This is probably the most anticipated car in the history that I have had this blog running, the car that will mark the retirement of the old Proton Saga and mark the beginning of a new saga in the history of Proton. It is what both we and Proton call “the People’s Car”.
It is the car that signifies Proton is going back to the basics and fulfilling its responsibility as the national car manufacturer to actually produce national cars that the majority of the people actually need – a cheap, economical run-about car with a sedan bodystyle.
That car is the new second generation 2008 Proton Saga, known to us for the past few months as the Proton BLM.
As most of you should know by now, the new Proton Saga was engineered from the Proton Savvy’s platform, by a team that was led by Proton engineers together with external consultants, including LG CNS. It was developed in a record period of 17 months from the design freeze stage to the SOP stage. It was designed to be a simple, affordable and practical entry level sedan. You could call it the people’s car if you wish, something the original Volkswagen Beetle was a long time ago.
Proton decided to do away with any attempts at making this car “different”, from the beginning it was decided that its design was to be smart and simple. The front features a hexagonal mesh front grille, swept-back headlamps, and prominent lower air intakes on the bumper, while the rear of the car features wraparound crystal cluster lights and a concave boot lid. From the side you can see prominent wheel arches, which give the car a sportier look.
Thankfully, there are no design quirkiness to be seen, and the car lacks the typical hatch turned sedan awkward look that the Suzuki Swift Sedan and the Nissan Latio have.
For a small sedan like the Saga, what many will be looking at is how much interior space it has. So let’s have a look at how the new Proton fares in that area.
The new Proton Saga is bigger than its predecessor in pretty much every way possible. You’ll probably be able to guess what cars Competitor M and Competitor V are. Numbers are good, but they remain just figures on a piece of paper until you actually try getting into the car.
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Here we have regular PAULTAN.ORG contributor Shannon Teoh in the rear seat of the car. You can see clearly the legroom and headroom available to the rear passenger – surprisingly good! The only concern would be the width of the car, it is narrower but acceptable given that this is a small B-segment sedan.
Either 2 adults or 3 children will sit comfortably in the rear bench, and there are seatbelts for 3 people, so if the government enforces the rear seatbelt rule anytime soon, the Proton Saga will be ready for it.
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Interior conveniences include two cupholders in the front, one cupholder in the rear, an open storage compartment where the passenger airbag would be expected to be, a glove compartment, two rear bottle holders, door pockets on each door, seatback pockets, a 1-DIN storage area below the 1-DIN CD player, and finally a little compartment just below the steering wheel column.
The Proton Saga has a standard car power outlet socket positioned at a 90 degree horizontal angle just below the air conditioning controls. This might cause a problem with some of the longer devices that you might want to insert into the socket, like mobile phone chargers and etc, as it might get into the way of the gear lever. If you have drinks in the front cupholders, these might obstruct the power outlet as well.
The air conditioning controls themselves (click image on the left to enlarge) are very simple and intuitively designed. This is an improvement over the Proton Persona’s air conditioning controls where the temperature dial was somewhat confusing. Previously readers who have seen the dials have said they look like they were recycled from the old Mitsubishi-generation Protons, but these are new stepped dials. I’m not sure what the proper term is, but it means that when you twist the dial, you feel feedback from the dials, they “click” from setting to setting, while the old dials in the Saga/Iswara/Satria/Wira were stepless, you just twisted them around and they don’t give any feedback as to whether you’ve actually achieved anything or not.
The only stepless dial is the one where you control whether the air conditioning system recirculates the air or takes in fresh air from outside. This has been made into a dial instead of a button of sorts because the control actually requires the action of you twisting the knob to close the external air intake vent – basically its a manual system.
The air conditioning vents integrate angle and open/close functions in a single action, much like the ones on the Satria Neo. The dashboard plastics do not fall into the soft touch category, but Proton has added texture so that they do not look or feel cheap, and I appreciate that thought. I do not really have a problem with the plastics. The stepped dials and switches do not have a cheap feel to them, and all of them provide feedback as to whether you’ve actually pressed them, which is an improvement over the Persona’s feedbackless dashboard buttons.
The switches, knobs and dials are all placed in intuitive positions. My only issue with the interior is not something major. It’s just that Proton does not seem to have a standard Human Interface Design template for their interiors. A little button with a dot on it activates the central locking system in the Proton Persona, but the same button in the Saga is used to deactivate the alarm system! The same design, but different meanings in different cars. This will have to change in the next generation of cars.
Audio is provided by a single CD Clarion head unit, and either 2 speakers for the N-Line and B-Line, or 4 speakers for the M-Line. The silver head unit lights up with red backlighting, matching the rest of the car.
I wish Proton has specified to Clarion that the volume knob be on the right side of the head unit instead of on the left, as this is a right hand drive market. If you notice, the Clarion 2-DIN head unit used in the Mitsubishi-generation Protons and the Waja had the volume knob on the right. Nevertheless, the audio output through the speakers was rather decent, but being a 1-DIN unit there will be many who will swap everything out for their own custom ICE setup.
I am not completely sure, but I reckon that if you take out the 1-DIN storage compartment module from below the 1-DIN head unit, you’ll probably be able to install a 2-DIN unit.
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The picture above shows how the front passenger area of the Proton Saga would typically be looking like. The passenger’s legs are in the photo to let you judge the interior width of the car better. The driving position for both the manual and automatic versions were decent without issues.
For the manual version, the clutch pedal was adequately spaced away from the brake and accelerator pedals, unlike some previous Protons. The automatic shifter uses the P-R-N-D-3-2-L shift pattern – no shiftronic-like features here.
The manual shifter is really something I’ve never seen before! The shift lever is so tall and the shift throw is rather long. The high position of the shift knob shortens the distance your hand has to travel from steering wheel to shifter, so many it was intentional. The lever’s free play both in neutral and in gear was also quite noticable, and it all reminded me of a pickup truck’s manual shift lever, although the lever did not vibrate like how a pick up truck’s normally would. Shifts felt rubbery and disconnected, not very fun but nevertheless it gets the job done.
Clutch engagement and disengagement for the manual transmission happens quite far into the clutch release. It should be quite safe if you accidentally shift without pressing the clutch pedal to the very deepest, as somewhere past mid point the clutch would have already fully disengaged.
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On to the new Proton Saga’s best kept secret. The new 1.3 litre Campro IAFM engine. Let’s get to the low down on whats changed since the last iteration of the Campro 1.3 found in the Proton Satria Neo. Firstly, the manual gearbox that comes with this engine is now sourced from Aichi Kikai instead of Mitsubishi, which Proton engineers say allows them greater flexibility in specifying gear ratios, something that Mitsubishi did not provide.
Next, the engine has an Integrated Air Fuel Module which integrates a variable length intake manifold system. I will not go into lengths explaining what a variable length intake manifold system is since I have already done that before (click here to read).
The electrical system has also been updated. Ignition now uses coil-on-plug ignition, which eliminates spark plug cables from the ignition system. This eliminates some power losses caused by spark plug cables. The starter is now of a smaller physical size, but has a bigger capacity. If you listen to how this Campro IAFM 1.3 engine starts compared to the Campro 1.3 in the Satria Neo, you can hear the difference. Think of how the Perdana V6 sounds like when it starts.
The Campro IAFM engine keeps the Campro 1.3’s 94 horsepower at 6,000rpm and 120Nm of torque at 4,000rpm figures, with changes only to the way the power and torque is delivered instead of any change in the peak power and torque. Proton’s dyno tests of the new Campro IAFM engine reveals power ratings of up to 98 horsepower is achievable, but Proton prefers to publish the power figures in brochures at 94 horses for some reason, perhaps for consistency sake as not all engines may be able to achieve the 98 horses figure.
As you can see from the scanned dyno chart comparison above, the original Campro 1.3 was making slightly more than its 120Nm rated torque at peaks, but there are some serious dips in torque in the low to mid rev ranges. The new Campro 1.3 with the IAFM module has a very different torque curve. Its peak torque is lower, but still achieves the 120Nm target. There is also more torque between 2,800rpm and 4,000rpm.
I am happy to report that with my brief Proton Saga review test drive around Cyberjaya there is no annoying torque dip with the new Campro engine now, but nevertheless it still did not feel particularly torquey at low to medium revs. One would expect a VIM system to provide stronger than usual low end torque, but I guess in this case the VIM only manages to fix the Campro’s naturally bad torque curve.
Throttle response still leaves a little to be wanting – the engine is slightly slow to come on and slow to taper off when responding to throttle movements – nothing dangerous but it can be noticed. The laggy throttle response is why you sometimes have a little throttle blip when you shift gears on the Campro, whats happening is the throttle still continues to be open when you’ve lifted your foot off the accelerator pedal and disengaged the clutch, so the result is a little blip.
Proton quotes expected fuel economy for the manual model to be 6 litres per 100km, and 6.3 litres per 100km for the automatic model, at a constant speed of 90km/h.
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Ride and handling is not the typical feel you would expect from a Proton. While the Persona has very decent handling for a 4 door family sedan, the ride comfort for this new second generation Proton Saga is good, but unfortunately the body roll angle is rather significant! However, the roll rate is at an acceptable rate so the roll is not overly uncomfortable during normal driving. Go abit aggressive and the rear passengers can be thrown about. What makes it worse is the lack of any rear assist grips to hold on to, even though it looks like there are mounting points for the grips!
The seats are your average baseline sedan seats – only the Nissan Latio excels in this area with their oversized seats. We did not drive very far so at the moment we can’t really tell if they are comfortable during long journeys or not. The rear bench does not do the whole split-fold-down thing, so this will be a concern for those who want to carry long things often, that require the sedan’s boot length to be extended to within the cabin.
The rear windows do not go down fully. I discovered this when I got into the back seat of the Saga so I could stick my head and camera out and take moving shots of the car while we were on our test laps around Putrajaya. The window only came down about two thirds of the way – there was no way I could stuff my head out that.
The new Proton Saga uses a MacPherson strut suspension at the front, and a torsion beam suspension at the rear. These suspension bits were based off the Savvy but tweaked to suit the new car. The front has a lower spring rate, while the rear has a higher spring rate to compensate for the heavier boot. There is a front stabilier bar directly connected to the damper body instead of the lower control arm.
Tyres are 13 inch steel wheels wrapped with 175/70R13 tyres for the N-Line and B-Line models, and 14 inch alloys wrapped with 185/60R14 tyres for the M-Line model. Brakes are 13 inch ventilated discs at the front, and 7 inch drums at the rear. The M-Line has a single driver’s airbag, but none of the line-up has ABS brakes. The boot is a decent 413 litres and comes with a full sized steel spare tyre.
Fitting its purpose as a family car, the new Saga comes with child lock functions for the rear doors. All models also have central locking, but the N-Line does not have an alarm or remote activation of the central locking.
Click to enlarge and view specifications list for each model
I think the new Proton Saga is a great little family car, with an amazingly adequate interior space that can fit 4 people comfortably, or 5 people if you must. There are a little issues here and there that make me unhappy, for example the central locking knobs are very hard knobs with a small diameter. The small diameter hurts your finger when you press it down to lock the door.
But I can live with all of this, and most people would not even notice the small little details I’ve pointed out in this article.
The car drives well and handles like a Savvy with a softer suspension, the Campro’s annoying torque dip is gone, the interior is decent with good legroom and headroom, and a 1.3 litre engine should prove to be fuel economical. People, this is your car!
The only thing that worries me is that Proton’s assembly line still seems to be a hit or miss affair, I have a friend with a perfect Proton Satria Neo, while some others find that they’ve mistakenly purchased moving aquariums with failing power windows. I hope Proton will continue to improve on their QC efforts.
The aftermarket industry should quickly look into designing sportier springs, anti-roll bars, and a short shifter for this car, as I believe these will really be in demand for those who wish for a more engaging drive from their economical buy.
Proton Saga N-Line Manual – RM31,500
Proton Saga B-Line Manual – RM34,998
Proton Saga B-Line Auto – RM37,998
Proton Saga M-Line Manual – RM37,498
Proton Saga M-Line Auto – RM39,998
It is available in 7 colours – Metallic Black, Granite Grey, Solid White, Genetic Silver, Chili Red, Mountain Blue, and Zircon Green.
Please post any questions in the comments if you want to know more about the car. I will try my best to answer with whatever I remember of the car from the short media test drive we had on Monday.
Please enjoy the following additional photos:
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Manual transmission meter panel – Click to enlarge
Automatic transmission meter panel – Click to enlarge
Automatic transmission meter panel – Click to enlarge
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Chili Red
Chili Red
Metallic Black
B-Line Genetic Silver, with N-Line Solid White in background
Mountain Blue
N-Line Solid White
Zircon Green
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FIRST!!!
Would love to test drive it someday. Might be my very first car!
it’s ok but the price is a bit higher for this model. hope to review the price and pls compare with others country cars. If the car sales in malaysia always is expensive and low quality. u believe or not the models export to oversea always the quality will better than here, why this happen? do the proton knows that we malaysians also human being where need beter quality cars. think about it
w0w..very cute car
GOOD
Third!!!..hehe….cool~~
not a bad looker
Looll..Forgot to sign in 1st…If Not i’ll b da 1st to comment..Huhu
Bravo Proton..
‘Proton Basher’..Any words ?
one question.do they have power window for the N-Line?
cool…just saw the launching at TV1 just now…am going to have a look tonight at the nearet showroom…
good job proton!!
well done, Proton!!!
will consider to buy one after real view of it.
I bought one.!!!!
i bought too…
fourth..damn..
Did you ask whether the new IAFM cant be fitted to the current campro thts already out there on the streets?
WAH
Very NICE CAR !
Interior is cool too ! :D
Unfortunately, only the most expensive variant has the front fog lamps, seat height adjuster, reverse sensor, and electric door mirror and alloy rims :)
HAI… disappointed
good….
but i hate body roll….
but no car is perfect…
at last… on 18th january 2008..
congratulation.. 2morow gonna see it with myy own eye at mutiara damansara..
Let keep finger cross
very long gear stick..how about the seat..suitable for long journey?
My First Impression WOW!!!! Will make a point to Proton Edar Showroom Tonite – My wife already planning her new set of wheels. May this is it
Another WOW!!! From me…. or rather US
stylishhhh! fu yohh!
Looks good! Might be interested in getting this car!
I like d meter cluster…
Thanks paul, since I live far from the city, your blog cover some of my question without any need to go to the showroom. Perhaps some of the question best answered in the showroom itself. Anyway this is a great blog and I never fail to read anything you post here especially if I’m looking for a new car.
Damn… i have to say that this is a damn good car… this is real economical family car… and it look so good… look like proton have make us proud at last… bravo proton!
nice…the standard of ‘our’ car is getting better…..well done !
wahh.. i must hand it to you Paul. published on 5.30pm on the dot! impress.. impress..
actually, im currently at Proton COE showroom rite now. as i mentioned in other threat, a family member already made bookings for this baby.
wow, it’s definitely worth it! it looks waaaayyy better in real. every body was ‘ohh and ahhh’ing.. very funny if you tell me. since im only there as an observer, more than once strangers come up to me and ask my opinion on the colors, features etc (perhaps thinking ill be impartial or they jz need a 3rd opinion, but i think their minds are rather set on buying). you’ll be surprised how solid color can also look so good. i personally like the granite grey one, kinda sleek looking
im not in liberty to buy another sedan, im saving my pretty pennies for my future sports car. but then i can tell you straight up its hard to keep your cool looking at those babies. to future SAGA owners, congratulations. hope sumbody would give me a ride soon!
Atleast it has decent looks and not something which is bold and out of ordinary. Perhaps this is really what the people really want.
The dials still look like they were from an old wira. To save costs, there must be some ingenuity.
Paul, what about the issue of quality? Are gonna get what we paid for? Or much lesser? Kindly enlighten us.
Word of caution to buyers. Proton still needs time to sort out their issues. People who rush to buy it will be proton’s guinea pig. Don’t say u are not warned though it is very tempting.
Goddammit! This car is freakin UGLY… hehehe… NOT~
Seriously… from the first look, it’s not bad at all! It’s very possitive. The interior looks good. They are playing safe eh. hehe… Anyway, with this pricing, “car V” and “car M” will be having a tough time. lol~
u r great Proton….Excellent..
twelfth!!hahahaha
great car man! i like the price.
X L N,
paul ,
is it not too overly exegerated if i say,
its a bit of french car ride quality, (comfort tuned)
The part that shocked me was about the handling. But I assume it is still better than iswara right?
Paul it will be great if you can do comparisons between this New Saga and the old one. Like in pick up feel, comfort, interior is narrower than the old saga? thos kind of stuff.
Too late to book now… the waiting list already very very long :)
looks good. surprisingly good for a car with such dimentions.
It’s easy to imagine similar design cues on future proton models such as the perdana replacement or MPV.
Kudos to Paul Tan for his kind report and congratulation to Proton for the resurrection of its new Saga…at last.
So ladies and gentlemen, the car is already there. I am looking forward to your feedbacks, compliments, grouses, complaints and everything about the car. It’s all yours now. Let the party begins !!
nice headlight….
with the pricing… can’t complain much dee…
the exterior looks nice… very nice indeed… interior..have to see it in person to feel it it’s cheap or not… although paul did mention on something being done on the surface…
all in all, for the first time, we can classify this car as cheap and probably good?
hehe
a very very good looking car seriously…decent stylish base line model i ever seen…good expansion job from savvy platform…p1 doing great job then those jap…no awkward look in this car…simple interior design but i bet it will functional well…i like those meter panel…a spacious car from what i see…good job…i think theres more to come from this new saga…high line is not introduce yet..i think the high line wait for its own campro cps+VIM to be fitted on it…mayb it will come with more feature on its interior plus some R3 bodykit…hahaha good job p1 g luck BLM…gonna see it personally at showroom ASAP
freeze said,
January 18, 2008 @ 6:02 pm
Paul it will be great if you can do comparisons between this New Saga and the old one. Like in pick up feel, comfort, interior is narrower than the old saga? thos kind of stuff.
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table given up there.
Cool exterior design, same thing I can’t say for interior. P2 Viva will never selling well after this as it used to be. My opinion.
BTW manual stick quite fugly. I’m no P1 basher please, mere sincere comment from a citizen.
The overall design is very nice, waaayyy better than the Logan. By the way, how is the all round drivers view?, seems the front pillar is abit wide and obstructing. Any plan for a track day event Paul? Love to see what this baby can really do. Recaro seats, anyone?
wow.. good job proton!! a good product really! and superb pricing. for the first time in history, the rakyat do not feel cheated by a glc ! congrats proton..
i would like to offer myself to represent perodua to announce the stopping production of perodua viva… hahahahaha… :P
going to see it tonite.my wife says is quite interested.may be buying.if only i can sell her jeep 1st.
headache…
over all looks good
over all look tidy finising.
oh yeah…………the new saga really look cool
drebar , i agree wat u say,stop to produce viva …………wakaka
P2 viva ,a loser of proon saga ……….
i cant wait to see the the new perdana will be wat look,
but i think it will very very very cool……….
at last!! the moment of truth!!
hooray!! my baby is out!!!
gonna enjoy driving it!!
thnks a lot paul for this great masterpiece of urs!!
bravo Proton!!!
=) GREAT suprise…. i like it…. looks simple yet stylish… improvements in its performance… Good job Proton…
how it would ‘taste’ oh if u put 15/16 inch sport rim, apexi safc? hehehe.
so…
really great style IMO..
i really like the front..
but still a cool car and my desire to buy Car M has vanished and SAGA come into my mind..
considering the long Q for booking, I will wait for the high line.. maybe they insert the campro CPS but will it fit..
just wait and see..
perodua will have less sales…..
brilliant dashboard texture, really dampen the reflectivity,
bl4ck said,
January 18, 2008 @ 6:41 pm
how it would ‘taste’ oh if u put 15/16 inch sport rim, apexi safc? hehehe.
______________________
will taste slightly like this, huhu!: http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2048/2187349626_47677fac06_o.jpg
What I like: the look from behind, boot space, cup holder at the back door.
What I don’t like: only the high line got the small compartment behind the driver and passenger seat (other only have behind passenger seat, I wonder why).
crash test only got 3 star. I expect it will got 4.
still hard to see the behind when reverse.
quality no better than viva.
conclusion: never regret I got a myvi. :)
arghhh showroom is crowded… will come back tomorrow to look for this car.
saw the launch via internet streaming @ office.. it look nice, let see tomorrow if it feel better.
and BTW paul tan, bravo and well done for the coverage :)
well done proton!
proton had been doin their homework nicely!
well, for an econo-car like dis, we dont expect much detailing like button feel, touch and so on. its pretty decent. hope tat r3 division will sort out the throttle issues as well as the suspension issue. i’m sure dis car will look gempak wit nice r3 aerokit! havent seen the car tho..
anyway.. its really good to c the road flooded(hopefully soon) with a car like dis! proper safety, decent economy, etc… goodluck with ur future models!
wow… this car seems strong and i doubt the competition from myvi le… its good to know tat proton finally comes out with “the people’s car”… nice brilliant move!
not really sure bout this….just wait n see ar…..
persona being a hot babies just for one month…after that?…
see that?….and think by yourself la
mmm.. from motortrader review, the 1.3L campro IAFM has 98hp and 113.2Nm which contradict to your review. now im not sure which one is the corrent engine spec. care to expain us, paul??
bole la…quite impressing for our national car maker
sure sell like hot cake…maybe it will set the highest sales record…n hold it for
a very long time…b4 other car makers able to beat it..well done to the
engineers..a job done well…
just back from launching at KLCC.
THIS CAR ROCKS!
about 7 cars of different specs were shown.
IMO white color suits me :)
plastics feel good
the drag coefficient, Cd, same as savvy
galvanised steel is used
frankly speaking, Viva is just an overpriced car!
apart from “makan2”, we managed to get know
that a 7-seater mpv will come insyaAllah.
for those who wish to have a sporty look saga,
u can fit 17inch OZ rim, leather seat,
smoked headlamp, side skirts,
scaled-down evo spoiler at the back.
it’s not my idea, but was shown there by RED
(a department sort of), in eye catching red chinese color,
with black colored roof.
who want their VW if we can have our own VW ?(Volks=people, Wagon=car)
Viel Glück Proton!
a good looking car imo. interior looks modern. with enhance engine. i expect built quality to improve or potong zaka this proton saga
Seen the car this afternoon, it was rather stylish and elegant. Now lets hope the quality of the car won’t dissapoint us!!!
with lotus, i hope that r3/RED or wateva division will make a sporty variant of saga and savvy that benchmark the legendary peugeot 205gti or the original mk1 golf gti for its purity in handling. juz dream..
cant wait to see the look on my fren’s face…. sure she is regreting for buying myvi now n cant wait to show of to other teachers in school who bought viva
sure lepas ni…’viva gone forever’!!!
hahahah
hmmmm not bad le the looks and everything… But Paul, to you, Persona or the new Saga is better? ride comfort built quality and etc….?
Paul Tan boleh!!! Thanks anyway.
Finally some commendable efforts from Proton.. Hope they’ll keep it up..
Even tho I ain’t in the market for a new car, I’ll still be goin for a lookie at the dealership to see how good this new “people’s car” really is…
Thx Paul for the quick coverage! Great write-up as always!
The front part looks like Fiat Panda, cool…
hahaaaa..mari mari..all of us buy one, then we can create new proton saga car club..can make alot of money tooo..hahah mari mari mari!!!
congratz proton.. finally u’ve made it.. can’t wait to test drive this car
Paul your blog is on the news!!! Here’s the link…. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82f8O2u-lRo&feature=related
gosh.. this blog is like a chatroom! i got hooked and had been following ever since day one i browse it.. me newbie but feels like family liao! lol .. am loving this new saga baby alredi! if got saga club can me and my old babe megavalve saga join arrrr ;)
Clean design…but not a big WOWW it’s just a normal car, not excited, not bother to look it, but congrats Proton for your new products.
I’ll wait and see whose power windows will fail this time… my bro’s 2007 Gen2 failed twice last year and now it is starting to fail again. Bah, back to Proton again.
While replacement is free for 3 years, it is the time wasted to get it replaced at the service centre.
Saga R3 anyone?
Thumb up for P1
good job
After 22 years, at last, the old Saga can rest in peace.
At one glance, non-motoring enthisuast will find it hard to believe this SAGA was based from Savvy, unless you put them side-by-side.
No airbag/s is not really an issue for me..at least I have the option to put a 4-spoke Momo later on. And, hey, even the base model got power steering & central lock!
Paul,
From your review you wrote the shift pattern is P-R-N-D-2-L, but from the pic it looks like it is P-R-N-D-3-2-L.
the long stick shifter does look rather odd….let’s hope it can withstand prolonged use and the moment exerted on it.
Already see this car in the showroom, well looks much better than in the pictures and overall it’s a nice looking sedan and simple, any way not planning to buy a new car so soon….don’t mind buying this one in future…
Paul:
How would you rate this car overall on a scale of say 1-10,
1 being a pile of rubbish to 10 drives like a Ferrari 430 Scuderia?
i just got back from the showroom, the car is so niceeeee. harap2 loan cepat approve. so slowla bank nih!! im petite. but i dont feel small sitting in the driver seat. i used to cuak, kot2 the car might be too big for me like my father’s iswara. unfortunately dia takde tray under the seat like the perodua. and it has big boots :) the seat is comfortable, not like the gen 2. tp td tengok getah kat tepi boot dia tuh dah tercabut. org2 yg gi tgk showroom tuh ganas2 betullll. nway, i still like the car :) my first ever car :)
mmmm, nice… Audi A4 front facelift + Merc C class tail lights… Good job Proton…
i sometimes drive my work car, a Land Cruiser 70 pickup with a gearstick as long as the saga and it feels lazy and imprecise compared to my daily transport, a manual AE101corolla. one of the reasons ppl buy a small manual is for the sweet and tacticle gearchange feel when you shift. from this review, it seems that this car is underdeveloped, although the interior is the best i’ve seen from a proton- and you can’t really argue with performance with this money. oh and the N-line version looks like a commercial vehicle- wheels too small
Long gearstick is the norm nowdays, a common feature in race/track cars. An ergonomic feature for our hand to shift from steering wheel to gearstick in shorter time. Short gear stick is a thing past just like found in Savvy MT. Paddle shifters totally eliminates the need to take our hands off the steering. 2 hands on steering wheel is important for us to have total control on our car during race.
Just came back from proton showroom. Too bad that I’ve bought the merdeka saga 6 months ago. This new saga is such a nice looking car. What I like most about this car are the steering which is like the one in satria neo (without the buttons), the overall exterior design and the taillights, which is very nice looking too. But, what I don’t like about this car is the plastic looking handbrake, and for me the old saga’s handbrake looks better though. Otherwise, this is such a very desirable car for that price tag.
(um after all registered to this site just to compliment the new saga…)
No bad ar…
But have to see the Real SAGA 1st
hi all, me a newbie, hooked on paultan’s blog ever since first time saw it, this place is even faster than a chatroom, really freaking awesome lolz.. am loving the new saga baby alredi! if got saga club can me and my old babe megavalve saga join arrrr.. til i upgrade to new gen saga! ;)
hmmm.. wonder why is BigFish now… hehe
Congratulation and thanks Paul Tan for the good review of the new Proton Saga. Congratulation to Proton and all the best in future and come out even more exciting and better products.
Well, I haven’t go to showroom as there were so many people at two of the Proton showrooms which I passed by after work. Tomorrow sure will go to see the Saga. For now, I kinda dislike the long manual gear shifter.
Paul, may I know what is the drag coefficient (cd) of this Saga and do you have any crash test photos for this Saga or you can just stated its rating. Thanks a lot.
The People’s car Award 2008 and People Car Choice Award 2008 goes to Proton Saga!! hahaha…. just to hit up the party!!
Happy Motoring.
As usual, so many congratulatory and patriotic statements. .Not least the Proton salesman talk this good and that good ……
i cannot resist this car but cannot afford to buy a new car….how?pity me..uhuhuhe
I really wish to personally congratulate Proton, especially Mr. Syed Zainal Abidin. They’ve done such a wonderful job bringing Proton back in the black!
I think this will sell better than their own Persona, in terms of price.
The one thing that I am most happy for Proton is the design, NO MORE SH*TTY SAVVY DESIGN!!! Everything looks so stylish now, including the nice interior, which is a step up from the previous cars, even the Persona’s remake seem to look bad next to the new Saga’s!
Welcome back Saga, and more importantly, Proton.
cant wait to see Proton’s MPV… should be better than this… not in the market for sedan
The best comments i’ve seen on proton cars in decades!!!
Great job Proton. Hope to have lots of new models after this :) .
Gonna photoshop bodykit renderings after this . ;)
Thank to PT for good write up which is very informative but not exhaustive.
——–
“Please post any questions in the comments if you want to know more about the car.”
———
I visited the Proton showroom opposite IOI Mall. And there are two new Saga on display, come with black and white.
Paul, hope you can answer this question: –
1. Conventional design have 2 piece window, old Saga, first Kancil, Mercs S class, Waja, Persona, or any other car all have small triangle fix piece + windable rectangular piece.
2. From my “inspection” on rear window. I am in the opinion that the BIGGEST FLAW and BLUNT BIG MISTAKE for this car is the rear window come with one big single wind able rectangular piece.
3. I try to wind down manually for the white and black color. I managed to wind down all 4 windows but lower down approximately 2/3 of the opening only (so eliminated my doubt on faulty/malfunction window). Looking at the car and photo in your blog, side view, red color), the one big piece window extends to the top of handle. Logical explanation is this piece can wind down to up to top of tyre or bumper level only. Thus, the big piece is unable to fully wind down for full opening.
4. Asked the sales girl for explanation, she was “kelam-kabut” without any answer but just try to wind down the window. Ask another salesman, his answer is “biasalah”, “oh yah, this window design to open 2/3 simply because survey show people tend not to fully open the window and to prevent children from coming out.” For me, no answer from the salesgirl is better than the salesman “freak talk”.
5. The above is not as what defender described as “ad honimem” argument, but through proper observation and hand on to check it. Anyone go to showroom can do it themselves to satisfy that what I said is factually correct.
6. I don’t think it is part of child lock system – “Fitting its purpose as a family car, the new Proton Saga comes with child lock functions for the rear doors”.
Care to explain, not only from Paul, but anyone, be it Proton engineer, defender, bashers, etc. Care to share the information.
Thank you in advance for any objective explanation.
Paul says: hey, thank you very much for reminding me of this. i did notice this and even took a photo of it to blog, but somehow i forgot to insert it in the article. i have now added a photo and an extra paragraph regarding this.
Wow… Nice job Proton! The front looks amazing! While the rear, on the other hand is OK, looks like Skoda… Overall I am impressed… Front looks very sporty, and looks like it has potential to be even sportier (we’ll definitely see modified versions of this car) and I already thought of one design in mu head the moment I saw this… Think EVO X and Golf GTi…
lots of ppl asking around when m in the show room…really like this model alots…luckily made advance booking early on for my mannual granite grey…avoided to long QQQ…one thing which not like on this baby will be the height ratio between the window & the door body…sort of weird when looking from far…can’t wait to test drive it…pls. share out comments once you all able to test drive…
One thing I noticed… Why is the center piece (between driver and passenger) so low? They raised the gear lever so high that it looks awkward… I mean, while reaching for the air-con knob, people are definitely gonna bump into the gear shifter…
Wow Big Fish… i’m at awe at your determination to find flaws & open up possibility for bashing sessions…
when will the NEW Saga come with a hatch back version?
next year?
Hi all, i was new here,
just back from the showroom, the car was very very nice, good job to proton this time, realy cant complaint it, but where can i see all the color of the new saga or the Moutain Blue & Chili Red, i like this two color, who know pls let me know, thanks
wahh, the rear view looks 95% like the previous gen C-class (which is a good thing). overall, i think it looks better than latio, city, or even vios! kudos to Proton!
Bravo… gonna see it tomorrow. The salesman SMS to me for today’s launch and refreshment for everyone, but I could not make it. Otherwise today makan free, ha ha ha.
And oh..the black=chrome emblems Rare sick (great) i love ’em. The’re gonna be like that for the other upcoming models.
hi guys & gals…
went to the showroom to have a look at the Saga… a nice decent built car and quite roomy…
but thats not the point… i talked to a proton guy… i asked him about the waja CPS… he informed me that the new waja would be launched in april at the latest after proton launched the new perdana in march. and the new mpv would be in the middle of this year… wah… 4 model with-in this year alone… but sadly, according to him, the waja would cost more by a few thousand. beside the changes of the powertrain and interior, there would be some minor changes to the exterior also. hope this info is true and will excite us for the next few months… ciao
wow! impressive! thumbs up! Finally a major improvement!
Congratulation Proton, congratrulation Syed Zainal and Whole proton family. Now you produce people car. It look simple but very nice. I like it. Good for ladies as well
Is it only the test unit or the car does not come with mud flaps? Or do all new cars come without it nowadays? Also notice there is no side signal? But ofcourse can see the front one from the side as well.
kingbrutal said,
January 18, 2008 @ 10:43 pm
hi guys & gals…
went to the showroom to have a look at the Saga… a nice decent built car and quite roomy…
but thats not the point… i talked to a proton guy… i asked him about the waja CPS… he informed me that the new waja would be launched in april at the latest after proton launched the new perdana in march.
===================================================
A new perdana? The mitsubishi 380? or a facelift?
BigFish said,
January 18, 2008 @ 10:01 pm
———————————————————-
wow, after considering the flaw that you pointed out, i think this car really suck now, cause the back window cant be winded down completely
…..
wow, for the segment it is in it kinda wins hands down in the looks and practicality section… BUT hope its QC bucks up… proton now designs nice looking cars but the moment of truth for them will be their QC which i bet my buck will suck again….
Wah, based on comparison with Car V and Car M, this new SAGA definately the best for money. Pity to those who already own V and M, ya. Not only that, the price is also cheaper.
Why is V for Vendetta sitting in the rear seat? He looks so happy though.
hi everyone
my first time here and hope that you can help me in choosing Myvi,persona and the new proton saga. my first priority is fuel economy and engine technology, then space and accessories.
thank you
And pity to those who own Old SAGA. Trade-in price is so cheap that better to keep rather than trade-in.
farghmee said,
January 18, 2008 @ 7:30 pm
just back from launching at KLCC.
THIS CAR ROCKS!
about 7 cars of different specs were shown.
IMO white color suits me
plastics feel good
the drag coefficient, Cd, same as savvy
galvanised steel is used
frankly speaking, Viva is just an overpriced car!
apart from “makan2″, we managed to get know
that a 7-seater mpv will come insyaAllah.
for those who wish to have a sporty look saga,
u can fit 17inch OZ rim, leather seat,
smoked headlamp, side skirts,
scaled-down evo spoiler at the back.
it’s not my idea, but was shown there by RED
(a department sort of), in eye catching red chinese color,
with black colored roof.
who want their VW if we can have our own VW ?(Volks=people, Wagon=car)
Viel Glück Proton!
ilmondo said,
January 18, 2008 @ 7:37 pm
with lotus, i hope that r3/RED or wateva division will make a sporty variant of saga and savvy that benchmark the legendary peugeot 205gti or the original mk1 golf gti for its purity in handling. juz dream..
Guys, was talking to the guys wearing the SAGA RED shirt at KLCC launch this evening, Actually the car is from Proton Styling department, PROTON l Design as you can see stated on the number plate, and the plastic plate by the c-pillar (not R3 or RED department as you think) . The car is actually a showcar to give an overview to customers how to modify their SAGA. and done by PROTON l Design designers. RED means Revolution Enhanced design, as you can see, the standard SAGA is Enhanced for the showcar..
ahh Big Fish I was trying so hard to comprehend ur question then I finally get it…the big piece of windows rests on top of the rear wheel arches when fully wind down..that’s what you mean.
I think my savvy rear windows can’t be fully wind down also..
Waja does not have a small triangle piece also..can the rear windows fully wind down..or the wheel base is long enough to accomodate the fully wind down windos.
Cost is the main factor..just adding a small window on the A-pillar like Honda City is could raise the cost…
and truly it’s a safe design for manual cranked window…there’s no other mean for you to raise up the windows if kids are at the rear seat.
hey, anyone took pics of that saga RED?? cant wait to see mod new gen saga on the roads ;)
And pity to those who own Old SAGA. Trade-in price is so cheap that better to keep rather than trade-in.
—————————————————————-
There’s still demand for cars with carburettor engines..SO simple to mantain..no electronics, no ECU, No sensors to worry about.
cabin width is reasonable ,likely a wira width,
boost up seat good for legs,
of course stiffer suspension batter, but its suit the best and more rewarding for car with more powerful engine with big wheel and low profile tyre for higher limit of application and enjoyment, the GTI for instance,
or sportier tuned suspension is for 1.6 as its more capable, or for sportier hatch,
but for this 08 saga, if i were to own 1, ill keep this supple suspension for a joy of being comfort, keep its satndard wheel,
but like said, with 08 saga cheaper car, if got some spare duit to visit accesories shop,,
Hey just got back from the show rooms. Theres alot of space in the engine compartment. Wow. Its for turbo enthusiast i guess. Other areas are reasonably good. Overall looks is acceptable from front to back but then I feel the proton emblem is probably a little too big. anyways i would give a 7.5/10 ratings :)
will they fix the new improved fuel efficient engine on persona?
ENZO said,
January 18, 2008 @ 10:32 pm
when will the NEW Saga come with a hatch back version?
next year?
———–
Hacth back – Savvy lah dude …………
yup yup.. tat’s why i still love my old auto megavalve saga so much.. two decades old liao and still goin strong.. quite reliable car it is… easy and cheap to maintain..
I will be back to post few more questions about this car that I doubt likely have quality issues.
i’m just back from COE… what i can say is this car is much-much better from picture.. i like the black color rear view… like honda city.. what can i say is i don’t expect better than i thought… the interior is simple.. meter = cool.. front & rear looking is wow.. the back cupholder is good.. i think black color is most of choice.. car ‘V’ & car ‘M’ is on trouble right now… what can i say is “the Saga legendary is begin”…
a very good car in term of performance & price
Not that great looking but not that bad either, just simple and functional for basic car. The styling is acceptable and way much better than old boxy dinosaur saga. I like the front design most and mostly it is uncluttered.
Interior as expected hard plastic as a main ingredient to reduce cost. By adding a textured pattern on it somehow reduce it cheapness look, but not very much.
Manual gear shifter too awkward, just like a lorry. ;-)
Well I’m going to showroom tomorrow to test drive and see how it performed. Expect to see the famous slamming door test by unscrupulous Malaysian public tomorrow too. :-)
wau!!!!!!ur advertisement in tv so deepful…..good 4 p1 basher…..
Yeah…Rock it baby!! Seriously cute car.K.O punch to V car maybe..hahaha.
I give 7.99 over 10.00 rate for this new born.
i will rate it as 8 over 10….
Seen the car with own eyes in the showroom just now. Looks much more better than just from the picture. The exterior design is stunning for a car of this size and this price. Interior wise, I love the new texture they make on the dashboard. It makes them seems like soft rubberish feels even though in reality its hard plastic. The gear knob also does not feels or seems too tall as seen from the picture here. Its quite acceptable to me and better than the old Saga/Iswara. Legroom is ample at anywhere you seat and headroom is almost as good as sitting in my Inokom Matrix.
Overall, its the best car that you can buy for that money and congrats to proton for able to produce such a car. Next, I’m eagerly waiting for the new Proton MPV. Hidup Proton!
I must say..very impressed I am with the simple design & widely acceptable by many. Pleasing to the eye. never even expect the interior that good as well was wondering similar to the old unit.
I must stilll say..gosh its better looking than the present WAJA. Many would agree with me.
Surprised BigFish rather quiet, besides clevelry pointing one mistake but a blind spot to many potential client. What say u Bigfish…it must be better than ur expectation so u rather not speak out…?? I do like ur comments.
Good work Proton. U will see there will be word of criticism from the Mini Drivers/owners. Full with envy , they will point out like thier big ego…Mymini space is biger than SAGA…u will see. They dont give up.
#
ENZO said,
January 18, 2008 @ 10:32 pm
when will the NEW Saga come with a hatch back version?
next year?
—————————————————————–
err, u mean savvy?
kingbrutal said,
January 18, 2008 @ 10:43 pm
hi guys & gals…
went to the showroom to have a look at the Saga… a nice decent built car and quite roomy…
but thats not the point… i talked to a proton guy… i asked him about the waja CPS… he informed me that the new waja would be launched in april at the latest after proton launched the new perdana in march.
===================================================
A new perdana? I strongly doubt it! A facelift maybe, but I think what the salesmen meant is the new Gen-2 facelift as launch in Thailand recently.
From my observation, normally we should be able to see spyshots of new Proton models on road test circulated on the net about 3 to 6 months before the planned lauch date. And I’m sure nobody here have seen
anything that could be the new Perdana.
Firstly i’m planning to buy kakak Persona. Unfortunately, i change my mind because of this model. Thanks. Very cheap. I think Proton will become top world’s low cost car manufacture of the year with great combination of technology. This model i think will become hot like “pisang goreng” soon. Not hot cake(orang malaysia mana suka sangat cake). Keep it up Proton.
I got some information. About fuel cunsumption. I read from http://www.proton.com.sg/persona_specs.html.
– Persona melahap 6.3 liter and this Saga melahap 6 liter liter with both running 100km constant at 90km/h for manual transmission. Only different 300ml for extra 300cc?
I’m konpius. Any clever people kindly tell me something about this reality.
Bad idea. Overall i think better Persona. because more comfortable.
do you want my bapak car’s old wira? with nice number Wxx 5353. kehkehkeh…
wow
very detailed ‘report’ for this blm
front design cue like R34
impressive design
in budget price
kudo proton
Jeremy Clarkson : “Finally there is cheap n cheerful car from Proton..” :P
nice car but the interest rate is killing me. damn the bank!!!
Hei guys dont be so happy yet. Have anyone realize the test crash picture, especially the side crash 1. See carefully & think can the person survive inside? Even the front crash test u can see already went half into the engine bay, will the engine stuff went inside the cabin?
The safe result haven come out yet & i have a feeling it will not be very good…
BigFish said,
January 18, 2008 @ 10:01 pm
5. The above is not as what defender described as “ad honimem†argument, but through proper observation and hand on to check it…
____________________________________________
What you just gave was a first hand account. Nobody has suggested otherwise. Although everyone can have a different account for any given scenario.
A “first hand account” and an “ad hominem” argument are two very different things. In other posts, I used the term ad hominem to refer to your criticisms of other commenters – when you attacked/flamed the commenter rather than the idea the commenter gave.
No need to get defensive.
I was at KLCC Convention Centre. This is where all the Proton peeps went, including some Worker Union guys. Lots off official-looking men in tacky cheap suits. Saw the CEO, was politely asked to make way for the MD…
Saw all the models. Talked to some guys. Got a brochure. Sat in the white manual version coz the auto stick was really putting me off. Sat in the manual, nice seats…hmm…nice louvres. Flick-flick. Saw the stick, slowly engaged clutch and moved the stick. Limp. Tried the whole circle round my hand. When you throw it is sooo rubbery. I liked the fact they maintain Single DIN player, there’s enough room under the seats for amps. And Paul. Double DIN sucks. Its pretentious to have those lights. Nobody makes them anymore coz nobody cares what happens to cassetes.
Went out and headed straight to the engine bay and tried to see the IAFM but couldn’t because of the engine cover. Then headed round the back. Nice A$$!!
But yeah…ok. Its basic. Went and saw the heart-wrenching ad on the screens and that’s where it happened. I’ve looked beyond it’s failings and have come to accept it as it is; the people’s car. Practically just aching to be lowered.
Me? Just waiting for my black 1.6Neo Std and a chance to go up to Karak.
nice mullet.
how does it compare with the swift, vios/yaris and jazz?
thats its competitors in overseas markets. and maybe when afta kicks in since proton is so successful now.
by the way, how do they calculate fuel economy figures in msia? 6.3 litres at a constant of 90kmh???. alot of cars can do that nowadays.
LittleFire85,
Let me explain a little to you about crash protection. The car has to deform in order to absorb the energy from the crash. If the car does not deform, all the energy will be transfered to the passenger, and the passenger will probably die. The front is supposed to collapse; and the engine and stuff will not go into the cabin as the engine bay has extra space (it is not packed 100% full, so to speak). The moving and bending of parts is what absorbs the energy. Take a look at www.euroncap.com to see the crash test results of other cars. The key is that the cabin area should not deform too much; and the areas around it should deform to absorb energy.
Oh yeah another thing. The rear windows of my 2003 Hyundai Trajet doesn’t come down all the way too. So what!? Bugger off.
Hei guys dont be so happy yet. Have anyone realize the test crash picture, especially the side crash 1. See carefully & think can the person survive inside? Even the front crash test u can see already went half into the engine bay, will the engine stuff went inside the cabin?
The safe result haven come out yet & i have a feeling it will not be very good…
—————————————————————-
What the heck Ever heard of crumple zone? From the pics it’s good enough.
Look at the previos entries how the firewall is reinforced with safety bars and beams to spread apart and channel the impact force from the point of collision. I’m pretty sure the engine is designed drop upon a collision.
It’s even better designed than some Nippon rebadged cars!
Collision bar in front of the radiator.
Viva, I bet myvi’s look puny like this too hehe…not even qualified to be refer as beam
http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/881/vivacompressorwt2.jpg
Savvy
http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc187/zairulsalina/IMG_1186.jpg
White stuff polystyrene materials for pedestrian protection.
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n137/mohdhaizi/nik%20accident/Image549.jpg
Chassis strengthening force distributions beams in BLM and all Proton cars, just like savvy.
http://images.paultan.org/images/proton-blm/Proton_BLM_Build_Teaser_13_Large.jpg
With front bar installed.
http://images.paultan.org/images/Proton_BLM_Buildup_100108_4_Large.jpg
W/o the front bar
http://images.paultan.org/images/proton-blm/Proton_BLM_Build_Teaser_15_Large.jpg
BigFish said,
As usual, so many congratulatory and patriotic statements. .Not least the Proton salesman talk this good and that good ……
wah u never learn how to respect others opinion huh… 90% readers here congratulate p1 and say a good thing about this Saga is that mean all of them are p1 salesmen huh….so you must be toyota salesmen always say good things about toyota…please mr fish, there are many readers give honest praise and constructive critics about this car….they said it with honesty what they like about this car and what they dont.so what wrong with that….is it so worse for u if someone say congratulation to p1…that is just they opinion plz respect it…yes mayb they said it with patriotic spirit but once again what is wrong with that…this is made in malaysia by malaysian there must be some proud feeling about it because we are malaysian since it so clear that this product is looking good inside out( but not perfect…no car is perfect)…i think u must go to PLKN to learn how to love your country and support if not much, a bit wut malaysian people is producing by their own hands, plus they do a very good job for this one…
for your question about the rear window…its practical to just can lower it down until 3/4 only since this will increase safety factor for children seat at the rear and this car have an air-con so no need to wind down the mirror…if still want to get fresh air from outside, i think its enough 3/4 down only so you nose will not suck so much air:)….others car have this feature too…example kenari
OK. Now this is my 2nd message to this page. Just now only gave my impression on the new car b4 going home at the office. Too excited to go and see the car. After office hour, straight head to the nearest proton Showroom at Batu Berendam , Melaka there. There was a large crowd when i arrived there around 6.15pm.
When i am around the crowd, one good thing is i didnt hear any negative comments from any of the customers there. I observe what other people are saying while taking a look on the car.
Some of my verdict on that car: 1) engine compartment is big, not so cramp in there. therefore, your mechanic will love to service your car engine as well. HAHA. Radiator is good too in keeping the engine cool (bigger) .
*** The engine cover is not suitable to be use on CAMPRO anyway. Take it off.
2) Interior really impress me especially the meter panel (very nice looking). Seats are comfortable too (both front and rear seats). Seating position is good too. Legroom are acceptable.
3) The boot is large enough though and the boot cover is definitely safer to open and close than the 1 use on the persona and iswara. Easy to open and close the boot. suitable for ladies :)
4) Rear bumper if u observed after opening the boot cover, u will see 5 BIG screws are used. (Benefit: the bumper will not easily fall-off in the event of a small collision from the rear) and for the front bumper, i didnt observe it. So i cant comment on the front bumper.
5) Rear door frame rubber is thick enough and looks like the lasting type. Closing the rear door sound also different. Front door frame rubber didnt observe.
6) oo ya, also the interior compartment (drawer ) on the front passenger side is made from thick plastic ( exactly the one found the same on the MYVI) Go and touch and feel it and u will believe mee. (HARD OO)
7) the Clarion Radio CD player looks nice too. The player’s color should have match with the dashboard color :)
8) … enough for now. too many already. I am going to book this model on this Sunday because less people and also the salesman will have time to deal with u. Dont mind with the queue. I plan to buy either the blue or the white or silver color, (B-Line) Manual Transmission :D
OK LA. My comment is too long i guess
I must say ” Proton, U have another Success Achievement ” Finally . . :)
saw the car at PE today, good value, decent space (similar size with the vios actually), good design exterior and interior..finally a car for the masses..excellent!! …2-4 months waiting list though..sigh..
Hei guys dont be so happy yet. Have anyone realize the test crash picture, especially the side crash 1. See carefully & think can the person survive inside? Even the front crash test u can see already went half into the engine bay, will the engine stuff went inside the cabin?
The safe result haven come out yet & i have a feeling it will not be very good…
————————————————————–
aiya very hard to satisfy this schoolboy….of coz la the engine bay will be like that….every car is like that ma….that is call strategic crash absorbing…the most important thing is u see the cabin structure……have u seen a crash test before this or not?
huhuhu..WOW!!that is my first impression..i like it..hope it will be my very first car..
BigFish said,
January 18, 2008 @ 10:01 pm
———————————————————-
wow, after considering the flaw that you pointed out, i think this car really suck now, cause the back window cant be winded down completely
=========================
The rear window is purposely made not to wind down completely as for safety issue. Even BMW have this, this is not production flaws, grey imports of BMW don’t have this if you notice…..
wa this model still got side crash test ar? Not bad huh? The frontal crash test looks better than waja…
Superb Proton!!
What most of us waiting 4 already reveal..
Got the chance to take a look at this beauty just b4 launch..Haha
Very nice…Keep up the good work Proton.
Paul, I have some questions regarding the gearboxes. There are no mentions of a new A/T unit supplier, so I guess it’s still using the same gearbox supplied with the Gen2 / Neo 1.3 units. Now, the question would be if these units have the “improved TCU” that is supplied with the 1.6 engine in the Persona.
Secondly, it seems like the M/T unit from Aichi is essentially a Nissan unit, perhaps with different gear ratios. It puzzles me that it has relatively ordinary acceleration figures, yet lower top speed when compared to the Neo 1.3. Would you be able to tell us how many RPM is the engine doing when travelling at 110km/h in 5th gear? This is of great influence to your highway cruising comfort and economy.
Judging from the Aichi product line-up, the Saga’s M/T unit would be a modified F30A unit also found in the Nissan AD Van and Almera. And interestingly, it would have an aluminium housing. That probably explains why the manual Saga is a good 20+ kg lighter than the A/T Saga. Can anyone confirm the gearbox code at the showroom?
(Source: http://www.aichikikai.co.jp/english/mission.html)
Also, interestingly, all of Aichi’s FR layout gearboxes are listed to use the “Remote” control method. It would seem like the gear selection and switching is done electronically? Perhaps that would explain why the gearshift feeling is rather poor. Or does it just mean it’s connected remotely by a cable? I don’t know much about this, so maybe someone can share their knowledge of gearboxes.
For me, a gearbox makes or breaks a drivetrain. A good gearbox is able to hide an engine’s weaknesses, while a bad gearbox can make a good engine drive poorly. Plus long-term (~10 years) gearbox reliability is more difficult to maintain compared to engine, especially with A/T units.
went to a showroom earlier…i was just observing the people who came to check out proton’s new baby…had a good time watching malaysians making sure they get the best out of their money…i have a video of people doing all sort of weird test to see if the car is up to the mark but its not right posting for everyone to view
first i saw a who put his face flat on the floor to check underneath the car.the he woke up with a big smile on his face..i wonder why??
then another lady was opening the fuel cap and thightening it a few times..maybe she had bad experience opening it or thightening it in her previous car.
i sat inside the car simply to see what the rest of the people doing..i was shock to see the middle aircond knob was missing because 20 min ago i saw it and twist it…wonder who has taken it out to send to a lab to see if the material worth to fit in a rm 39000 car..
an old man was checking out the head unit then after a few min he came back with the keys and on the player..he was tuning in to some chinese station the to light and easy and finally was satisfied i guess so he pressed the horn..everyone in the showroom looked at him but he was a happy man…maybe he has some frequency problem in his previous head unit..and a horn failure..or maybe he has a hearing problem…
and another young boy came in and started the car..and the salesman asked him not to and took the keys away..the boy then called his dad to point out the aircond vent and twisting it in all sort of position..by watching him do that..i can assure everyone here..the aircond vents are at the highest quality and most durable part in the entire car..
i was sitting the back seat and da rear door was open..a guy was standing beside waiting for me to get down..i didnt for a long time so he asked me if its comfortable..i said not as confortable as vios(simply said that to see what he will say in return) and he said biasalah..proton mah..ini getah pun takde baik..sudah koyak worrr….pointing to the rubber seals around the door..wonder who tested the strength of the rubber….
then i came out of the car and talking to salesman pointing out the rubber and told him bout the aircond knob..he said he saw a guy pulling out the rubber around the doors to check..maybe its his work..wonder why he did that…can anyone guess??maybe he tought proton just welded the rear portion of the car starting from the door like kereta potong…
then the salesman pointed out at front door..someone hit it so hard till its dented…
i just pity those showroom cars…is it proton that goes through this kind of torture of or every other cars???
anyway i am unhappy with proton because the did so many effort designing the car to match the industry’s quality level..but they didnt not rectify a small problem which the carry forward from the savvy….THE GLOVE BOX STILL HAVE THE SAME GAP ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF IT WHEN ITS CLOSED…
otherwise the interior will not have any fault and some stupid australian wont be able to bash proton saga as how he bashed proton savvy..
its our pride and joy…mistakes has to be corrected…lucky bigfish didnt not notice this…hahaha…
Handling, I think the Neo will be much better,but this is a family sedan so I think it’s good enough, the rear windows is not big problem , I will book one as a company car..
yeay.. i’m happy to see the new car..
1. petang tadi on the way balik kerja aku gi tgk proton BLM dari subang sampai klang aku singgah each protonnya car centre. Hmm so aku leh compare laa mana warna aku nak amik just missed no blue color kat proton centre. Anyway aku dah decided nak amik myvi SE coz saving and monthly dalam rm 550 laa.. untuk 9 thn. But aku tgk petang tadi keputusan aku sama sekali berubah termasuklah tunang aku dan aku sekali decided nak amik keta nie. hahaha. kesimpulan nya aku puas hati la dgn kualiti just belum pakai lagi laa so tak tau qualitynya. Sebelom nie aku mmg anti proton but aku tak buta buta anti proton camtu aje coz i always atas pagarnya org hahaha…
dari segi design body hmm aku tgk kat internet dari pandangan sisi left and right nampak funny betulll!!! dalam internet aku tgk mcm lonjong semacam jer mabye picture tu kena stretch kot. but tgk depan mata look nice… hahaha aku suka. then body dia wah tegap jugak banyak kali gak aku sandar body aku kat pitu SEKUAT ATI aku baru la dia nak melekuk wah takla mcm tin milo pon… keras jugak hmm dari segi color aku sentiasa fuzzy yerla coz keja pon graphic desinger&IT department sure laa.. aku try imagine each color with gold rim 16″ haha yang paling kena bagi kesukaan aku ialah “granite gray†huuhuhu sebab aku nakkan other black color tu nampak mcm doornya slide tu menyerlah so aku dah decided granite gray yess!!! Tunang aku pon terus setuju bila tgk secara keseluruhannya yehaaa!!!.
dalaman well simple aku katakan just nice banyak plastic mold laa but u can’t compare dashboard untuk kereta yg 50-60K above laa.. tapi nice ruang besarr ma aku tunggi 170CM, 65KG but bila aku lunjurkan kaki wah lurus terus takder tersekat sekat and rasa selesa lah… even bukak tempat simpan barang kat front passenger seat tu pon tak tersangkut kaki aku hmm and bumbung dari kepala jauh jugak dalam 20 cm gak la jauhnya…
So aku angkat M-line MT 37,498.00. amik tujuh tahun still dapat rm490 kalo bayar 4500 hahaha actually tu duit for myvi sepatut nya now aku dah decided nak amik BLM hahahaa… minyak pon jimat gak la diaorGGG kKATAA dlm 12-13cent 1Km hmm kena bawak jugak baru tahu.. dari segi part radio dia aku cukup suka coz cukup senang nak cabut and tukar clarion yg ada tv tu wahhh.. kerusi dia hmm looks like waja but bit better la selesa untuk M-line. air bag just for driver hmmm napa tak buat 2 airbag terus pelik jugak.
Kerusi belakang tak boleh lipat lipat mcm persona, myvi but BLM mmg terus melekat hmm aku tak setuju napa dia buat camtu and pintu belakang pon mirrornya manual bukan auto. wah napa tak buat auto aduhh but when thinking back hmm sure price jadi dalam 43K kot if they added each doors power window and passenger sit can flip like myvi hmm coz proton nak target below 40k. Bonet puas hati memang muat cukup cukup nak masukkan 2 orang hostage haha. Belakangnya design cun mcm mercedes haha. cuma aku tak pasti ADA ABS tak???? hmm. terlupa lak nak tanya..
Anyway after compared with MYVI SE aku puas hati with the design & price affordable to buy with my salary 3.4K hmm. so kena la tunggu dalam 2 bulan worse case scenario 4 bulan
tapi takper aku tak kisah rumah aku ngan office 5min jalan kaki jer hahahaa.
“The switches, knobs and dials are all placed in intuitive positions. My only issue with the interior is not something major. It’s just that Proton does not seem to have a standard Human Interface Design template for their interiors. A little button with a dot on it activates the central locking system in the Proton Persona, but the same button in the Proton Saga is used to deactivate the alarm system! The same design, but different meanings in different cars. This will have to change in the next generation of cars.”
Proton should spend more time working on this area. It will be cheaper too instead of making lots of different dash boards.
It looks like the savvy with a boot, so I am thinking the clock is at the Odometer right? Is that correct Paul?
Can the Clarion Radio display a clock. It is annoying sometimes how people have to look over your shoulder to see what time is it.
Second question is the fuel meter:
If it uses the same annoying handphone bars like the savvy, then it must come with a fuel indicator which is not that accurate right? The short fuel indicator in the savvy’s fuel tank makes the car fuel a bit annoying. You can never get the car to have a full tank on the indicator (and even if you did) it will last like 10/20Km before the indicator goes down a bar. Then for some reason the fuel can stay at the lowest bar only to increase in height. I am not sure if you manage to mark the fuel indicator of the car on the test drive.
I did a quick look this proton’s new baby in Seri Kembangan showroom. Overall the exterior looks fine with me. nice and a bit sporty. Interior – personally, I hate vios rear seats. It is stiff n I had to bend my neck to avoid my head ‘kena’ the roof. Some more, aircond distribution in vios is worst. I sweat when I have to sit behind the car.
So how do I compare this car to vios. Apart from the c.c., I have better legroom and headroom at the back seat. Even I feel the breeze of the aircond rather than vios. This is a car for family.
But sadly, now most of the modern cars use timing chain, this baby use timing belt. Hmm, I hope Waja Replacement / Perdana Replacement will use it. Much benefits from using timing chain.
Then we have to wait about 2-3 months to hear any rising problem. Bottom line is, I like this car. Affordable, and value-for-money. Now Myvi has to compete with this new Saga whois the ‘jaguh kampung’ on the road.
hi again…
i can’t argue regarding the new perdana cause what i was told that the car is a total new design… not a facelifted version. it is not based on eterna and has a continental design. that was what i was informed. maybe this was done more secretly to surprise proton competitors.. who knows? and i’m sure he wasn’t talking about the gen.2 FL… anyway… lets wait until march to see it… it’s only 2 months away… be patient all protonians… and bashers… :)
dang it! my Waja still have another 27 months to settle ..! if not I can start saving money early for the upcoming Proton MPV..! not much info from the PE salespeople when i asked about the MPV, but they are quite sure that the P1 is going to release that the latest by Jan’09. The price range…? well he just told me to expect it to be around the current NZ Citra’s price with better build quality of course. I can’t confirm on that though, but hopefully we can get a good 7-seaters at half the price of H-Stream or T-Wish!
Well if not because i’m thinking of getting an MPV i might have booked one of those Metallic Silver M-Line AT New SAGA..! This latest baby is sooooooo cute! (and mind you all I love the tight gaps between the baby panels)
Honestly, the car doesn’t look like a sub-RM40K car. It is , in my opinion, at least on the look department, and the exterior finishes, comparable to those RM65K ++ korean made compact family sedan.
: peace :
it seems the only car that resembles it is the Dacia Logan, lets hope some foreign press will bother to cover their comparison test in the future…
Suddenly, people can accept Proton as their dream car again. including me.
This will be a good journey for proton.
For Proton, just take care of your quality. I’s a key.
You made it for Persona last time, and i hope you can made it again and again for this cutie model. InsyaAllah..
After this, what model huh? Tak sabar nak tunggu mpv.
Well! Better than before. But….still got no rear power window. Kena pusing lagi.
Malaysians going into a showroom and ripping a car a part seems so comical! COMEDY! COMEDY! But remember the 1980s ad for Proton Saga where the three heavy men go into a showroom, pull the tyres, check the Saga and then give it their approval? Life imitates TV commercials these days!! Hahahaha!
Yes, it is cute and decent enough. A baby Waja from an angle. So, the WKC 151 Black SAGA is actually David Arumugam’s SAGA. :-) Terima Kasih!! Nice ad by Proton + the Angkasawan’s silver SAGA’s ad too. The monochrome Proton’s logo look nice actually. The N-Line wheel cap have resemblance to VIVA’s 850 one. Proton will make it with this model, but please don’t forget when people actually avoiding Proton in few years back time. Jadikan panduan.
Looking good, for the price, minor things like window not winding down all the way are A-OK… only thing for me is the small looking boot compartment. Poor design decision I guess.
Can’t wait for the coming models!!!
Good job Paul.
Anyway, could u show us about the signal & wiper handle position at the steering column? is it the signal switch handle located at the right side or vice versa at the steering column? Thanks Paul.
Already checked the car. I just can say..im quite impress. But then..i’ll be waiting till next year before i buy this car..after 1st batch for sure. But the again, there are so much more from proton to offer this year. Newer version & facelifted for existing model..can’t wait for the surprise! :)
Proton do the right thing ~ this everyone affort to buy it !! this time no more milo tin … can see the crash test really no hit driver site & passenger site ~ ppl now will look for new saga no more P2 …. really can’t wait to test drive it ~ c the auto / manual coz plan to replace my old wira 3peed AT … now P2 should have a meeting to adjust the price lo … if not can’t sell well this year … P1 support u back … coz i also driving P1 now … this saga come out for hack down viva ?? the persona vs Myvi ?? so Savvy make a new price to VS kancil kelisa & 660 Viva … P2 no way …
Good try, not a bad looking car (Like the Accent)
Rear window not a big deal, as quite a lot of cars wont wind the rears down fully. Its a design issue for cars with a single sheet of glass.
I view not having rear power windows (perhaps maybe higher trim lvls will have them?) is a safety issue since there is no way to lock out the window from kids in the back seat (powered window versions should have a lock out from the driver controls).
Gear shifter of the manual is a bit of a dissapointment, after the rather nice ones on the Gen2.
Interior still looks too plasticky, furthering the same impression of cheapness (being the base range, perhaps this is forgivable).
I still feel that the car seems to be a deal because of the unfair market practices of taxing other marques too sky high. My respect will only go to proton when the artificial barriers are removed.
Not in the market for one though. I still hold the opinion that 35k still buys a much better 2nd hand car now that 2nd hand market is so depressed. Of course I understand its much harder to get a loan than a new car.
I went to the showroom yesterday to check out on this baby. Very impressive. Just what you would expect from a base model: nice design & practical.
But they should stop claiming this as THE ‘affordable’ car. It is cheap because all other cars are made to look expensive by NAP. If there is no NAP, then most cars will become “affordable”.
BigFish said,
January 18, 2008 @ 10:01 pm
———————————————————-
wow, after considering the flaw that you pointed out, i think this car really suck now, cause the back window cant be winded down completely
chanel said,
January 19, 2008 @ 1:56 am
———————————————————-
The rear window is purposely made not to wind down completely as for safety issue. Even BMW have this, this is not production flaws, grey imports of BMW don’t have this if you notice…..
=========================
I guess the rear door curve led to the window cannot wind down completely… this is normal for a small wheelbase B-segment car.. even my small Polo as well!
Tahniah Proton and Paul. I don’t care what others said… I like this car. All this for under 40K.
Let’s stop with the power window issue… my sister used to own a 3 series BMW. There’s power window problem, rpm sensor problem, air cond problem. My 5 year old wira 1.3 aeroback got 232 000kmon it … no problem at all. Just do the normal service every 10000km. Just change the battery last year (after 4 years). Timing belt every 100000 km. My friend’s spectra already got problem with ignition system after 6 month.
There’s no perfect car in this world. It’s just that nearly everybody got one or know someone that owns a proton. Any little problem that occurs we know about it and assume that all protons are defective. There are a lot more of good protons out there than the bad one.
It’s the same with other cars too. So, think before you bash. Don’t just bash for the sake of bashing. It just make you look like a fool.
Always remember that whatever car you own…. it’s your car and take very good care of it.
the car so cute…
put the spoiler then it look more aggressive… huhuu
overall..Good…just have to wait and see customer feedback..!..great bargain from P1..P2 have to revise their price list if they want to compete..But still prefer my Myvi lorrr….:)
Bye bye perodua
ppl oredi tired ur dvvt, toyota QC gimmick..
prrrfthhh
Remote shifting? I believe it means not directly into gearbox, e.g. for Mini, the 850’s had a long wand going into the trans case, but the later Coopers, etc. had a so-called ‘remote’ shifter meaning it just has some rods going to a ‘remote’ location farther back towards the drivers natural hand/arm position. Maybe this is what they mean? Remote could possibly mean rod or cable linkage but I don’t believe it’s specific to either one. Just my 2 sen.
paul,
any idea if they will come out with a high-line? with rear power windows, passenger air-bag and ABS/EBD?
for sub 40K is worth it for me, back window 2/3 unwide would be because safety + cost issue. i would acctept 2/3 wind at the back if there is no window lock (power window) as you cant control what the kids do at the back. my 4 years kelisa got the same thing also, 2/3 wind but still have big gap (can still fit head out) .. sometimes have to regularly watch if they are playing with the window. bad safety feature.
again.. FOR SUB 40K its worth it.
They might be Proton Saga with NGV around 4 th quarter of this year. Source taken from engineers inside proton .
Cudnt resist stopping by P1 showroom on d way to work tis morning (had actually planned to go to mutiara’s tmrw).. had solid white B-line.. cudnt resist the knocking and shutting the doors (why no feedback from BigFish on tat hah) and no more milo tin impression anymore! wat awed me d most is the interior! gosh the legroom & headroom – only one word – unbelievable! and paul, i feel 3 adults (or 4 slim ones!) can fit in really comfortably on back seats ;) and the seats are very comfortable indeed, the back seats more slanting position, better than persona…
Then one very funny thing happen, i looked at the side mirrors and found no knobs inside to adjust ’em (like wat my manual wira has) and no (electric) buttons either (like wat my auto megavalve saga has) so enquired the SA. He said “ini B-line, ada ada, dekat dash depan” I said “tak nampak pun” then he came out from the showroom and went inside the car looking for it (hehe) then i said “memang tak ada ke, macam kancil adjust manually di luar ke” then the SA replied “ahhh ambil N-line, ini B-line”.. like tat oso can!
hahaha…. toy car…. macam kotak saja….
All positive feedback, Congratulation Proton.. New Saga will set new benchmark.
Congratulation to PROTON !
Well done, PAUL !
Really…such a great gift to the nations to celebrate 50th years of Independence !
Hey, MALAYSIAN…its a NATION CAR!
MALAYSIA BOLEH !!! yeah…
I like it, I love it …
only dashboard not so nice
Smallfish said,
January 18, 2008 @ 10:52 pm
Wah, based on comparison with Car V and Car M, this new SAGA definately the best for money. Pity to those who already own V and M, ya. Not only that, the price is also cheaper.
==subjective…some people do like hatchback/stationwagon other than sedan. Car V consider expensive i think.
how is the booking numbers by today?
congratulations another new car from proton. somehow, in my opinion, if i were have rm50k, would go for myvi. if i were have rm40k, would go for this new saga.
Paul, thanks for the test drive results to us. Somehow, i hope that u can make a comparison with myvi too, about specifications, rides, pricings. what is the differences especially of pricing if both are sedans with same specifications? i hope that it can be done so that lot of us won’t say P1 or P2 like enemies…
Smallfish said,
January 18, 2008 @ 10:52 pm
Wah, based on comparison with Car V and Car M, this new SAGA definately the best for money. Pity to those who already own V and M, ya. Not only that, the price is also cheaper.
————————————————————
to compare the price of this new saga with myvi, i think saga has better value for money. but hey, if u compare it with viva or that ridiculously priced sutera (forza), it wins hands down, literally..
razzack04 said,
January 19, 2008 @ 9:00 am
==agree with u. this new saga is nice.
tec96248 said,
January 19, 2008 @ 10:39 am
Smallfish said,
January 18, 2008 @ 10:52 pm
Wah, based on comparison with Car V and Car M, this new SAGA definately the best for money. Pity to those who already own V and M, ya. Not only that, the price is also cheaper.
==================
yeah pity to V and M owners.. esp for those who bought V and M car becoz of ‘QUALITY” factor kununnnn..
one of my friend admitted that V is overpriced but he said he paid for Quality..
yet the quality below his expectation
prrrfthhh pity him
i have some question regard to the manual transmittion…
anyone knows the gear ratio of the aichi kikai MF30A??
is the MF30A = F30A??
because from my survey from internet, F30A is old nissan sunny (b11)’s manual gear box…
sportypickles said,
January 19, 2008 @ 10:42 am
how is the booking numbers by today?
——————————————
i believe after lauching the saga yesterday, the booking will be OVER NINE THOUUSANDD!!!
i love this car..everything is nice..and cheap too..and more important is it is national car..i give 7.5/10
topgunthang said,
January 19, 2008 @ 12:54 am
how does it compare with the swift, vios/yaris and jazz?
thats its competitors in overseas markets. and maybe when afta kicks in since proton is so successful now.
_____________________________________________________
Their image has improved, but they arent really that successful yet. We’ll have to wait for the rest of their 08 lineup to tell.
IMHO, this new Saga does have the potential to compete head on with the swift sedan, vios and city (the jazz is a hatchback. a different class of car).
A few things would have to be improved:
1) It is currently too cheap. A luxury Saga variant should be priced around RM50-60k. The vios/city/swift all cost about RM60k with AFTA. The tax-free price in langkawi for the cheapest trim vios is RM55k. AFTA specifies a 5% tax rate.
2) ABS + EBD + 7 airbags standard.
3) Fine details such as a leather trimmed steering wheel and gearknob. Parts that users touch often. Better upholstery like the flagship Mazda2 genki (i really really like the upholstery of the mazda2 genki. hands down the most comfortable i’ve ever felt in it’s class).
4) 1.6 CPS/VIM engine.
5) Mated to a 4speed auto like the vios. A full fledged CVT would make it a vios killer if it also had specs #1 to #4.
The question is, could proton add all of the above for about RM20k?
correct me if i’m wrong..
just wondering if those pics are post-crash pics or ‘crashing’ pics?
seems strong if its post-crash!
well.. we dont know what the crash test dummies said yet!
*i’m just another proton surporter who feels proud when SAGA is launched. just curious bout the crash test pics!
I wanna thank Paul and BigFish for their information and findings about the car. BigFish, kindly updating us…er…no…just me with your findings from “the other side point of view” so that Paul can clear it up. I need to know what’s the bad of this car. And don’t worry about the good, there are hundreds of them here…be it superficial or substantial.
Oh, penYu… you are back. What’s up bro? This must be you proud moment. Enjoy ya…:-)
who cares..i just love this car
Just realized Paul actually driven this car 2 days ago and have to hold on to his press preview picutres until 5.30pm yesterday. The picture of the covered Saga is the similar to the one with the MD standing beside it. Anyway, its irrelevant.
Saga cant be compare to MyVi or Viva as P2 have over and over again proven quality is high on their priority list, have anyone complained about QC issues on Viva thus far? I do have to agree its an over price car. But so is every Kancil and Kelisa owner who sleep soundly at night knowing that they wont have to wake up to a failing car in the morning.
I have wanted a Gen-2, then the Neo, thought about the Pesona but instead kept my Kancil until now.
The saga is intead a decent car for the price. You can forsee in will fill the roads in time to come.
My hope is they take their time to deliver the orders instead of rushing the production to cash in and suffer what previous CEO did when the he launch the Gen2.
One other thing, Im currently in Kuching, so as you all know it will cost 2k more for any CKD or national car here. Thats acceptable as the road-tax and insurance here are slightly lower. But when I ask the sales man near Jalan Haji Taha showroom of the delivery date, he have the guts to tell me if you place your booking w/o colour preference you get in 2-4months, if you insist on a particular colour, the waiting period is 6months.
Can some one tell this to the MD of Proton and kindly ask him if this is an acceptable practice in terms or consumerism and customer service?
After all the hype is over, lets look at the practical point of view, for those who are buying this for their children for college, parents for giant shopping or maid to go to the market, fine choice.
But for those who are using this to sustain a income kindly consider these points:
1. Fuel hike is a certain after election. Please look at your budget
2. Once fuel goes up, it will be a ripple effect on you whole expences
3. Hidden cost of servicing, maintainance, insurance, road-tax, spare parts
4. Its a 40k car, you expect a Proton to last 9years in KL driving condition?
5. How much time you spend in maintaining your car?
I’m not a basher, I’ll seriously consider the Saga when I’m back in KL. But even at my income which is more than enough to buy a Vios or City, I’ll still take a look at the used car market and see what 40k can fetch me. Perhaps an old Corolla that will give me the good sleep for another 10 years?
I have a friend who drives a 20plus years Corona, the last model before it was axe in the local market, its running and have lower maintainance cost and better mileage than a Wira Aeroback.
Hold your RM500 booking fee and think about it for a moment. Think! But ultimately, choice and preferrence is individual.
@BigFish
The salesgirl panicked, eh? She must be new n unfamiliar yet wit the car, heheh.
But she is telling the truth. Rear windows on most cars today can no longer wind down fully, 1/2 is usually the most, like the Waja. Reason is cuz children CAN accidentally climb out, so the best way is to prevent it from happening by limiting how much the window can wind down. Toyota, Honda, BMW, Merc, Ford, Fiat, Hyundai, Kia, you name it. They all do that to the rear windows of their new models. Though I can’t be sure for China cars…..last time I heard got Chery score 1 star safety rating, so such feature like this is probably unheard to them. Say no to China cars. Muahahahahaha……..
Though I must say, oni able to open 1/3 is small…..oh well, if bigger, I wonder if someone’s gonna blabber wat I typed n then bash Proton for being unsafe aside from nt giving twin airbags n ABS. yareyare…….
oops not a cabin width of a wira, i agree its a small car, but new saga feel ‘releive’ ,
sis book E line,
Ops, I mean open 2/3 (instead of 1/2) at most, as well as this Saga!! Paul, I thought you know about this fact? If u want to, you could’ve snapped photos from the co-driver seat.
johanbey said,
January 19, 2008 @ 12:14 pm
Saga cant be compare to MyVi or Viva as P2 have over and over again proven quality is high on their priority list, have anyone complained about QC issues on Viva thus far? I do have to agree its an over price car. But so is every Kancil and Kelisa owner who sleep soundly at night knowing that they wont have to wake up to a failing car in the morning.
========================
haha i believe u dont own perodua cars and ur statment just based on ur assumption.. pls visit viva or myvi forum.. then u will know
How abt if
Perodua VIVA = RM27,447.50 – RM43,228.40
Perodua MYVI = RM33,277.70 – RM42,822.20
since new proton saga is exempted frm excise duty n sales tax…
nocrid said,
January 19, 2008 @ 12:05 pm
Oh, penYu… you are back. What’s up bro? This must be you proud moment. Enjoy ya…:-)
=================
i realiesed, proton is doing a right thing since savvy time..but at time most ppl still sombong and dont want to admit..
finally.. now so many ex basher become supporter
rgds
Ex proton basher since 1985~2005
@johanbey
You gotta understand that cars are painted with a limited number of units per badge. If you miss a batch, you might have to wait the next batch. Usually, the unpopular colours will hv faster waiting period. That’s why if u specify a (it will usually be the popular one) color, the waiting’ll be longer, but if u don’t, they can give you the unpopular color faster.
Or something like that. Bah, hope u can understand my rough explaination.
You consider urself NOT a basher, but making RM40k for what the M-line could offer sound overly expensive. And proceed to doubt its durability for 9 years?
So the spare parts will get expensive, what makes other car manufacturers don’t? Some come from Europe, Japan, overseas generally, you think the ships to bring it here run on winds? The truck to carry from port to service centre run on electric?
Dear Johan…
about viva..
Did you already browse viva owner forums..if not, better you reserve your observation or rather perception
about waiting time…
why not you goodself send an email to P1 MD.
Johanbey said..
Saga cant be compare to MyVi or Viva as P2 have over and over again proven quality is high on their priority list, have anyone complained about QC issues on Viva thus far? I do have to agree its an over price car. But so is every Kancil and Kelisa owner who sleep soundly at night knowing that they wont have to wake up to a failing car in the morning.
One other thing, Im currently in Kuching, so as you all know it will cost 2k more for any CKD or national car here. Thats acceptable as the road-tax and insurance here are slightly lower. But when I ask the sales man near Jalan Haji Taha showroom of the delivery date, he have the guts to tell me if you place your booking w/o colour preference you get in 2-4months, if you insist on a particular colour, the waiting period is 6months.
Can some one tell this to the MD of Proton and kindly ask him if this is an acceptable practice in terms or consumerism and customer service?
From where you got the info saying that this new SAGA is exempted from excise duty and sales tax..???
If you dont have valid info..just dont post it….GROW UP
NZFE said..
How abt if
Perodua VIVA = RM27,447.50 – RM43,228.40
Perodua MYVI = RM33,277.70 – RM42,822.20
since new proton saga is exempted frm excise duty n sales tax…
http://images.paultan.org/images/proton-blm/Proton_BLM_Tentative_Pricelist_Large.jpg
___________________________________________________________________________
did u notice the sales tax n excise duty is zero…
peYno said,
January 19, 2008 @ 11:20 am
yeah pity to V and M owners.. esp for those who bought V and M car becoz of ‘QUALITY†factor kununnnn..
one of my friend admitted that V is overpriced but he said he paid for Quality..
yet the quality below his expectation
prrrfthhh pity him
==i don’t agree with u totally. i might feel sad if i buy a viva bcos it is overprice and somemore only 1.0 compared to the saga 1.3. but i will feel satisfy if i buy myvi bcos it has all the things i wanted for 1.3. anyway, both viva and myvi are hatchback. should be compared to savvy is more appropriate.
I see it frm a price list. Did u notice sales tax n excise duty is zero!!!!
tokmoh said,
January 19, 2008 @ 12:23 pm
Ops, I mean open 2/3 (instead of 1/2) at most, as well as this Saga!! Paul, I thought you know about this fact? If u want to, you could’ve snapped photos from the co-driver seat.
Hang on ,where did my post go? I’m +ve I wrote this to correct THIS post:
@BigFish
The salesgirl panicked, eh? She must be new n unfamiliar yet wit the car, heheh.
But she is telling the truth. Rear windows on most cars today can no longer wind down fully, 1/2 is usually the most, like the Waja. Reason is cuz children CAN accidentally climb out, so the best way is to prevent it from happening by limiting how much the window can wind down. Toyota, Honda, BMW, Merc, Ford, Fiat, Hyundai, Kia, you name it. They all do that to the rear windows of their new models. Though I can’t be sure for China cars…..last time I heard got Chery score 1 star safety rating, so such feature like this is probably unheard to them. Say no to China cars. Muahahahahaha……..
Though I must say, oni able to open 1/3 is small…..oh well, if bigger, I wonder if someone’s gonna blabber wat I typed n then bash Proton for being unsafe aside from nt giving twin airbags n ABS. yareyare…….
blunt…
Is there a necessity to be so harsh on others? To err is human you know. You could’ve just corrected the misinformed gently.
Rgds
just now before lunch, i and my colleage went to see this car again and also comparing with the persona, the bigger sibling. my colleage, a fellow that’s really like to test drive every new car if possible…..
both of us feel much more comfortable in the saga compared to persona. the seats are softer in saga that make us feel like sitting on plastic chair inside the persona. we found that the dashboard are more ergonomical, appealing, acceptable than persona except the steering and gearshift lever. interms of interior space we couldn’t feel much differences. but this saga feel more comfortable then the previous model vios, either front or rear seats. the rear windows is a sad point that not powered. so it is better open 2/3 for child safety reasons, which others did apply also. interms exterior looks, similar to those early 90’s, so nothing to shout about but it may hv the lasting look over the persona. M-Line is a better buy because some of the things which is useful are not found in B-Line and N-Line. we prefered this saga to persona.
We believe that it might not affect much to the viva or myvi, bcos they hv their own market. This saga will definitely attract lots of buyers, both of us are the potential buyers. hmm……benefitted the consumers.
Proton truly deserves a pat in the back or maybe even a hug for this kind of model. A simple, practical,yet functional car which does not even lose out on style cues and most importantly an affordable car for the people. SYABAS PROTON !!
To kingbrutal. I don’t think the Proton guy gave you the right info. Perdana and MPV this year. Syed Zainal already said MPV next year (targeted on January 2009) and Perdana might be also next year too. For now, Waja CPS and Gen2 CPS will be next.
To LittleFire85 said, I don’t think you really understand the crash test and the safety feature behind cars. Have you ever see any car in the crash test only have bumper damage or less than half into the engine bay? You are asking will the engine stuff went inside the cabin? The engine bay and rear boot space is actually where the CRUMBLE ZONE are. Space where the car structure will deform to absorb the energy of the crashing. The occupants safety cabin zone are where the A Pillar to C Pillar all around (just like a box or cage shape) located!! That’s why you can see those yellow mark impact bars located including those located at the dashboard areas and lots more others – shown in stage by stage demo teaser that day – Paul’s blog.
Flaw for rear windows just because can not wind down completely and only 2/3 of it? Is that what you mean? Many cars built like that as its a safety features.
guys.. went into proton edar web site…
http://www.proton-edar.com.my/index.php?page=newsaga
the picture of manual shifter in the website somehow is rather short and sportier than da real thing.
Any comments proton officials?
Unicnons & other readers, there will be NO Perdana replacement for the time being. From a reliable insider source, DSZ has dropped the plan after realizing that the cost of rebadging the perdana from the Mitsu A380 is still expensive (manufacturing, sourcing, tooling, configuration etc). But can confirm u that an MPV and Waja replacement is on the way (2009 & 2010 respectively).
The Proton Savvy will be Export-Only model (thai, china), and cease to be sold locally, since its market position has already been replaced by the new Saga. Despite that, its parts will remain under production for the servicing of the existing ones.
Hopefully, DSZ kept his promise that Proton will keep their product cycle for not more than 7 years.
==================
The Unicons said,
January 19, 2008 @ 3:01 pm
To kingbrutal. I don’t think the Proton guy gave you the right info. Perdana and MPV this year. Syed Zainal already said MPV next year (targeted on January 2009) and Perdana might be also next year too. For now, Waja CPS and Gen2 CPS will be next.
Great job Proton. Enough for the compliments, next step:
1. Lengthen Waja’s platform and give us a low slung 7 seater at 65k. (i.e Wish)
2. Destroy Perdana – We don’t need a replacement.
Dear Johanbey…..
I don’t know what people are driving in kuching.. but in semenanjung there are a lot of proton over 9 years old. some even first generation SAGA & WIRA. About the waiting period…. come on lah, you’ll face this with all car manufacturer. If you don’t want to wait just buy an old model that nobody wants. That’s the only one without waiting period. Let me explain, car manufacturer have target or production plan based on plant capacity, manpower etc which they agree with their supplier or vendors. Let’s say 3000 per month. So, if 9000 people book the car.. you’ll have to wait at least 3 months. If 36000 people order the car.. they have production full for a year. If the just suka hati produce 10000 cars a month, in 4 month they’ll complete their order. What to do the other 8 months???
normaluser said,
January 19, 2008 @ 3:17 pm
Unicnons & other readers, there will be NO Perdana replacement for the time being. From a reliable insider source, DSZ has dropped the plan after realizing that the cost of rebadging the perdana from the Mitsu A380 is still expensive (manufacturing, sourcing, tooling, configuration etc). But can confirm u that an MPV and Waja replacement is on the way (2009 & 2010 respectively).
The Proton Savvy will be Export-Only model (thai, china), and cease to be sold locally, since its market position has already been replaced by the new Saga. Despite that, its parts will remain under production for the servicing of the existing ones.
Hopefully, DSZ kept his promise that Proton will keep their product cycle for not more than 7 years.
==================
yap this is correct Bigger Waja will replaced perdana after the FL Waja phased out.
2nd time again in the showroom…hearded that this Saga is with 16 valve & twin cam engine…which make it more power while in auto car…how true is that?
Paultan,
Any picture of the old SAGA next to the new one?
johanbey,
i dont agree with u.my old saga 1989 still in good condition and i can traveling fr kb to kl w/out any problem.today my sis in law want to sell her viva (baru 4 bln bli) with this saga.she not satify with her viva.not power but overprice….
i thought most cars can only wind down just like that for the rear windows?
rear window just stop there because its a non A pillar design (and the look rather clean), so theres limitation rolling to roll all the way, but in return the window apature open wider,
and to some extent, it prevent kids from doing the no no,
sis book it the E …budget ,with 2 children,
Joe Ooi ,she need the car, well the cars not bad,
i just came back from the showroom..damn it was so crowded.. n i met my cousin book for the M-line..
love the rear sit very much compare to Persona rear sit..
hope to get 1 of these since it is tradisionally running in my family blood to own a SAGA..
hope to see more lovely car from u Proton.
The gearstick doesn’t look that tall in the official picture from proton edar website:
http://www.proton-edar.com.my/index.php?page=newsaga
under interior
as compared to the one you posted on this site:
http://images.paultan.org/images/Proton_Saga/New_Proton_Saga_10.jpg
http://images.paultan.org/images/Proton_Saga/New_Proton_Saga_30.jpg
Which one is the real production gearstick since the saga in the showroom that I went to yesterday was an automatic M line model.
Look good but the new saga look a lot like Chevrolet Aveo. E.g. from the side, dashboard, front bonnet & tail lights. A copy?
Proton still pay for sales tax and excise duty. but they dont put at their pricelist anymore maybe for strategic marketing purpose.
#
Wilfred said,
January 19, 2008 @ 3:58 pm
2nd time again in the showroom…hearded that this Saga is with 16 valve & twin cam engine…which make it more power while in auto car…how true is that?
——————————————————————-
It is true..
So many people in the show room, just like pesta. Parking also difficult to find.
So, the expectation will be so many orders for this new car within this weekend, and then what will happen? Yes, you have to wait 5 ~ 6 months to get your car. So hurry-up. Wa sudah kena last time when ordering Persona.
Nearly 4 months to wait, eventhough I ordered it within 4 days after launching.
So, for this one, I guess many people will buy, based on observation at show room today.
Regarding the car interior I just like to comment on the door lock knob. Look very cheap design – like a plastic pensil and difficult to pull either.
Others are very well design.
Body looks strong too, not like old SAGA when if you press the zink a little, you can feel it to sunk down. This one is quite strong, maybe double thickness of zink plate.
However, I don’t really like torsion beam design for rear suspension becasue it kinda unconfortable when driving over the bump and holes on the road.
Cheers!
Hi guys. I just came back from booking an M-Line M/T unit. I noticed the auto gearbox is listed as F4A4A. Seems like a Mitsubishi / Hyundai unit. If anybody wants the gear ratios of the M/T unit, I should be able to get a hold of it tonight.
Because tonight the salesman promised me a test-drive. But only got A/T units in the showroom, so no choice, have to drive that one first. I’m still very curious about the F30A tho.
To normaluser and MisterBenjo, well I read it from local newspaper. That’s all. That’s why, in my post I just saying Syed Zainal already said MPV next year (targeted on January 2009) and Perdana might be also next year too. For now, Waja CPS and Gen2 CPS will be next. That’s why for Perdana replacement I did confirm about it.
erm..gonna book one …bt don knw how long i hv to wait…..bcos so many ppl already booked …haih~
Cyberkayu said,
January 19, 2008 @ 12:22 am
wow
very detailed ‘report’ for this blm
front design cue like R34
impressive design
in budget price
kudo proton
Jeremy Clarkson : “Finally there is cheap n cheerful car from Proton..â€
—————————————————————-
I think now Proton proves that things that are cheap doesn’t mean that it’s not cheerful. Happy motoring…
Can’t wait for the R3 variant, this car ROCKS!!!!
Ahh… sorry typing error. “That’s why for Perdana replacement I did confirm about it.” should read as “That’s why for Perdana replacement I DIDN’T confirm about it.”
By the way, thanks Paul for putting more pictures including the crash test. Even though a bit smaller but at least can see.
ingolstadt said,
January 19, 2008 @ 3:20 pm
Great job Proton. Enough for the compliments, next step:
1. Lengthen Waja’s platform and give us a low slung 7 seater at 65k. (i.e Wish)
2. Destroy Perdana – We don’t need a replacement.
—————————————————————-
Destroy Perdana? You got to be kidding, Proton needs to compete with the other auto manufacturers in every segment to ensure its survival. I wouldn’t employ you as the product manager if I were the Chairman or MD.
the unpainted bumper, if well styled, with alloy 13″ 185 65
black wheel arch and its lower side also black a k a stone guard,
carrier, spot light,
woo, a nice soft off roader look,
it’s nice & affortable family car to be own… well done PROTON.
I just came back from the showroom. Compared to viva, the car interior plastics feel cheap and almost the same quality as viva..but obviously this car is more value for money if you’re looking for a sedan. However if you compare the plastics with myvi, this saga really has poor plastics interior compared to myvi…miles in difference..the door latch inside feels cheap…the knob to lock/unlock the doors are horribly painful to press…only consolation is the price and the large boot area. Initially I thought of buying this car (i currently own a myvi) as I’ve seen proton improved steadily…I thought this car would have pretty decent plastics (something like myvi’s interior) after hearing from paul’s review and test drive…but I was disappoitned….but nevertheless, this is a decent car, nothing really to shout about. You should go to the showroom and see this car before passing any judgement because from the pictures shown, the car looks overly spectacular and grand, but when seen in person….you’d have a different opinion entirely.
Proton is going to lauch two or three replacement model this year??read it in star..BIZ NEWS page 3..
then i asked my friend..he said perdana replacement model will be on its way by dec this year…a rebadged version but with proton’s own engine to keep cost down!!!(what engine??)
second is proton waja with campro is going to stop…and its going to be replaced by proton waja cps..price will be around rm 63000 to 73000 and a full facelift is not going to happen because by 2010 or 2011 its going to be replaced and will no longer be 1.6 variant!!
mpv next year..based on waja’s platform(chancellor)..7 seater…its going to look like the new stream and tuned by lotus(for sporty handling)..also proton’s own engine.the final design process has been completed…so we will see spy photo’s very soon…so dun worry guys…
but the question is…what the other replacement model this year???the gen2 is out of the question because we all know its on its way…
SIFU we need you here to answer all our questions!!
dewasemut said,
January 19, 2008 @ 3:06 pm
guys.. went into proton edar web site…
http://www.proton-edar.com.my/index.php?page=newsaga
the picture of manual shifter in the website somehow is rather short and sportier than da real thing.
Any comments proton officials?
___________________________________________________________________________
Pardon as I’m no proton officials. But what I saw in the showroom is exactly as shown in the picture from the proton website. Its not as tall as shown in the picture from this site. Maybe its just a matter of viewing angle?
I think in your specification image, http://images.paultan.org/images/Proton_Saga/New_Proton_Saga_features_Large.jpg
You had accidentally switched the image between B-line and M-line.
Just came from the showroom. The car is decent. I just got hot air. Not like the pictures, the car is damn ugly. the interior is bad. Why would i pay 550 per month for a car that is so lame….
dont know what the fuss is all about!!!
I do find the new Saga reasonable and would certainly go view in the show room soon. Couldn’t expect much since its so cheap. Nearly gotten myself a 2nd hand Savvy if the Saga wasn’t launch.
Looks good; excellent interior space
Very small opening for commendably large boot – pity any cabbie saddled with this Saga
Ultra slim glovebox – why bother if this is best they can do
No lid on ‘air bag’ cubby hole above glove box – Hello thieves and sun
Limited opening of rear windows
QUALITY: All looked OK but front left wing on metallic grey 1.3MT at Proton on Jln Cheras tinkled like a toy tambourine when tapped – all other panels gave satisfying quality thud.
Five year extended warranty sounds brave and potentially expensive move
Pricing OK but main competitors are from Proton themselves – Savvy (dead anyway), Persona and Gen 11. What can they be smoking!
Can’t wait for Perodua response – something will be done about Viva pricing as it’s no showroom runaway either
Did not drive but gear lever certainly less than inspiring with rubbery movement at standstill. Sounds like the rolly-poly ride is pretty grim from Paul’s comments
I’ll say NO first, until I give it a rigid test. ALL Campro cars have failed my rigid test. Can this one survive? We’ll find out on Monday when I conduct a Quality inspection test upon the vehicle. Don’t try to be too smart, Campro @$$#0|_3$!
Add this, add that. Later, come out to nothingness! Learn from Savvy, you final idiotic batches. Savvy is a success with a proper class… though not 100% perfect.
i think jazz is entry level car. but with a premium. so proton needs to compete with it.
the yaris sedan/vios is just a yaris with more comfort and space. mazda 2 looks nice. but i didnt like the genki version. test driving it i felt it does not begin to touch the civic vti especially with the price being 1k aud apart.
fuel consumption is about the same if compared to the civic so its a no brainer. only the neo version is worth buying.
vios should be around the 50k mark in rm so that you right when afta is gone. considering toyota do hold up to aging pretty well. the 10k premium comapred to top line saga is acceptable provided its about 55k rm insteead of a ridiculous 75k rm.
test driving all these entry level cars…the jazz does rule them all i have to admit. even though i dislike jazz alot.
Wilfred said,
January 19, 2008 @ 3:58 pm
2nd time again in the showroom…hearded that this Saga is with 16 valve & twin cam engine…which make it more power while in auto car…how true is that?
———-
>>>Well, that’s…..true in a way. The campro engine does have 16 valve and twin cam, but there are many more factors to determine an engine is powerful or not. FYI, the 1.3 campro in the new saga is more powerful than 1.5 Mitsubishi in older wira n iswara ;) It’s also more powerful than Perodua’s 1.3 Myvi.
@ dr_carz,
There are many people with a harder life than you who would be glad to get what the Saga offer at that price. But of course, someone spoilt like you will never understand.
Hi everyone (point to ponder)…
I wonder how many among us still remember the time in 1985 when the first batch of Proton Saga’s travel across the country to advertise itself. I believe the excitement then, is ALMOST like when we are looking at BLM now. Those days, selling proton cars were much easier than motobikes :)
Thinking of these SUDDENLY it strucks me….
WILL
a) Pre-owned Saga’s (usually bought by 2nd hand dealer) be more expensive than new ones, due to the long waiting list. Just like in the late 80’s and early 90’s
b) Inspite of centralised booking system, customers can buy their way into getting their cars earlier
c) Proton salesman becoming berlagak and “tak kisah” attitude resurfaced. No more politely answering questions etc. Had the experienced (early 90’s) of no one coming to aid inspite of being in the showroom for 10 mins. Senang jual ma… apa susah2 mau layan.
These are just for Proton to ponder… I am in no mean a Proton basher, I had previously owned all proton models except Juara & Savvy. Good luch Proton and thanks Paul.
@normaluser
U SERIOUS KAH SAVVY WILL NO LONGER SELL HERE?!?!?!?! ussoh daro…..
i think i saw Shannon Teoh at Puchong’s showroom today! or am i wrong?
anyway, the design of this Saga looks ok and the space at the front is ample for a tall guy like me. the rear space is just so-so.
Waiting for the High-line to come… (i bet it will!)
Yes, I couldn’t agree more with you, Rizamri. This takape attitude not only will destroy SAs but Proton in general. YES, these new Proton SA which is not used to this overwhelming experience maybe will react negatively toward this ‘phenomenal’ demand after hot Persona.
Please remember, business is about long run instead of short term. This new Saga not without drawback so treat ya prospects nicely like Mercedes’ SAs.
awesome meter panel :-)
overall = NICE !!!!!!
hey.anybody got a pic of that RED saga???
Since it cost less than 40k, is it a bad sign for Persona & Savy? Not to mention those who bought the Merdeka Saga & Viva.
It’s a big impact for Myvi too because it offers 1.3 with a boot.
Great news for students & new white collar workers.
Bad news for car modifiers because the new Saga looks damn decent & lack of killer looks! Compared to Gen2 or Neo, just a simple modification & the car will look great.
Logically speaking, since buyers are aiming a car below 40k, i believe there is no budget to pimp their ride…..!
just nw went to showroom and tried to sit inside the car..it is quite comfortable and the sounds when i closed the car door was quite good…somemore seems like more “heavier” than previous saga…(or bcos of i havent eat for my dinner??) although the rims are 14″ for M-line models..bt it still looks ok…but it will be much better if change to 15″ la…haha…the interior looks is quite simple but got a little bit plastic-feeling..bt still acceptbale la..hope there is no quality problems for the first batch la…
nuzzary said,
January 19, 2008 @ 9:58 am
for sub 40K is worth it for me, back window 2/3 unwide would be because safety + cost issue. i would acctept 2/3 wind at the back if there is no window lock (power window) as you cant control what the kids do at the back.
————–
Just now went to Taman Equine Park Proton showroom opposite Jaya Jusco, ask 2 salesman overthere why the window open 2/3 only. They just replied “tak tau lah”. This show the following scenario: –
1. The Proton salesmen lack of training in term of product knowledge.
2. If it is for kid safety reason, the salesmen should be brief by Proton and they can reply confidently for the 2/3 opening design.
So far, there is no official claim from Proton that the 2/3 opening is for kid safety. And as so far prior to the above matter highlighted by me, no one, be it bashers or defenders mentioned on this safety feature.
The only thing mentioned by Paul related to kid safety feature is “Fitting its purpose as a family car, the new Proton Saga comes with child lock functions for the rear doorsâ€.
If the 2/3 opening rear window is for kid safety design, why Proton bother to put in child lock function? Furthermore, all manufacturers all over the world never claim this is new invention for kid safety features.
nocrid said,
January 19, 2008 @ 12:04 pm
I wanna thank Paul and BigFish for their information and findings about the car. BigFish, kindly updating us…er…no…just me with your findings from “the other side point of view†so that Paul can clear it up.
————
I am now preparing “long air” analysis on one aspect of Saga, I hope Paul don’t censor it! I will be posting once I am satisfied with what I am writing.
Went to COE for lookout and pass by several showrooms in Klang Valley, damn full of ppl grasping their hands on those new sagas..obviously Proton did a good job technically and marketingly and all in all we can say our rakyat anticipate for this for quite so long and now its here. Bravo alpha to Proton! Heard the waiting list are now up to 3 months. i’d say WOW for a one day sale after launch. much better than pisang goreng panas azmi seksyen 19 shah alam man!! Oh yeah
ingolstadt said,
January 19, 2008 @ 3:20 pm
Great job Proton. Enough for the compliments, next step:
1. Lengthen Waja’s platform and give us a low slung 7 seater at 65k. (i.e Wish)
——————–
So, re-engineer Chancelor to become 7 seater at half of its price of RM 130K++.
Look at the car boot, I open it and noticed there are 5 nut+washer to hold the rear bumper. The smooth line of bumper suddenly disrupted by this nuts. This is “rough work”, and the nuts shall fix it from behind t have a clean bumper finish. Perhaps Proton should rectify this “unwanted feature”.
Sorry for those who were expecting the gear ratios for the M/T. I forgot totally about it. But I have a perfectly good excuse for it. I managed to test-drive the A/T B-Line unit. All I could say at the end of the drive was, “Mr. Salesman, can you please deliver my car tomorrow?”.
Why? Because I was totally blown away. 5 persons in the car and the engine pulls away without too much grumble. Absorbtion of road undulation was really impressive, and from my memory, better than that of the Persona. Aircond fan at #2 speed delivered lots of air already, but slightly noisy. #4 should be really noisy, but it was cold so I didn’t bother to test it. Lights were good. Audio rather below my expectation, but nothing RM300 can’t fix. A “careless” throw into a corner didn’t fade my confidence, tho rear passengers complaint of bodyroll.
And then there’s that starter motor sound. That was the killer blow to me. I _really_ want this car. But there’s also a list of fixes to perform when the car comes. Replace the motorcycle horn. Change alarm to one with immobilizer and auto-lock/unlock. Add noise insulation panel to bootlid and rear bulkhead. Add tweeter for front and change to 2-way at the back. Maybe add some insulation into the doors too. Nothing major – looking forward to the DIY work later.
All in all, more than what you’d expect for the price. Still very impressed now. Please send me my unit soon ok, Proton?
PAUL…
ANY NEW SAGA TV COMMERCIAL????
I WANT TO SEE ONE….
mlbl said,
January 19, 2008 @ 7:15 pm
“… nothing really to shout about. You should go to the showroom and see this car before passing any judgement because from the pictures shown, the car looks overly spectacular and grand, but when seen in person….you’d have a different opinion entirely BLA BLA BLA…”
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I have seen this car, both in pictures / spyshots and have seen the real thing.
I think the car looks and feels much, much better in real that in the pictures. We respect your decision to keep your Myvi after doing your own comparison. But for other people perhaps they think otherwise, and hopefully you will also respect their decision on this car.
:peace:
dr_carz said,
January 19, 2008 @ 8:16 pm
Just came from the showroom. The car is decent. I just got hot air. Not like the pictures, the car is damn ugly. the interior is bad. Why would i pay 550 per month for a car that is so lame….
dont know what the fuss is all about!!!
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I would pay RM550 per month for this car and I won’t make a fuss about you and your even uglier car.
:peace:
madimat: of course, everyone here is entitled to their opinion about the car. make no mistake – this car is worth buying over viva..for that kind of price tag and engine, is worth every penny. my only concern is the interior’s plasticky feel and the somewhat worrying QC issues that seems to plague proton’s cars…I think its best to wait till the next 1 – 2 batches before proceeding to buy any of proton’s cars because i’ve heard countless of people having tons of problems with their cars..even my colleague who bought a satria neo complained after 2 weeks he got his car – the dashboard was rattling…if its 2 months or 2 years I’d accept that…but after 2 weeks ?
No doubt proton is steadily improving their quality these days, so hopefully they can keep that up..
Finally… Proton Manage to think outside of the Box (Literally the Body shape)… it’s a nice car… comfortable drive rather than the older version… i think we have to wait and see for the endurance…. well normally the first model always have some issue with it… :) Also can’t wait to see any photoshop job for this beautiful machine…
mlbl said,
January 20, 2008 @ 1:25 am
. my only concern is the interior’s plasticky feel and the somewhat worrying QC issues that seems to plague proton’s cars…I think its best to wait till the next 1 – 2 batches before proceeding to buy any of proton’s cars because i’ve heard countless of people having tons of problems with their cars..even my colleague who bought a satria neo complained after 2 weeks he got his car – the dashboard was rattling…if its 2 months or 2 years I’d accept that…but after 2 weeks ?
=======================
so you never heard viva gerbox kong after 3 days?? and never heard myvi dsahboard rattles problem???
pls update ur info bro
Well done Proton!!!
Love the simplicity of the design. Defenitely a SAGA.
Bigfish,
The 2/3 opening rear window doesn’t bother me as I never open the rear window anyway. So hot, need aircond!!!! And did you know that the first generation Lexus LS rear window did not wind down completely as well? But no one cares because it was a Lexus.
peYno – never heard of those so far but I’ve heard some issues with myvi of course…but not as much as i’ve heard of proton’s QC issues and dangerous ones at that like brake disc failure, aquarium satria neo, power window failure…
This is really great car for rakyat..Im proud of it and it is affordable.
mlbl ,that guy is likely Proton salesman, he all the way bash MyVi and Viva! There are two type of Salesman, good saleman is more reasonable if they just said the product they sale is good. Never condemn their competitor.
Another kind is “extreme” blind kind by said everything is good about their product and everything is bad about their competitor. This is very unhealthy mindset. I won’t deal with this kind of saleman irrespective of which brand they sale.
Hello Everyone!
To Mr. Big Fish:-
The reasaon for the 2/3 wind down window at the back is:
1) Design Constraints and cost cutting measure. If want to make the window go down fully, the price of the car might go up few k’s. So it’s a wise desicion of Proton not to do so in order to keep the car below 40K.
2) Child safety feature. Initialy, this was not intended, however when there is a design constrain like this, it is common for car manufacturers to ‘turn it into’ a positive aspect; rather to look on it’s downside, look at it’s benefits.
Generally:
This 2/3 window wind down at the back is common nowdays, as most manufacturers uses it as a cost cutting measure. SEE OTHER CARS, LIKE PERODUA, TOYOTA, HONDA(A and B segment cars) and so on, they have similar ‘design constraints’ and its quite common in the automovite design industry. Another thing Mr. Big Fish, I would like to remind you that A CHILD LOCK SAFETY FEATURE ONLY PREVENTS THE CHILD FROM UNLOCKING THE DOOR NOT UNWINDING THE WINDOW!!!
Cheers!
For a 30ish grand worth of car,I’m not complaining much as if I’m expecting a premium car
Some people here are being unreasonable and there are some people who claimed to own Proton cars,not a Proton basher but yet ask us to wait for his ‘ill-intended’ reports when he test the car.What are you?Some kind of a hypocracy scheme?
Oso,someone’s way of deducing the quality is by testing the car until it passes his so-called Quality Test. Must’ve a big CERTIFIED ISO QUALITY TESTER sticker on his forehead
Sigh….
My personal view of the new SAGA…the design is not great BUT it’s not fugly. Its a basic car with no jazzy,fancy equipment/accessories. Good for someone who wants a simple,no-nonsense car that car deliver them from A to B
Need to wait for the reports of the owners on the quality of the car before posting any serious/further comments
si-fu said,
January 20, 2008 @ 9:42 am
Hello Everyone!
Generally:
This 2/3 window wind down at the back is common nowdays, as most manufacturers uses it as a cost cutting measure. SEE OTHER CARS, LIKE PERODUA, TOYOTA, HONDA(A and B segment cars) and so on, they have similar ‘design constraints’ and its quite common in the automovite design industry. Another thing Mr. Big Fish, I would like to remind you that A CHILD LOCK SAFETY FEATURE ONLY PREVENTS THE CHILD FROM UNLOCKING THE DOOR NOT UNWINDING THE WINDOW!!!
————
Your first reasoning “common” and “cost cutting” and “design constraint” have some basis.
But to say it is for child safety reason, there is no “official” claim from any manufacturer! Normally central window lock at driver seat is function as to “disable” rear button to prevent child play with the window is commonly available in the market, including Waja.
yeah yeah !!! i realy like this car, and some one or Mr. paultan can post any mountain Blue saga picture, or who know which show room go show this color of car ?
please let me know, thank you very much
On sales and marketing aspect of the Saga and previous models at Proton showroom. The folowing is the “frequent” traits that I am facing with Proton salesman: –
1. “Tak apa” attitude.
2. Not “serious” in dealing with visitor and sometime customer have to approach them, rather than they take proactive initiative to reach customer.
3. Their presentation is “bland”, lack of “urgency to buy” approach and convincing power.
4. Lack of product knowledge (even some non-technical question). This include give “cin-cai” answer.
5. Sometime brochure also “out of stock”.
6. Don’t record down visitor contact no., thus no follow up call.
7. Difficulties to get test drive, etc.
To boredofschmucks. Yes. I kinda agree with you as there are people dare to say they are going to do full assessments or testing of this new Saga. Are they qualified as a tester? What are the qualifications for those poeple? Hahaha…. I prefer looking forward from those REAL QUALIFIERS such as those editors from magazines (local or international), Fifth Gear NOT TOP GEAR….
To mlbl. You never heard don’t mean it never happened! Even Toyota, Honda, BMW, Mercedes, Hyundai, Perodua, got power windows problem, transmission problems, brakes failure problems, electrical problems including shock caused by bad wiring and many others. My point is, there are thousand of cars (same model or not from each manufacturer), don’t tell me you have seen every single car and check through every one of them. Say if you live in KL, do you know what happen in Sabah, Sarawak, Langkawi or other states? What more to say, thousands and millions of cars in a single state. Those who drive branded and luxury cars, most of them will just keep quite if their cars failed. I know because I have friends, colleagues…. like that. Proton is a bit unfortunate last time, because having more flaws in their cars. However, recently we can see the improvement from Proton…. which for many people with rational and positive thinking will feel it is good but still Proton must learn and improve themselves faster.
That’s all I can say. Not defender of Proton and basher to other car manufactures.
Cheers and happy motoring.
Finally, after so many years, the new SAGA arrived. It’s quite a suprise actually that Proton manage to pull this off. I mean design wise, it didn’t make the ‘extended’ rear end look awkward unlike the Latio or the City. But, personally, I think this car is no head turner. It looks bland. I don’t feel the ‘freshness’ that you felt when they launched the Gen2 and Neo some times ago. It’s a bit dissapointing or is it me expecting too much? But I guess, SAGA has met it’s purpose as the car for the masses. No offense to “kipas-susah-mati” Proton. Maybe it’s just me.
A bit side track. I’ve read somewhere on January 17. Excerpts from Mr. Rocky Bru’s blog; “Market talk. I hear the Proton management, the same one that sold MV Agusta for 1 Euro, is planning to sell off Lotus. No, not for 1 Euro…….Proton sold off MV Agusta on the pretense that the bike outfit wasn’t part of its primary operation, which is to make cars. Ironically, BMW, which is also primarily a car manufacturer, paid close to RM500 million for MV Agusta.
The re-making of Saga. Expect the Proton chairman to deny this talk tomorrow (Friday, 18/1)……”
Anybody here can confirm this? Paul? sifu?
morning~anyone here who already tested drive this new born SAGA, if don mind can share ur opinion here..in terms of comfortability, stability, power delivery at low rev etc etc…..haha~
and,
how many stars of this car scored in crash test..anyone?
thanks for sharing~
Wonder why people paying much attention to rear window that can’t be fully winded. My Citroen also only 2/3 rolled down. Why they need to roll down the rear window? To those who has this concern, when is the last time you rolled down your rear window?…Perhaps rear passanger paying the toll ticket for you?
Need to differentiate between what things need to have and what things want to have…If more attention were given to what things want to have then probability to spent for unnecessary is there..
Hi there again!
To aksMs:-
I guess wat you heard was just a romour or a hype. The last thing that proton would do is sell Lotus. There are many long term projects already planned with Lotus, for the next 10 years or so. So i guess its a false statement. I respect your opinion on the car, as each individual has their own taste and how they look at certain things. Not like certain ‘people’ who just go to the showroom to find fault on the car.
To boredofschmucks and The Unicorns:-
I agree with you guys. Some ppl talk/post here as though they know how to test a car or an engine. Many people doesn’t know the vigrous testing that the Campro engine endures everyday. There are test conducted on the Campro engine for 500hours at maximum rpm (arnd 6000rpm) and/or maximum torque (depending on which engine) with specific intervals (to simulate oil change) depending on which engine, to see the durability of the engine. Other then that, there are constant road test being done on existing models (with weights on board) for mileage accumulation to test the durabilty of the engine with load and also the durability of the car. The are many more tests done which many ppl dont know. That’s why when initially Campro was launched, Proton claimed the engine was durable. Due to these vigorous testing and so on, the service interval for the new Saga is EVERY 10000km. So the car is not only cheap, but cheap to maintain also. Some people just easily tell whether the car can last for 9 years or not, if the car and engine is cared properly it can last for 30 years also.
Cheers!!!
BigFish said,
January 20, 2008 @ 12:27 am
Look at the car boot, I open it and noticed there are 5 nut+washer to hold the rear bumper. The smooth line of bumper suddenly disrupted by this nuts. This is “rough workâ€, and the nuts shall fix it from behind t have a clean bumper finish. Perhaps Proton should rectify this “unwanted featureâ€.
—–
Hmm… maybe we should comment next that the tyres fitted onto this car catches too much dirts.. Proton should rectify this by having ‘dirt repellent tyres’ fitted instead.
To orgkampong. Well, that’s why some people don’t even “DO FULL ASSESSMENT” to other cars (from other manufacturers) and start to complaint about Proton cars including this Saga for its rear power windows can not wind down completely.
—————————————————————-
BigFish said,
January 20, 2008 @ 12:27 am
Look at the car boot, I open it and noticed there are 5 nut+washer to hold the rear bumper. The smooth line of bumper suddenly disrupted by this nuts. This is “rough workâ€, and the nuts shall fix it from behind t have a clean bumper finish. Perhaps Proton should rectify this “unwanted featureâ€.
ANS: 6 NUTS and WAHSHERS actually. I think Perodua MyVi and Viva also have this “UNWANTED FEATURES” too and as you said “rough work”. Correct me if I’m wrong. Why Daihatsu / Toyota didn’t rectify this? I did some references. The Honda Civic U.S. model and Honda Fit U.S. model (just to name two models from other market than Malaysia) also have 2 nuts and washers to hold the rear bumper. Sound familiar? If got time, I’ll try to find out more car with this “rough work” and “unwanted features”.
Happy motoring everyone. Cheers.
Compare this to my Savvy, the door finishing is much better with nicer curves & flowing design. And has even small fabric patch at the handrest area. Nice touch for sub-40k car.
The only consolation for my Savvy is that I can fold flat the back seat and hv enough space for my Ikea shopping day..
Got an air bag some more… ishh… ishhh
I wonder if we get to see the new saga which has been tuned up to the max? regardless R3…
myst said,
January 18, 2008 @ 5:39 pm
Looll..Forgot to sign in 1st…If Not i’ll b da 1st to comment..Huhu
Bravo Proton..
‘Proton Basher’..Any words ?
————————————————————–
you are worse than a proton basher. provoke anger who are disagree with you and turn this place into a war zone.anyway it’s a new car. wait until 6 month. let some test rat use the car first. then let them talk here. the unpleasent thing i’ve discovered are the steering wheel quality and the exposed frame in the bonnet at rear back seat for N line and B line. engine compartment looks ok but many empty space at engine right side. they should do something to cover that area. overall are just so-so. anyway proton already did something. ” dare to change” has show a little bit.
congrats to proton for dis new product. Please don’t take things for granted after this.
A normal car that probably deserved the many ‘WOW’, ‘OHHH’ n ”AHH’…. it’s a little sad but that the reality in Bolehland.
Finally the right offering.
All those damning bashes and flaming critics from many Malaysians either in this blog space or elsewhere.. finally… were officially answered by Potong.
Lets hope this car survive way past the initial euphoria (excitement)… everyone want this car to be a success.. almost..
Potong, congrats for finally deliver what customer demands…
And last but not least, the base for this new Saga, the Savvy is a good car. Hope people will realise that n appreciate the little ‘good-handling car’ better after this.
Thank you si-fu for the further input and comments.
To orgkampong. Well, that’s why. Some people only put in some crap comments about Proton cars including this new Saga without knowing the facts that there are so many other car manufacturers produced their cars with rear windows which can not be winded down completely. Why they never complaint and only when Proton cars, they bring up the issue?
BigFish said,
January 20, 2008 @ 12:27 am
Look at the car boot, I open it and noticed there are 5 nut+washer to hold the rear bumper. The smooth line of bumper suddenly disrupted by this nuts. This is “rough workâ€, and the nuts shall fix it from behind t have a clean bumper finish. Perhaps Proton should rectify this “unwanted featureâ€.
ANS: 6 nuts and washers to be exact. Since I’ve been looking and test drive many cars I can’t remember too much. If I’m not mistaken, Perodua MyVi and Viva also have nuts fixed such a way. Correct me if I’m wrong. So, why Daihatsu/Toyota also didn’t rectify this “Unwanted Feature” as you called. I’ve did some surfing and found out even Honda Civic U.S. model and Honda Fit U.S. model (just to name two models outside Malaysia – United State mah, more standard right? hahaha….) also have 2 nuts and washer fixed on the rear bumper such a way too. So, you call this “nice work” and “good feature”? or “rough work” and “unwanted feature”? Sound familiar? For me, as long as the boot close and cannot see the nuts, that’s fine as long as those nuts actually to straighten the fixing of the rear bumper. If after closing the boot still can see the nuts then I can say its rough work or unwanted feature. Just like you said.
Happy motoring and cheers to all.
Unicorns, that’s so true. One must take complaints about proton’s perceived lack of build quality with a pinch of salt especially if:
1) The person has never owned a proton car.
2) The person has only owned proton car(s).
GENERALLY: I find that people who have owned BOTH proton’s and continentals dont complain much about their protons. However, people who owned both proton’s and japanese cars do complain abit about their protons …but still they dont complain as much as people who have only owned a proton car.
To Bigfish: Eh, im still waiting for you long winded review. For the first time in awhile there appears to be more positive than negative comments about proton. Come and balance things up abit.
i went to the showroom 3 times already.yes,3 time. i choose this proton saga over myvi, viva,sutera,kenari,atos,suria,qq,spark etc the same price range :) why? i dont need to explain. you find it out at the nearest showroom near you. tutup cerita! to bashers, wat ever. peace
its a worth it car…
it feels ok to me.’but still waiting for campro CPS waja…
The Unicons said,
January 20, 2008 @ 11:22 am
BigFish said,
January 20, 2008 @ 12:27 am
Look at the car boot, I open it and noticed there are 5 nut+washer to hold the rear bumper. The smooth line of bumper suddenly disrupted by this nuts. This is “rough workâ€, and the nuts shall fix it from behind t have a clean bumper finish. Perhaps Proton should rectify this “unwanted featureâ€.
ANS: 6 NUTS and WAHSHERS actually. I think Perodua MyVi and Viva also have this “UNWANTED FEATURES†too and as you said “rough workâ€. Correct me if I’m wrong. Why Daihatsu / Toyota didn’t rectify this? I did some references. The Honda Civic U.S. model and Honda Fit U.S. model (just to name two models from other market than Malaysia) also have 2 nuts and washers to hold the rear bumper. Sound familiar? If got time, I’ll try to find out more car with this “rough work†and “unwanted featuresâ€.
Happy motoring everyone. Cheers.
——————-
Whatever makes with this “rough work” with this “unwanted feature”, I still maintain my statement even it is Mercs or BMW! I am not “selective” and “fault finding” with Proton.
Same to rear window 2/3 opening issue, it is crap “design flaw” if Toyota, Honda, etc have this. Don’t just because of other major manufacturer do it, then small player follow blindly!
These are the “cost cutting” exercise aim at to maximize profits/minimize cost rather than “cost saving” – a value engineering exercise during design and production stage aim at eliminate unnecessary cost without sacrify the functionality, aesthetic or quality aspects.
To Mr Big Fish:-
Big Fish Said,
‘If the 2/3 opening rear window is for kid safety design, why Proton bother to put in child lock function?’
“But to say it is for child safety reason, there is no “official†claim from any manufacturer! Normally central window lock at driver seat is function as to “disable†rear button to prevent child play with the window is commonly available in the market, including Waja.”
I want to higlight here, that CHILD LOCK AND CENTRAL WINDOW LOCK is 2 different things! GET UR FACTS RIGHT BEFORE U POST BLINDLY! U just contradicted urself! First u say ‘child lock function’ then central ‘central window lock’, where are getting at actually? Don’t u know that the new Saga doesn’t have rear power window? If don’t have rear power window, HOW TO PUT CENTRAL WINDOW LOCK????? That’s why the window only can be wind down 2/3!!!! To compensate for that!
Wats is this with requesting for Proton to claim that it is a safety feature? U think Proton got no other better other things to promote on their car ar? Afterall, those kind of window design is common and not a big thing TO BE CLAIMED!!! Why not U ask other manufacturers like Perodua, Toyata, Honda, Hyundai, Renault, and so on to claim the same thing? Not like certain manufacturers (Car V), got nothing to promote their car, they claim their car door can open 90 degrees la, 80 degrees la…isn’t that a lame thing to promote a car with? There are many other features to be higlighted with this car, that’s why Proton is concerntrating on that rather then concerntrating ON A WINDOW! U claim other people are purposely bashing P2 cars especially the salesman and so on, firstly how sure are u they are salesman? Secondly, isn’t that what u were doing prviously and also now? Bashing for no reason? Please Mr. Big Fish, i think everybody here knows that U cant accept Proton is improving. I am not telling that they r the best or wat, but they are improving and will further improve. Just give them a chance. Not everybody is perfect, and the same saying goes, not all car manufacturers are perfect. Dont go to show rooms, to ‘test’ the car ‘ur way’ and purposely find fault on it. I think these kind of attitude is childish, improper and un-professional.
Cheers!
hehehe… right on si-fu
anyway… u must admire his determination… so many ‘bad experienced’ with Proton still went to check the car for fault… and his findings are:
a. the rear window only goes 2/3 down?
b. there are some screws and bolts on the boots?
really… I am confused by his aim and intention for all this fact-finding… if u don’t like the car or the manufacturer itself, why the trouble in the first place? let people who like the car be left alone. it’s like u are promoting hatred on proton. it’s like u have some hidden agenda here. even Paul himself who is more of an expert on automotive see this as a good product and here we have a yahoo who say it is not. I really pity your mindset… too much hatred… learn to love and you won’t be such a pitiful person.
To si-fu… can u confirm when is the waja CPS is due? I’m been waiting since last year to book it but nobody seems to know when it’s going to be launched. the most I can get is, it will be launched in april the latest… is it true? thanks
Well said, si-fu.
Kingbrutal, are you saying you are getting the Waja CPS? Cool. Hope the center console for dashboard area is nicely redesigned as someone told it is one of the improvements besides getting new engine. Hopefully better gear shifter and hand brake too. Haha….
Coming months will be even hotter as more new cars going to be launched. Wah…. haha…. Busy man!
Drive safe, keep safe and stay safe wherever you are. Have a nice day.
To Bigfish: Eh, im still waiting for you long winded review. For the first time in awhile there appears to be more positive than negative comments about proton. Come and balance things up abit.
————
Yeah, exactly I try to reply one of our fellow forummer about this car resemblance to Dacia Logan. Thus, the next big question is it P1 carry out re-engineering exercise to make new Saga from Savvy chassis, or it is “rebadge-ticon” transformation from Dacia Logan? I am still look to my “Mahaguru Tuan Google Bin Tok Yahoo†for more information.
OK, I am not fault finding again, I dare to claim that I am good if not expert in analyzing photos. I am involved in photographing way back to 1990s during my college time using professional Nikon camera.
I can identify with “90 % accuracy” whether the photos is taken using standard lens (SLR conventional 50mm), telephoto lens or wide angle lens (indeed this is a basic knowledge for cameraman). And now, I am interested and brush up my skills in dealing with digital photos & Photoshop (get a lot of tips from my brother who are opening bridal studio).
OK, now we are back to business, I am not trying to divert your attention but just to share something. Look at the crash test photos furnished by PT. I don’t know how and where Paul obtained these photos but I hope it is not from Proton. I have the benefits of doubt that the attached photos are in original form?. I already copy and paste to winword, enlarge and analyze it.
The “signs” are very visible: –
1. Look at the first photo.
– The glass broken effect, if enlarge “look like a lot of water splash out effectâ€. And as known to all, the glass use in the car is not like normal glazing, where it will normally broken, but still “stick togetherâ€. However, this photo shows that it is splash all over like water (look like the quantity is more than it supposes to be, some more the second photo show the rear window open 2/3, so left 1/3 to “splashâ€).
– Look at the dummy vehicle, the rim is paint with yellow. I believe this part is not Photoshop. However, the rim for this Saga dummy is red (left), and extends to tyre. In my entire life, what I know all tyre available in the market is BLACK? Looking further on enlarge photo, it was found the “artist†done a bad Photoshop job, the tyre is authentically black but come with a layer of semi-transparent red coloring. The worst is the red color even “spilled†down to the floor a little bit. Why they paint red all over rim and tyre? This will be described the likely reason when we look at the second photo.
– Look at the smaller hole of the drum rim for dummy vehicle, the contrast is very clear between the hole and the drum. For red color rim in Saga, the alloy wheel hole is blurred? (i.e. for side impact crash test, supposed the Saga dummy is stationary).
– Look at the lighting direction, there are sport light visible from the back and top (look at the reflection of light on top right hand side of the windscreen). Look at the tyre at right hand side, it is completely black (perhaps the “artist†forgot to Photoshop it)
2. Look at the second photos
– The lighting direction should be come from all direction since there is no shadow below the car.
– Look at the front and back tyres, the alloy rim is clearly visible. But the hole on the alloy wheel is more blur compare to holes for yellow drum rim in the first photo. There shall be no such thing as argue on use of cheap low pixel camera to take photo for this important test.
– Look at the circle line between the alloy wheel and tyre, it is not perfect round as compare to the yellow dummy vehicle. Therefore, I believe the purpose of the tyre paint red is the “artist†cut the alloy rim from somewhere else, and paste into this Saga dummy. To cover out the bad Photoshop job, the easy way out is by color red all over the alloy wheel and tyre. The door handle is likely being Photoshop as well so that it looks like production unit of Saga.
Then subsequent question is why they do this? Likely answer is P1 (assume the attached photos is furnished by P1) may actually do not carry out the crash test but use other crash test photo and Photoshop it, later claim as their own. So far, one perplexing thing is why there are crash test photos but no test result announced? Is it no test or 1 star rating, so “no result�
Does the crash test photos are actually belong to Dacia Logan? I check with the Dacia Logan website and find a crash test photos but from different angle and they give their crash test rating as 3 star for adult occupant safety.
http://www.renault-dacia-logan.com/logan-safety-euro-ncap.php
Paul, please don’t censor this posting and take it as another question for you to answer (if you see it as question and worthy to answer).
Paul says: You’re just being absurd as usual and I am not going to bother with this.
Hi kingbrutal:-
Hehehehehehe, Let see wat he says after this!
Regarding Waja CPS, it will be launched by mid this year, the earliest by April. I am not sure wheather both the CPS cars will be launched together or separately, but most probably together! One thing i can reassure u, u wont be dissapointed waiting for the Waja CPS. Even i am pondering of getting one! Hahahahahaha. Its ‘super sweet’ i can say. It rides well, handles superbly, powerful engine, SUPERB interior! and fast too! The best part of the car is the engine! It can rev up to 7000rpm EASILY and EFFORTLESSLY, like A HOT KNIFE THROUGH BUTTER!!!! The engine is SUPER SMOOTH!!! Before u know it, u r already hitting the redline!!! Hahahahahaha. Thx to its CPS and VIM!!! I guess i just made u more anxious and excited, i am too actually!
Cheers!!!
si-fu said,
January 20, 2008 @ 4:33 pm
To Mr Big Fish:-
Big Fish Said,
‘If the 2/3 opening rear window is for kid safety design, why Proton bother to put in child lock function?’
“But to say it is for child safety reason, there is no “official†claim from any manufacturer! Normally central window lock at driver seat is function as to “disable†rear button to prevent child play with the window is commonly available in the market, including Waja.â€
I want to higlight here, that CHILD LOCK AND CENTRAL WINDOW LOCK is 2 different things! GET UR FACTS RIGHT BEFORE U POST BLINDLY!
———
Thank for the comment, i am not wrong to say so since I specifically mentioned my Waja. And thank for the info on child lock and central window lock. Anyway, no point argue further on this as every thing is well said.
To ezralimm. Well said. Some people thought that only Proton cars got flaws. Last time I did post about my friend’s Toyota Vios less than 2 years power windows failed. The latest one is my uncle’s Mercedes Benz E Class (W211) suddently brake failed, no brake so crash on other people’s car. Luckily he drove slowly. His old Mercedes Benz E Class (W210) got bad wiring. Electrical shock!!! sold off get W211 also got problems.
Not to bash other manufacturers, as these are the facts.
My opinion on the overall of this Saga is it is decently built and price reasonably under protective NAP environment. This is not the barometer of Proton success. Proton will be truely success only if they can export in big nos. to achieve economy of scale, and to compete at local market without NAP to fully benefits the consumers.
This car is really good and it is a worthy successor of the original Saga which is in the 30K range. Overall, it exceeds my expectation and I’m happy that although it is a sedan version of Savvy, it looks like an all new model.
I’m a bit surprised that they removed the handle bars for the lower 2 spec models. How much could they save from those handle bars? If they are trying to save on cost for the most entry level, they could have omitted power steering steering with no audio player (As I believe people would change the standard clarion head unit).
On the pricing, it is bang for the buck. There is no other sedan in this price range and it would interesting to see how would this impact Myvi sales. When Persona was launched, it enjoyed good feedback but surprisingly it didn’t affect Myvi sales.
Looking at the pricelist, the B and M line is only RM2000 differences. That RM2000 would give you Airbags, pretensioners, Foglamp, Reverse Sensor, Motorised Mirror, Fabric door panels and alloy rim. I would forsee that more bookings would be made for M line than B line. The RM2000 would cost a few bucks over several years of loan.
There are some rooms for improvement for Saga and I do hope they would have a H-line model. 1.3L would be sufficient for better fuel economy. For the upcoming H-line model, if they have one, it would be great to have:
1. Rear power windows
2. Foldable split 60:40 seats (Just like in some original Saga models) to carry long items (such as a ladder or curtain rail)
3. ABS + Extra Passenger Airbag
4. Side signal indicators
I’m sure there are people who wants the above if priced less than RM45,000.
Q:why only could rolled down window 2/3?
A: if u want fully rolled down,go buy persona
Q:Why dont have rear power window? what a poor choice!!!
A: if u want rear power window.,go buy persona lah
Of course proton want to protect their investment in Persona.They will only put rear power window if viva drop their price below 30k, which not going to happenlah. Do u still remember, iswara comeout without power stering, now got it. Simpan skit, that strategy loh. Kalau awal-awal dah letak power window,passenger airbag, then no more secret weapon anymore.
But not nice if their answer customer face to face like that lah. All have hidden agenda.
To BrakeFader. I do agree with you those features / accessories for H-Line variant for this Saga, if any. Another thumbs up. Hahaha….
SHUT UP! who cares if the window ‘only’ winds down to 2/3? u want to throw ur babies out to the road issit???
A real budget car I would say. It helps lotsa low earning family to own a decent car with an affordable price. Hope proton may improve better. Btw, any idea the new IAFM can be installed into Gen2 campro? Please advice. Thanks
Dear Sifu Si-Fu
Is the Waja CPS is the upcoming Waja model codenamed MC-3? The one reported to be supercharged?
What do u mean the Waja CPS having powerful engine? 127 horsepower is not that powerful for a car that weighs 1200-1300kg.
How about the throttle response? Hopefully its not as laggy as the existing ones found in current Campro. I’ve seen many auto reporters highlighted their concern on the lack of throttle response from the new saga.
Thanks
==============
si-fu said,
January 20, 2008 @ 5:18 pm
Hi kingbrutal:-
Hehehehehehe, Let see wat he says after this!
Regarding Waja CPS, it will be launched by mid this year, the earliest by April. I am not sure wheather both the CPS cars will be launched together or separately, but most probably together! One thing i can reassure u, u wont be dissapointed waiting for the Waja CPS. Even i am pondering of getting one! Hahahahahaha. Its ’super sweet’ i can say. It rides well, handles superbly, powerful engine, SUPERB interior! and fast too! The best part of the car is the engine! It can rev up to 7000rpm EASILY and EFFORTLESSLY, like A HOT KNIFE THROUGH BUTTER!!!! The engine is SUPER SMOOTH!!! Before u know it, u r already hitting the redline!!! Hahahahahaha. Thx to its CPS and VIM!!! I guess i just made u more anxious and excited, i am too actually!
Cheers!!!
Apparently, the Waja CPS might be coming out as soon as next week??!! Is that possible? The guy who took my order said his manager’s office has stacks of Waja CPS brochures already. Dunno if he’s just teasing me or not … Haha … As for the bashers, just ignore them and they’ll go away. I went to the test-drive last night with a Civic 2.0 owner who wants to get the Saga for his chick. When I mentioned the rear windows, he said, “Normal lah, my Civic also like that”.
As for which car to get, I think if we put all the cars available for under RM40k to the Fifth Gear track test, the answer will be obvious (as to which will lap faster).
Based on observation, the reason why rear windows can only be wound down 2/3 is because there isn’t much space in the door to accommodate the entire glass. This is due to the design of the rear door, the bottom-rear of the door panel will curve in to make way for the rear wheel arch.
The child safety and all that reason – I think it does not make sense. Can children sit in front? Should the front windows be designed so that they cannot be fully wound down too?
By the way, this rear-window limitation is not an exclusive case to be found on Protons only. Many other makes also like that. So, gentlemen, please don’t harp on such trivial issue anymore.
i admit that the SA should know about the window things so they can answer the question that BigFish asked.
I think proton should beef up the Sales and Marketing segment and of the Service Center people.
Mr. Normaluser:
Yes thats the code name for Waja CPS, MC-3 but it wont be supercharged and never was supercharged. I know it doesn’t sound powerfull, but comparing the previous engines that the Waja used, the 4G18 and Campro 1.6, this engine gives a lot of difference. The most significant difference is the way the Campro CPS+VIM ACHIEVES the 127hp and 150Nm torque.
The laggy throttle response is actually quite hard to notice as a lay person except during manual gear change. The throttle blip is mainly caused by ‘the way’ the ECU is mapped and the ‘language’ limitation to ECU mapping. Currently, Proton is changing the tools( softwares, languages, interfaces) to map the coming ECU’s. This will DEFINITELY eliminate the thorttle blip and improve the throttle response tremendously. However, the throttle response for the Waja CPS and Gen-2 CPS is much much much better then the normal Campro 1.6 and 1.3. Trust me, much much better. I wont deny that there is still blip, but hardly noticeble unless noticed by experience people like Paul. Hehehehehehe! As i said in my previous post, Proton is changing, constantly changing and improving, just give them a chance.
Cheers!!!
lol at the bashers…..some even have their own testing method…lol…without sample/CAD also can test..can determine centre of gravity????? Brilliant…..work in automotive industry la come come…..cost saving maaa…..sure boss love you so much….even promote you to superduperseniorextrapowderful engineer…..no need status 0 status 1 drawing…straight go to mass production lol…..
And need to cover the empty space beside the engine? Why? lol…..ermmm ample space what ..easy to access…
met black color …..yay my first car…
wow. 320 posts liao.
kudos Paul Tan.
Didnt notice more pics were added until few minutes ago.
The chrome on glossy black logo looks alot better than the previous colorful one. I got a feeling there are gonna be plenty a neo/savvy/gen2/persona with it on the road in a matter of months.
Thanks, Paul. Overall, i hv no much comments on this new generation Proton Saga. A pretty good car. Well done, Proton. Keep it up.
However, i still do not agree with the meter panel design. The design looks much better compare to the Savvy and Gen-2 but the light colour is not that comfort-RED/ORANGE. I suggest the Proton should refer to the design of the City or Vios’s meter panel. The most suitable light colour would be the WHITE plus RED colour indicating light. This give us a high contrast view and ease for fast reading of the meter panel. Besides, the meter panel layout still need to be improved like City or Vios.
Another bad things are the central locking knob and the clumsy hump which should be eliminated. I prefer the Thailand version GEN-2 knobs. I also would like the turn indicator and ABS to be included into the next edition of SAGA.
Hopefully, this car will gain back the trust and satisfaction from the Malaysian and not the frustration or critics. Waiting for the great improvements from Proton in the future!
Will Proton come out the new 2009 or 2010 SAGA ???? I m curious about it.
One thing more…… I LIKE the chrome PROTON logo look. WOW! Looks pretty good, stylish and elegant. SIMPLE is Beautiful…. That’s right, man! Check it out.
I am a woman, thus I know next to nothing about cars. I am an average wage earner. So I can’t afford to keep changing cars nor upkeep a high maintenance. Can someone please tell me which car is better? Proton BLM or Perodua Myvi? Please help.
I went to the showroom today to check it out. Our showroom car was a white B-line. It had missing antenna, noisy boot hinges and a chocolate stained roof upholstery.
It just didn’t feel quite good sitting inside. Felt a bit plain and cramped, but definitely more spacious than Iswara. Mainly I think because I was in the Persona so long, waiting for people to clear off from the saga. Heres the minor issues for me.
1. The roof upholstery was quite thin and and when pressed it feels like plain cardboard wrapped.
2. The rubber mouldings on the outer door frames were quite thin and are slightly out of shape.
3. I hate the sound when I knock my elbow against the door trim. Don’t really mind the dashboard but the door trims should have been soft. I think the M-Line comes with a cloth like insert on the door trim.
4. Locks were hard to press and pull up, but not much worries as we usually use the remote control.
5. The coin holder or grip on the door panel has a visible screw, kind of a turn off to see such crude way of installing it.
6. No independent clock.
7. Door closing does not sound as good as the Persona, almost like Iswara when it was new.
8. No signal on the fenders, might cause problems with other drivers in parking lots.
9. Sun visors are too small.
What I’m very happy with is…
1. Rear legroom improved, now people can sit behind me when I drive.
2. Air con lever or directer or whatever its called is quite solid and not bad to touch. Way better then the ones in Iswara, which breaks after a few years.
3. Better seats design and higher seating, which means easier to get in and out.
4. Nice and thick steering wheel.
5. Nice meters, hopefully the RPM, temperature and fuel indicators don’t go cuckoo.
6. The door panels are so thick (the width of it) later I checked out the Persona again, it was even thicker. I would assume these provides better protection against impacts, compared to half of the width in Iswara.
I forgot to check the if the wiper stalk is on the left or right.
I still cant forget the Persona, so damn nice looking interior, with its short auto gear lever which was real sporty compared to the one in Saga. When opened the Persona door felt like opening into a Honda Accord. S theres my dream car for now. Persona.
Anyhow this Saga is definitely better than the previous in almost every way.
hehe Freeze, of coz la Persona is a lot better than the new Saga… Just look at the price between those 2 cars… And Persona is like Wira, the middle range of proton while Saga is the low range…
Proton already do a lot of improvements already. The car quality becomes better while keeping for lower price. No more karat (like old SAGA), drop bumber and side front light (like wira), power window problem (like Waja).
However, one more factor to keep customer is After Sales Service. Any design flaws (if any) proton must be responsible to recall and provide FOC replacement. Customers’ complains even a very small matter must be taken care so that the next production lots or different models should not carry the same issue. Hence, customer service officers are very improtant to listen and inform to Proton Management for further improvement.
Does Proton I-Care really serve customer right? Maybe you all can tell your experience dealing with I-Care.
I have been practising changing oil every 10000 KM when using Semi-sinthetic, and my old car can still running well. However, P2 model still keeps 5000 Km to change oil eventhough using semi-sinthetic oil. Actually, how do they decide 5K or 10K to change oil. Anyhow, I agree with Proton for 10K Km for changing oil – it save maintenance cost.
hai, currently I’m still thinking whether I should order Manual or Auto for proton BML. Please could you all advise me because I want to use rim 16 inch if I use Auto it will drop the car performance alot right, this is my guess. For those expertise in car performance please advise me I really want to buy this proton.
6. The door panels are so thick (the width of it) later I checked out the Persona again, it was even thicker. I would assume these provides better protection against impacts, compared to half of the width in Iswara.
——————————————————–
true,
just a little comparison, ‘how far people from inside to outside, (wall thickness),
just a comparison, no offence to any other makes, as i respect for friends’ preferences,
myvvi is 112.5mm wall thickness
08 saga is 162.5mm wall thickness
well,,,, can always push the interior width limit,
at the end of the day ,we do need this sense of security (thick wall),
@BigFish
If the 2/3 opening rear window is for kid safety design, why Proton bother to put in child lock function? Furthermore, all manufacturers all over the world never claim this is new invention for kid safety features.
——————–
>>> Well, well, well!!! So all these while, people always complain Proton unsafe la, Proton killed thousands of lives which “could have been saved if only they drive a Toyota/BMW/Volvo/Merc at a price he paid for Proton”, Proton shud close shop coz they’ve murdered Msians, blablabla.
Here I am, reading for the first time ever, somebody is complaining about Proton putting in child lock function!! What’s wrong? Isn’t that showing Proton “not compromising safety for cost”? Isn’t that showing Proton “caring for the safety of the children”?
I read somewhere else a topic about why most new car models’ rear windows can’t wind down fully, and I really love this quote:
“Its because (sadly) car companies are sometimes more concerned with the safety of children than the idiot parents are.”
How’s that for Proton being caring about the lives it carry? Their engineers must’ve been a very loving and caring father/mother.
So, what have you against putting child lock function? Just cuz it oredi have 2/3 rear windows opening? So naive. That’s like not wearing seat belt on a car with airbag, if the airbag burst, do you think it will save you or suffocate, burn your skin, and crush your ribs? It takes two to clap.
And about why “all manufacturers all over the world never claim this is new invention for kid safety features”, they have better things to talk with their super advanced Cambridge/Oxford/MIT/(any top 200 unis) standard safety or green system that’s much more advanced than a no-brain primary school feature thing like this (or even more stupid abt door open 90deg. Heck, so all other cars have oni been able to open 10deg oni is it?). For this exact reasons that there are bashers who would bark endlessly at Proton’s “stone age” tech, and curse for it to close shop.
@The Unicons
Wow, poor your uncle, no wonder in 2004, Mercedes is 9th place from the bottom in JD Customer satisfaction survey in US. If you watch Jeremy Clarkson review CLS55 AMG, you’ll know that Jeremy really, really loves the car, but unwilling to buy it if it was his money because “it’s a Mercedes”. Probably that’s the British version of how we would normally say “It’s a Proton, what d’ya expect?”, ahaha. Imagine Msian dare say “It’s a Mercedes, what d’ya expect? Toyota-like reliability?” Nein…..they’d deny and pretend their eh-pen-cif car is made by God ie perfect, wakakakaka. Even then, Toyota oso have probs, nee? ;)
The moral is: “Pobody’s Nerfect”!! Fanboying a brand cuz one thinks it can never ever break down or hv quality problems is naive and they need to get a life. Or at least listen to “Welcome to My Life” by Simple Plan.
“To be hurt,
to feel lost,
to be left out in the dark,
to be kicked,
when you’re down,
to feel like you’ve been pushed aroun’,
to be on the edge of breakin’ down,
and no one’s there to save you,
no you don’t know what it’s like (to be the Proton MD)
welcome to my (Datuk Syed Zainal’s) life!!”
Life…..should be like Marlboro and strawberry milk!! There has always gotta be both bitter (pw rosak) and sweet (Lotus handling roXx!!) moments!! Only then it can be worth living!! Because of that, I will always give my support to Syed Zainal!!
So anyone of you who still thinks this new Saga is still “same old, same old Proton”, and that your life sux becuz your current Proton always pw rosak, gearbox rosak? Then be reminded that DSZ’s life is 10,000 times worse than yours. Think about the man who has to do the job of ensuring the cars’ QC is international standard. You wanna complain, you gotta know its pricetag. If can’t afford, they stay poor and stupid the way you are.
The good news is, both Mercedes and Proton seem to have beefed up their effort for QC. I love that fact, cuz they both “sudah terhantuk, baru terngadah”. Yohoho.
Cheers.
mergaztua said,
January 20, 2008 @ 10:50 pm
hai, currently I’m still thinking whether I should order Manual or Auto for proton BML. Please could you all advise me because I want to use rim 16 inch if I use Auto it will drop the car performance alot right, this is my guess. For those expertise in car performance please advise me I really want to buy this proton.
==========
me too having the same issue to decide over
kindly need some guides from the experts….
pls help…
si-fu said,
January 20, 2008 @ 5:18 pm
Hi kingbrutal:-
Hehehehehehe, Let see wat he says after this!
Regarding Waja CPS, it will be launched by mid this year, the earliest by April. I am not sure wheather both the CPS cars will be launched together or separately, but most probably together! One thing i can reassure u, u wont be dissapointed waiting for the Waja CPS. Even i am pondering of getting one! Hahahahahaha. Its ’super sweet’ i can say. It rides well, handles superbly, powerful engine, SUPERB interior! and fast too! The best part of the car is the engine! It can rev up to 7000rpm EASILY and EFFORTLESSLY, like A HOT KNIFE THROUGH BUTTER!!!! The engine is SUPER SMOOTH!!! Before u know it, u r already hitting the redline!!! Hahahahahaha. Thx to its CPS and VIM!!! I guess i just made u more anxious and excited, i am too actually!
Cheers!!!
======================
Hi si-fu….
indirectly you have rev-up the Waja CPS anticipation with your teaser comment. Hope all this is true, as I really enjoyed driving the 4G18 Waja though its power & torque is lower than Campro but it provide the most enjoyable driving pleasure at 2.5K-3.5K rpm….The dashboard has been touched as you quoted/rumour, does the aircond vent still tilted towards driver side? this way of design is similar to BMW & it does proves to be quite elegant & more high-class (at least to me)
2. Is the exterior have any changes/totally new Waja body been intorduce? I would like to see new headlamp been put forward, the rear thermometer light have a new design or at least touch-up the feel cheap feeling on the rough white cluster.
3. A wide angle side mirror been retain (like the current right side mirror on Waja) & introduce to the left side as well.
Last but not lease, the gear box. Bring something new to the gear box, be it a 5speed gear box or at least make fancy thing like a shiftronic gear gate where you have + & -. I think this is only electronically involve for the shiftronic, basically it is the same as the current P-R-N-D-3-2-1 layout. Shiftronic lets you play the gear manually just like you manually pull the lever to 3-2-1, etc. Correct me if I’m wrong on the shiftronic….
Tq.
I read cbt-nst this morning, Datuk Syed Zainal promised in a year or two, proton cars achieve high level of quality plus this quality issue is not easy to deal with.. I’m positively sure that he will keep his promises.
just glad my gf just booked one this evening.. when it comes to cars, she’s just not easy to be pleased. visiting showrooms was our routine and always she had some issues with the choices available whether locally made ones or foreign ones…
recently she kind of settled with the issues and decided to go for a suzuki swift.. until this evening, when i took her to pandah indah showroom..
-doors need some getting used to to shut them properly, so as the boot lid, rear windows? hmm .. wheat else? i can live with all that.
..to have your loved one satisfies with her decision.. -priceless
V for Vendetta at the back. LOL.
i went to the showroon ysterday to look at the newborn baby from close…
i was so nervous to even touch it at first… n then…all i can say was ‘wow!!’
mybe coz of the excitedness!!!
heheh
i really loved the M=line, when i got out of the car after trying it out all i can say tht.. its spacious, loved the interior (except for the door lock knob)… for such a price it is definitely an excellent choice!!!
i can’t belive tht i’m saying this but here goes……
i agree with BigFish when it comes to the salesman issue…
since i went to check out the car with a proton friend of mine we were stunned by the answers given.
its so sad to know tht these sales rep are not well equiped with the knowledge of the product n also the manufacturers.
i also got the info saying tht syed zainal is already goin aroud to inspect the sales centres due to tis problems. Thumbs up for him!!
the reason tht im pointing out this matter is tht, i juz want to remind my fellow bloggers tht DONT BELIEVE EVRYTHING THAT U HEAR!!!!!
though im a proton supporter, advicing u to get a 2nd opinion coz once u get the wrong idea over somthing it is hard to get rid of it!!!
p/s please advice me should i take manual or auto coz later on i want to change the rim to 16″ @17″.
As for the choice of M/T or A/T on the New Saga, I decided to go with the M/T gearbox even though I do not have the slightest idea what it feels like to shift. The showroom I went to didn’t have one. But yeah, I still settled for the M/T because I’ve had bad experience with Mitsubishi A/T units. My mom’s Waja gearbox stopped shifting properly after 7 years. My girlfriend’s 1991 Saga suddenly bled all its ATF onto the road. But then again, it’s a really old car. But what I learnt from that was for long-term reliability (~10 years), M/T is much easier to maintain. No such thing as fill in the wrong fluid.
On top of that you also get better fuel economy, and you can shift it as hard or as soft as you like depending on driving conditions. This M/T unit should be a Nissan unit, so perhaps clutch pads have to buy Nissan parts. The M/T unit is also a good 20KG lighter.
to not buy your loved ones and yourself a proton…..priceless
hi all, i when to Pudu showroom and sit in the driver seat in the new saga. I felt that the steering is not in the center. it is about 2 to 3cm to the left from the center. it is normal?
the steering is also about 10 degree shifted to the front on the right side? it is normal?
anyone feel the same?
to MR bigFish,
whats wrong with you man??you are actually living in the world of your own and you want everyone else to be in it..i mean think in your own weird way!!
whatever photographic lesson/knowledge you have is pure crap…
anyway..to answer your question:
check the pic with side view of the frontal collision..did you notice the airbag is fully deploy and still in its full expanding capacity?this means this photo was taken during the impact..because after the impact the airbag will lose it volume to at lease 1/3…so this pic was taken with a high speed camera..ant this explains why the tyre is not perfectly round…because its still under load from the impact…and it deformed to this extend!!understand??
the second lower pic..again dont look at the tyre alone..look at the entire pic…and u will easily notice its taken from a lower pixel camera or the image has be resized by someone..using any software..and its not photoshop of version of dacia logan or whatever crap u mentioned..
the glass volume u mentioned..this was the real joke man..what makes you think pic one and pic 2 was the same car??and what makes you think that the windows were open??ok nevermind that but when u mention why it was red..u made a fool out of yourself….the colours usually painted to make it more visible like how the pics showed the deformed tyre clearly..if its black..it would be harder to notice…check how other manufacturers test their cars..not EURO NCAP k…i am talking about other manufacturers…in house crash tests!!check then u will get a clear pic!!
and about the lighting…how can you be sure the top pic and the lower pic taken at the same place, same angle an all??
and about the glass…normally car in europe have tinted glass like proton’s safe tint..to make sure the glass sticks together even if its broken…not your so called double glazing!!!!dont lie to people here and make up your own assumtions ok???? it is all tempered glass…and the front glass piece is usually two piece glass which two layers of glass is heated to form a single piece…tempered glass will break such a way shown on the pic..if you dont believe me try breaking your car window..it will break into tiny pieces because its very brittle…your knowledge is very shallow man…please man buck up…dont be a blind basher…please learn to accept the fact!!
http://bridger.us/2002/12/16/CrashTestingMINICooperVsFordF150/
check this link above..why the tyre is white??
rest of the pic…find yourself…
To misspurple and mergaztua:-
The Saga base model has a wheel size of 175/70 R13. This gives us an OD (overall diameter) of :-
1inch = 25.4mm
Half of 13inch = 6.5inch = 165.1mm
Section height = 70% * 175mm = 122.5
So the OD is = 165.1 + 122.5 = 287.6mm
The rule in upsizing or downsizing a wheel is to keep the orignal OD of the car’s wheel with +/- 3%. This is to ensure the braking system is not affected and the speedometer reading is not deviated. So the possible upgrades or upsizing that can be done with the new Saga is:-
-185/60 R14 (the M Line tyre size)
-185/55 R15
-190/50 R15
-195/45 R16
-190/45 R16
-195/40 R17
My suggestion is, if u guys dont want to loose the comfort much, try to use combination with 50-series and above tyres. These are just some of my calculated suggestions only. U guys too can calculate using the formula above to choose the best wheel suited to ur choices. Regardless of these, i guess whether choosing a MT or an AT is not an issue anymore. AT or MT solely depends on your driving preferences, ur fuel consumption worries (AT higer FC), whether u guys drive alot in jam or not (i’ll choose AT if i drive alot in jam, easier), maintanance cost(AT higher maintainance since need to change AT fluid every 40000km), and so on, and so on. Hope i have helped you guys to make a choice.
P/s – Sorry to hear abt the SA’s. I know they really lack knowledge on the product. However, these problem is currently being rectified. Hope you guys can hang on!
To chanel:-
The profile of the dash is still the same, how ever the center console layout has been changed. The interior has been given an exquisite touch to give an expensive look. The leather seats comes with better texture, softer and more comfortable. The mirrors are still the same though.
The shiftronic or steptronic is not same as changing gear from L to 2 to 3 and to D. Its different, the + and – minus sign is actually a totally different system, like the Savvy AMT has. Savvy AMT actually uses a manual gear box with an advance actuator and hydraulic system controlled by a special computer (TCU), wat it does is actually each time u push to + or -, rather then u pressing the clutch and moving the gear lever, the system does it for u in a split second. When u put it to D or R, the TCU tells the system to change gears with a preset engine speed interval. Its abit too lengthy too explain here but i hope u get the basic idea of it.
The AT version doesn’t have shiftronic or steptronic, however theWaja CPS AT has gated gear shift. The gated gear shift is like normal AT gear, its just that u dont need to push a button to change gear. Each gear in the gated gear shift has a grove to give a gate effect to hold or to lock the gear in place. The gear knob for the gated gear shift looks good too in the Waja CPS.
Hope this info helped u guys.
Cheers!!!
I truely admire bigfish for his effort, but everyone knows it is a very serious offence to ‘use’ someone else’s pic (in this case the logan) and modify it to looks like theirs (proton). Proton could be sued for hundred of millions or even billions for that “stupid artist’s photoshop skill”.
And to make the story more interesting, even act like CSI and pretend to know everything about photography and ‘photoshop’ing, even though he just learned it from his brother. I’m pretty sure with that small resolution, you won’t be able to examine the pictures due to pixalation during picture enlagement in photoshop. oh yes, that’s why you see smaller object blur more than the bigger object in the picture.
And, do you realise there is such thing as global illumination, indirect lighting and reflection? i guess not. I’m not going to go deep into graphic or 3D language, but we all learn science in school right? we know that yellow object will absorb all other colour in light spectrum and reflect the yellow light. this reflected colour will be picked up by the nearby object. try put yellow object on a piece of white A4 paper and you will see a yellow gradient on the paper close to the object. this can be related to bigfish’s argument on the red colour bled onto the floor surface. and why they painted the tyre with yellow and red? simply to mark and record the speed and other factor in the collision test. the test are usually recorded in a high speed camera up to 2000 pictures per second, or 1 pictures in 0.0005 second, just like gaban. hehe.
and yes, not all car have shatterproof glass on every window. usually, only on windshield. if you don’t believe me, try hit you car window, and then blame to proton for power window failure to withstand an impact :) to install safety film similar to shatterproof glass would cost me close to RM2k on my waja.
Here I am again!
I seriously dunno wats wrong with Big HEADED Fish!!! WIndow issue fully wind down, now crash issue he winds up!!! U think Proton is stupid to Photoshop a crash test? Do you there are official claims the new Saga exceeeds European, Gulf and Australian Specs? Read today’s CBT. As prem3377, definitely u have VER SHALLOW KNOWLEDGE AND TALK BIG!!! Do u think Proton would dare to claim that if there crash tests were fake??? Are YOU CRAZY???
Do you know where Proton does its crash tests? So dont simply talk big!!! Proton didn’t simply spend 440million ringgit to produce a car with fake crash test results! Proton crash test are usually done in Idiada, Spain. Usullly 5 DIFFERENT CARS are prepped and sent there to be tested. The reason 5 is once a test is done on 1 car, it cant BE USED AGAIN!!! U think, this one like kedai Ah Beng ah, ketuk ketuk balik and use back the same car? U must be out of ur mind. There are many crash test done, front crash, side impact, rear crash, roof crash, pole crash. These are the common crash test done! EACH ONE OF IT NEEDS DIFFERENT CARS!!!
The reason for the glass to shatter, is because the cabin compartment is quite air thight. Thats why when u sit inside the car, and close the door, there is a buzz in ur ear drums due to the pressure difference. All CARS THAT UNDERGOES FOR THE SIDE CRASH TEST, THEIR GLASS SHATTERS!!! That is if u ever seen a crash test pic before!!! This happens because when the wall hits u at 30km/h to 40km/h, it builds up a hig pressure in the cabin, The only way the pressure escapes, through the glass!!!
The only way a manufacturer can claim officially that their car has scored stars in a crash test if the test is done by a certified body like EuroNcap. If not, u cant claim it has 3 stars or 4 stars or watever stars. The test that is done in Idiada, Spain is only a lab test, done and evaluated under STRICT guidelines of certified bodies like EuroNcap. So, rather then they claim the cars have stars, they claim the car have exceeded European, Gulf and Australian crash standards. These countries have certain crash standard and safety requirements in order for their cars to be sold there. UNDERSTAND!!!!!
U R JUST ONE SICK, FAULT FINDING PERSON, BIG HEADED PERSON!!!
Cheers!!!
Hi Again,
Sorry some typo error in my previous comments. It should read like this in the first parag:-
I seriously dunno wats wrong with Big HEADED Fish!!! Window issue fully wind down, now crash issue he winds up!!! U think Proton is so stupid to Photoshop a crash test? Do you know that there are official claims and statements that the new Saga exceeds European, Gulf and Australian CRASH STANDARDS? Read today’s CBT. As prem3377 said, definitely u have VERY VERY VERY SHALLOW KNOWLEDGE AND ONLY KNOW HOW TO TALK BIG!!! Do u think Proton would dare to claim as such(exceeds European, Gulf and Australian CRASH STANDARDS), if the crash tests were fake??? Are YOU CRAZY???
Cheers!!!
I guess i’m wasing my time arguing with ikanbesar about the ‘photographic evidence’ and his photoshop skill. Should have let the master (si-fu) give all the fact and the ikan will be fried.
Anyway, I like this saga very much. Too bad I just bought a waja 7 months ago, if not i would have book this car. And now new waja with cps coming soon, just 1 year after i bought, then come new version? tak acii… tak adil.. waaaa….
Erm, Si-fu, will there be H-Line for the new saga?
To m08:-
Currently there wont be any H-Line version for the Saga. However i personally think, the management will see and study the market needs and response from current situation and MAYBE they might decide to come out with the H-Line version.
Regarding the Crash Test, something that i left out, The New Saga Crash Test result were EQUIVALENT to a 3-star crash rating overall.
Cheers!!!
Already book one..black color..Just wanna congrats proton for this 2nd new baby under DSZ. Selamat maju jaya. Proton boleh.
sifu,
lucky u corrected it…i was wonder why were you say i am shallow minded too..haha
was reading wat i posted time and time again..
anyway thanks for the info…and one last question…the mpv is going to be using 1.6 engine or larger capacity???pls answer or atleast give a hint..thanks
BigFish I think u are a moron by giving that stupid photoshop theory.
Dacia Logan and Saga also u dont know how to differentiate.I think Paul already fed up with your stupid comments, same like us. Go create your own blog, because we feel sick everytime we read your comments.
misspurple said,
January 21, 2008 @ 12:20 am
p/s please advice me should i take manual or auto coz later on i want to change the rim to 16″ @17″.
———
If you stay at Klang Valley and facing daily jam on the way to work. It is better take auto for practicality.
tokmoh said,
January 20, 2008 @ 10:57 pm
@BigFish
If the 2/3 opening rear window is for kid safety design, why Proton bother to put in child lock function? Furthermore, all manufacturers all over the world never claim this is new invention for kid safety features.
——————–
>>> Well, well, well!!! So all these while, people always complain Proton unsafe la, Proton killed thousands of lives which “could have been saved if only they drive a Toyota/BMW/Volvo/Merc at a price he paid for Protonâ€, Proton shud close shop coz they’ve murdered Msians, blablabla.
Here I am, reading for the first time ever, somebody is complaining about Proton putting in child lock function!! What’s wrong? Isn’t that showing Proton “not compromising safety for cost� Isn’t that showing Proton “caring for the safety of the children�
————
You misquote me, I am not complain about the installation child lock.
Go for Manual Transmission.
Not the worst looking car and definately not the best looking car either. Decent and up to market requirement. At last Proton woke up and smell the air. Hope the service center would not be sleeping all the way.
Looking forward to test drive the car and see if it really worth our hard earned money.
Keep it up Proton!
spacious than persona – the back seat. my next car?maybe. :)
BigFish said,
January 20, 2008 @ 5:13 pm
PHOTO 1:
I think you never see the real crash test or from crash test video clips or REAL EVENTS. Everything only from photos. Go to www.euroncap.com. For example the Volvo C30 (2007 model) side impact result. You can see the glass / window also brake into pieces. Don’t tell me the glass / window still “stick together” as you said when 50KM/h (30mph) impact is put on the glass / windows doesn’t brake into pieces!!!!!
Photos – everything will be “stop” or “pause” once you took the photos. So, those side impact photos that you saw mostly are because they took it at the moment the impact just happend and not all a bit longer or the way through it finished.
You want to see what happen next, look at the video clips.
PHOTO 2:
You know why all those tyres have been painted and the colour of the car so blured instead of shining looking car? This is so called the internal testing and more like a early stages of crash tests by car manufacturers as all this will be digitize in digital format into computer to anaylize. Improvements will be made stage by stage again if necessary until the final products is finished. Only then you can see those shining looking cars retest again by each manufacturers including those like in the EuroNCAP web site as final results. For EuroNCAP, they will see the end results only and not necessary for them to digitize into their computer again.
wahlaueh…
hot…HOT topic…. & many xxx comments… lazy to read all…
My personal opinion feel that not bad from P1. I am P1 basher… but i still think we need to really step in & feel then only can give correct comment for this long….long await SAGA.
Regarding changing RIM & tyre. Any one can searh in internet for wheel size conversion. this is to check varience for original to new wheel diameter which will affect speedometer reading (plus or less km/h as compare to original wheel)
Frankly speaking, the out look still acceptable, but the interior is too plastic feel and look cheap especially the central panel, very very old fashion. I think this only canbeat Proton own car, maybe Viva also, but definitely not Myvi. Check out also the sound when close the door also. I go with the showroom wit my Myvi, just park infront the showroom, the salesman don even dare to say anything when i critisise the Saga. There’s only one thing it can proud of it is the PRICE. For ppl who cant even afford a Viva can really consider this, if u don mind inside is too plastic feel.
Have been reading comments on this blog for months but never been interested to post until this new saga came out. Went to two dealers to check out the car (both b line auto). Exterior design is nice but interior not as nice as persona but comparable to Myvi. Wanted to see a manual (to check whether the gear is as high as the photos). Also wanted to see a M line to check out the differences but also not available.
Test driven a persona previously and plan to test drive this saga to compare but don’t think the drive will be good as persona but probably better than Myvi.
Overall, good value for money.
tokmoh said,
January 19, 2008 @ 10:14 pm
==agreed, is more powerful than myvi, because it has bigger engine cc. more powerful than wira 1.5 because 1.3 campro is new generation engine and hv additional 4 valves. somemore hv this IAFM to help out. it has to be better if not will be dissapointed.
is good to hv this model with that price as especially for first time car owner.
mr bigfish, (by the way,.. have you paid your annual royalty to Burger King for using their product trade mark..?. if not , you better use different nick)
What you said so far :
1) people who like Proton cars are all Proton salesman. FALSE. I like proton cars, and I owned a Proton car,.. but I am not, and never work as a Proton salesman or promoting Proton cars to anybody to get rewarded as salary or commission. I believe this also true for thousands other Proton car owners. We are not Proton salesman.
2) Rear window can’t be opened fully so the New Saga is a lousy product. FALSE. People who bought other makes (which are more pricier) never complained about their 1/3 or 2/3 or whatever small opening on their rear windows. Only YOU and YOU who complaned on this, because it is a Proton car.
3) Proton faking-up their crash test results. FALSE. You create false stories and more false statements just to satisfy yourself and degrading the others. You claimed you magnified the crash test photos and did your owned CSI-styled investigation on the photos. ( .. ??? ) what can i say, you are really childish and more or less a very self centric soul with nothing else to do..? wake up man,.. other than spending hours of your time looking for others fault, why don;t you go out and have a cofee with your girlfriends, or go take a vacation somewhere.
4) and more other things and stetement and claims which i think not worth anything other than some piles of rubbish talks. That includes you type of “Quality Assessment Test” which ketuyk-ketuk here, bang – bang door here,.. scratch here and there,. you know,,.? that really shows you a very lonely type of person whose really need a special attention and something to be corrected in you mind before you go out and see people. You better work for a defence and military manufacturer where you can ketuk-ketuk and bang – bang the door of the Army Tanks before they’re out of the production lines.
whatever la mr BigFish. hope you will grow up and be a matured person very soon.
:peace:
hail to r BIG FISH.. he is our own Jeremy Clarkson kekekeke
willing to sacrifice and spent lots of time to find a small detail of ant defect..
i think proton better give him one unit of tis saga for two or three week, for him to strip off all components..and come out with his own fault defect.. which i think more than 400 pages of defect..
already saw the saga but unable to test drive..
nice front design…
Si-fu,
Jangan ambil hati la bro. Maybe later can ask Big Fish to come up with DCS for RR window glass to MSG or TSG and quote them. Request for double curvature and see la wheteher can still manage the total cost planed. Or even better, take him as Cost planner + CAE/CAD Engineer/Designer even contributing in Styling Dept. Hey, that sounds like TM, no?
Kudos to the gang la at ED – Body design. Powertrain and ED Equip as well. A job well done (but still need kaizen la bnyk improvement still needed)
BigFish said,
January 20, 2008 @ 9:55 am
si-fu said,
January 20, 2008 @ 9:42 am
Hello Everyone!
Generally:
This 2/3 window wind down at the back is common nowdays, as most manufacturers uses it as a cost cutting measure. SEE OTHER CARS, LIKE PERODUA, TOYOTA, HONDA(A and B segment cars) and so on, they have similar ‘design constraints’ and its quite common in the automovite design industry. Another thing Mr. Big Fish, I would like to remind you that A CHILD LOCK SAFETY FEATURE ONLY PREVENTS THE CHILD FROM UNLOCKING THE DOOR NOT UNWINDING THE WINDOW!!!
————
Your first reasoning “common†and “cost cutting†and “design constraint†have some basis.
But to say it is for child safety reason, there is no “official†claim from any manufacturer! Normally central window lock at driver seat is function as to “disable†rear button to prevent child play with the window is commonly available in the market, including Waja.
==mate, there’s official claim before, i just couldn’t remember where they i hv read beforem maybe BS standards or manufacturers. anyway, don’t bother to find it, can be searched.
if i’m not mistaken, this saga comes with real spare tyre, not the small&tiny one like “kereta sorong”. i find it (saga) very convenient, in case if the spare tyre needs to be replaced. consider this case: one of my friend owns a car that uses this small&tiny spare tyre told me that it was difficult to find one if the spare tyre exhausted due to wear&tear.
moreover, my suggestion is, proton should make the hinges at the doors to be more easy to shut. the current design is good, but i wish the hinges to be “smoother” i.e. less effort to make the doors shut, like most in continental cars.
PEACE :)