/EU. One of the reason why GM rely heavily on its Daewoo counterpart is due to the low development cost compared to their US/EU. Noted that looking at proton now the development is not at the desired pace, but should funding be made available (through very good parts bin and expert mentor) I'm pretty sure it can be achieved.
Talk is just talk eh… so why not just eat your words and travel to countries with 'level-playing field'. How about Indonesia for a start? Surely the Indons 'welcome' us very warmly, so much that they'd 'sweep' for Msians on the street of Jakarta to give us a proper 'welcome'.
But it's ok, cheap toyota is more important than ur personal safety, right? So go ahead then, be proud that you can finally own a cheap toyota, bought in a 'level-playing field' country. That sounds much better than remaining here, since this country only makes you unhappy…
So, what do you have to offer as a counter argument? Do you really know the price to pay for a 'level-playing field'?
lavenderguy, i agree wholeheartedly with every word that you said.
scottloeb, i agree wholeheartedly with you too. It has always been the goal of developed nations to tell people, free economy, level playing field etc but till today, none of them practises that and continued to force developing nations to open this, open that….. sigh…. proton need not close down, they can be merged with a global giant.
tokmoh!! Haha…. thanks. agree with you too. there's so many countries which can make people happy. your last question really strikes the bull's eye. 'price to pay for level playing field'. till today, there is NO level playing field anywhere in the world and all these people who wants to buy a Japanese made car wants Malaysia to lead the way and be the 1st in the world to have level playing field…. get real…..
All forumers, pls read the news about P1 1,2,3 years ago…..semua topik sama saja, mau enter China with 150k volume, want to penetrate Iran market with 200k volume of Persona, konon nak develop Middle East market MENA jadi hub for Proton…..Pooodahhhhh, dah 3 tahun clock ticking, HAMPEHHHH pun tarak, as of now sales in China only 2000 unit.
Mgmt P1 bagi janji2 kosong to Press so that share price naik. In this case (JV with VW) look what happen to the share price increase from RM 3++ to RM 5++………somebody got a huge duit raya out of this.
thanks for the heads up, opaque. ya agree with you vios is indeed overpriced, its getting expensive with cheap cosmetic upgrades.
Malaysian, one thing i notice when you do comparison, u like to take those high end proton cars (CPS) for praising, but when comes to bashing, u will take the worst car – vois. for your info, vios is an entry car just like saga, and saga's interior is crap. so why are you comparing cars in different segments? or are you confuse because of the pricing that you thought they were the same?
for your info, all toyota cars are imported from thailand. langkawi is 100% duty and 100% taxed free, i dont understand why you compared it with thailand, their government didnt tax the car, but it doesnt means the dealer cannot make decent money, else what do they eat?
since u like CPS so much, go compare the CPS selling in malaysia and CPS selling in UK or maybe even australia, tell me the ones we're getting here whether its 1st class or 3rd class. its not even on par with the price with the equipments/standard/quality we're getting, hence 3rd word tech is the affordability of the majority of us are getting, do u understand?
try go check the price of the cars before and after proton is established. oh, if im not mistaken, you're not even born yet, pardon my ignorant.
here you are thinking of giving chances, while those CEO or wutever the top players happily enjoy the rippings, naive arent you? what to do, spoon fed since young, still believing in giving chances. thats why ppl like you allow proton continue to do the ripping. try open the market up and see how they survive. chance will be given if they prove themselves in the competitive market, period.
Whoa, the giants have woken up. On both sides too. Car prices in the Gulf States….check it out. Won't you agree that Southeast Asia, except Singapore, is below us? Compare ourselves with other booming economies la, can't think of a decent country now. We have higher GDP than these SEA countries, but look at the way we live, our motoring culture is pathetic due to high prices. Motorsports? Forget about it. We can't even run a decent backyard race team due to these extreme prices. VW is here to help, so let them help us.
Don't compare cars that is specifically designed for low class regions such as Southeast Asia's City and Vios, compare the tech with a regular car, such as a French or a German small sedan. And which part of the 'highest car prices in the world' except local manufacturer, is wrong?
Do really know what Malaysian vehicle prices would be if protectionism does not exist – don't say it doesn't exist.
After 20 long years – if it were a human, we'd say 'all grown up' – can we proudly say we won engine of the year? or chasis of the year? Proton ain't world class and won't be for a very long time. You're on the inside, you know why. Just my two damn cents, and the good thing is, I have a right to say it too.
Some of the comments here are very good. Spirit of discuss is healthy…kadoos guys…
Malaysian,
Exactly, these bashers are too blind to see the irony of other countries. They reckon that those countries are very efficient, 100% transparent, 100% accountability, adapt a 'no fear or favor' approach when it comes to axing non-performers, no cronyism, 100% meritocracy, 'level-playing field', anti-protectionist, blablablabla… basically, they reckon all other countries except Msia are much, muuuuuch better run, which results their economy so excellent, cars became very cheap n every citizen can afford a dream car.
Taik hanjing diorg la. Bail out bank tu apa (dah la dapat berbilion duit rakyat, pastu guna duit tu bagi bonus berjuta kat manager2 diorg)? Bail out gm, chrysler tu apa? 2 juta org hilang kerja dah tu apa? UK yg xde kereta nasional tapi harga keter masih mahal kalo compared ngn negara europe lain tu apa? Pastu kalo betul la ada negara yang efisien macam Singapore la katakan, apa pasal benci pula, panggil diorg kiasu la, kiasi la, lansi la, blablabla.
I think feeling miserable is their way of enjoying life. Nvm, their freedom to choose. So be it.
I, like you, decide to just enjoy life in a more joyful way.
Cheers bro!!
haha…. have a great dinner to you too tokmoh. enjoy your dinner to celebrate Malaysia as the ONLY country in the world which is not subscribing to no subsidy and no protectionism. (according to them lar…..) :)
proton again. malaysia boleh, we must have our national car, ini maruah kita!!!
semua orang asing kerja sini, semua barang asing guna kat sini, tapi, kereta mesti proton!!!!! ini maruah kita!!!! siapa mau beli proton? tu yang tak mampu. malaysia boleh!!!
yea, its correct that foreign country succk big time. So, even if our car price is the most expensive in the world, it doesnt matter. even if every cheap worker here is earning less than RM2000, and the cheaper proton is RM35000, it doesnt matter. In US you can earn the same amount of USD2000(Cheap job), and Honda Accord is USD 20000 only. USD30000=Nissan fairlady.
—————————————————-
so when their banking system fail, we say, Nasib baik Kita Kat Malaysia, tak mati lagi.
WHen they are rich and making big money, we say, Die pa mat salleh, kita orang apa? right??
————————————————
good thinking. Keep on fighting with Cow head and all politic issue, and they even have volunteer fighting for them in this forum, see how lucky our gomen is??
everyone go to Indonesia to make car, go to Thailand to make car. You dont wan other car maker here, do you still wan Intel,Sony,Motorola,Agilent here? if you wan them, why reject VW, Toyota,Honda?? dumbass.
car is important, your car fail, you die. and you can tolerate with bad expensive car policy. very good.
its not proton problem, its the whole system that has problem.
end of the day, we still drive proton,perodua. period.
Excuse me, if Proton is really that good, a national pride and blah blah blah; why are our ministers all fighting for a camry. Why are we not seeing Proton being used by the Royals? Top ministers? Why are the top dogs in the corp world not using Proton? Aduh~~
Yeah cakap macam hebat, tak suka sangat subsidi, bersaing dengan orang luar lah, kalau tak suka sangat apasal subsidi minyak nak pulak, subsidi tol nak pulak, barang kena kontrol harga, peniaga nak naik harga susu kena minta gomen dan lain-lain. Kalau berani, semua open lah, bagi semua yang luar masuk macam singapore tu (tengok bagaimana rakyat dia komplen pasal PRC!!). Kesimpulannya, jangan berlagak hebat sangat, cukai kau tu seciput je, banyak hasil negara datang dari sumber alam lah ngok… jangan bongkak!!!
Because Proton is our rakyat punya car, so it only built the cheap~ one that rakyat can buy. Sorry not for YSB and VVIP.
SO what if many job losses are created when proton is close down. It will only pave the way for more foreign carmakers to come in….more dealerships, service centres, assembly plants will be created, all these require jobs too. To have a Mitsubishi, Citroen and Renault as our national car is pure plagiarism at it's very best. Barisan Nasional Memang Boleh
Some one said to compare cps in Malaysia with Cps overseas. I don't think cps is offered yet anywhere else except Thailand. Maybe Singapore and indonesia are getting cps too.
oh ya, i mistakenly written cps, sorry my bad…
1. perceived built quality & reliability of proton's product should be improved.
2. for those who still have the "i don't believe attitude", pls keep an eye on proton if not both eyes.
3. "making a car" is not as easy as "maintaining a car".
i'm happy to see our intellectual & technical experts are hand in hand to develop proton. i wish i were with them.
somehow, it is getting boring here with all this irrelevant stuff, sorry Paul.
i missed the time when Si-FU, 360 & TheKing giving some enlightening infos regarding proton.
Morgen morgen nur nicht heute, sagen alle faulen Leute.
say no to proton
after so many comments, none has yet to answer my very simple question. if Thailand is such a great car manufacturing company, why are their Toyota priced HIGHER than the toyotas they export out? Their dealer wants to earn commission in Thailand but all other distributors of toyota are volunteers in other countries? Or perhaps Thais are much more wealthier than Malaysians? Don't you understand that if Proton is not allowed to succeed, one day we will be like Thais? Without Perodua rebadging Daihatus, can you buy MyVI which is cheaper than Hong Kong? Producing cars and get to known as Detroit of Asia but they needed to pay MORE for their Toyota than other countries? Car prices will only be cheaper for a while if Proton fails. After 5 years, the prices would have gone up considerably…. there are already lots of examples. OPEN YOUR EYES please……… please…… please…..
I only wonder it seems the G is serving the public? or seems someone is thinking the public should serve the G, and allow the G to spend the tax payer money on their own likes.
Proton never serves the public. The public serves proton for 20 years.
The consumer rights is being take away.
I am wondering if we can launch a dont-buy-new-car campaign for 1 year and let those car sellers serve back the public. But i think its just a dream since peope wont united.
You are right Malaysian. My dad told me that before Proton was born, car dealers were selling old models of Foreign car manufacturers. When Proton was born these cars dealers suddently bought newer models. One car dealer was said to monopolise spare parts making it expensive. Actually there many benefits to car buyers when Proton was born. Also SMEs were born and many now exports car parts all over the world.
Satria Neo needs 1.4 Twin-Charge VW power (170 bhp , +200 Nm torque)
ASP Import in Europe !
how bout the W16 from the veyron chuck it at the back of an exora, rear-wheel drive mpv monster, first in the world, thats something to shout about, The first significant world record to make it into the malaysian book of records.
C'mon la, Honda got their plant in Malacca, Perodua is assembling the toyota avanza, some plastic manufacturer here makes the plastic bits for Mercedes, We got intel & AMD factories, c'mon la, Malaysia CAN make good products.
All asian-badged cars sold in the EUROPE that got good response are assembled sumwhere in EUROPE!. So proton, dont humiliate urselfs if u dunt hav a plant there, u can capture Asean, Indian, Australian markets, but first, gotta win in home grounds… VW..it worked for SKODA, it sure will work for PROTON, bt ppl behind proton dunt want to lose their extra money buy selling us crappy cars… THE FIRST PROTON SAGA was a fighter, still works even today… the wira, waja(worst), i've had in the past were terrible.., at least the wira still got some pvc-ish material on the dashboard… all the latest protons!?!?!??! like my savvy for instance…SEMUA PLASTIK BALDI!!!!!!!!!!!! PLASTIK BALDI!!!!! PLASTIK BALDI KEDAI 2 ringgit, my god.., i wouldnt care if the friggin car came with 5-star EURO NCAP, inipun tidak.., where does the money gone proton!?
BTW… in UK if not many ppl know.., newspaper is like 25 pents, and a coke is like 50 pents or so…, its not exactly 1 pound is 1 ringgit in value, 1 pound there could get u a coke and a newspaper i think (my friend told me), so a 10k pound car is equivalent to a RM40k in relative terms…, it sounds cheap to us but still expensive to them…,its like dis, u need RM6 to get 1 pound, but 1 can of coke there is not 1 pound 50 pents, its prolly less than 1 pound