Most of the world’s major manufacturers are really into ‘downsizing’ their engines now to improve CO2 emissions and provide better torque. A new breed of 1.4 to 1.6 litre light turbocharged engines are replacing normally aspirated 2.0 litres, mainly in Europe.
Some statistics point to a fuel economy savings of up to 20% over normally normally aspirated rivals. Even our national carmaker Proton is looking into a Campro Turbo project, which basically allows our 1.6 litre block to make the power equivalent to a 2.0 litre or larger engine.
But a UK company called Warranty Direct claims that turbocharged cars are more likely to breakdown today compared to their normally aspirated rivals.
They also claim that half the cars built in Europe are turbocharged, and this number could rise up to 85% by the year 2020.
Of course, data such as this benefits companies like Warranty Direct, which sell extended warranty coverage which you can buy for your car when your manufacturer warranty expires. So there is a hidden motive in them delivering this message to the public. But if it is backed by data, it could warrant a little worry.
Companies like Toyota and Honda which have not followed this downsizing trend would be smiling at this piece of news as well. So far Japanese manufacturers haven’t really done much to develop such ‘downsized’ engines, except for Nissan which shares its new small turbo engine with Renault.
There really shouldn’t be nothing to worry about within the first 5 years or so of ownership if you really follow your service schedule. Owners of Golf GTI, Peugeot 308, MINI Cooper S, etc etc, any problems with your engine so far?
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If i not mistaken, long time ago Turbo engine maintenance have been proven to be more costly than N/A engine as they have more part to service, such like turbo, inter-cooler, blow-off, sensor… The benefits is more better power and for diesel better FC.
Besides that, Turbo engine need more changing or better lubricant as the heat of the turbo deteriorates the lubricant faster. Yup, i do agree if given to normal foe driving a turbo vehicle may end up more failure incident if not sensitive about the vehicle condition.
Even i have seen a lot of Kancil Turbo kong due to excessive mod or not service regularly.. As a lot of owner tot that owning turbo kancil is like owning a normal N/A car?!? What a big mistake! Is totally different world for both turbo and N/A engine!
As paul also mention "There really shouldn’t be nothing to worry about within the first 5 years or so of ownership if you really follow your service schedule."
If you service ur car regularly, u dont have to worry much..
Yes, aftermarket turbos usually meant for higher output i.e. more power. Hence, the engine's durability is reduced if not turbocharged properly and serviced regularly.
i tink its the turbo itself that have a higher failure rate rather than the engine itself….
no complaints from my evo gang, so far so good…
just don't get into too much of turbo-maniac-syndrom esp for the 1st timer. and follow your service intervals. that's all it needs.
=off topic=
mcrae in neo s2000 scored podium (no. 2) in scotland's intercontinental rally championship last week. no 1 is guy wilks (ex-neo driver) in skoda.
I haven't heard any problems from SAAB owners, they still keep their cars after 30 years owning it
every part have wear and tear, shock absobers, cv joints, bearings, including turbos,
you need a car and cars need you too
well obviously, turbo engine are not as reliable as NA engines. think about it, forcing air into an engine and making the engine spin at higher speed than it is intended.
but, with proper tuning and modification, i dont think turbo engine are very much different from an NA lifespan.
even a properly serviced modded turbo can outlast a old and unserviced NA engine.
turbo introduce more pressure on the engine, so the engine itself needs to be modified to handle more torque and pressure.
car manufacturers, when designing their engine around turbo considers this.
car modders, who slap a turbo/intercooler did not consider this, hence high rate of failure…
sudah sekarang turbo no good. Exora still in thhis direction , wakakakakak
About 10% increase only ma…
im driving a golf gti with stage 1 tune and so far.. touch wood nothing major happens. i believe VW engineers would do alot of stress test before putting into production. The only part that i worry is not the engine nor turbine, is the gearbox. So end of the day, engineers that build cars with turbo surely do stress test with max output and not blowing anything but always remember auto gearbox got a life spent and by pusing them harder = shorter life. So Service engine oil and gearbox oil before the intervals is the best thing to do for turbo cars. Nothing major will happen if turbo is already came stock with the car. Same goes to my bro Volvo V40, nothing major happen eventho the car already more than10 years.. or maybe some wear and tear or old parts not working very well, i assume is normal for everycar.
mouse u forgot to mention GTI service interval is 15k, even for the first service.
this a joke for me.
people those crazy about turbo and hp ,
they don't event care about how much money they spent!
thousands ringgit doesn't matter! as long as the HP increase!
Speak about maintenance cost.. oh come on!. there's so many amoi, lenglui, ahso, awek, toyotafan, japanwannabefan etc out side there.. most of them don't know car maintenance. Even to check the engine oil, brake oil, coolant and worse..to change puncture tyre also dont know!
but it bet it's really different with Turbo, Hp madness person!.
they do know MOST!
i have 3 turbo car, volvo s60 T5, airtrek turbo and proton waja 4g18p 1.6 sohc +turbokit …. actually, if you follow the maintanance schedule, all is just be fine and always in good working condition …. since my volvo and airtrek is originally turbo engine, my waja is diffrent story… it is originally NA engine from proton… i install full the turbokit parts into it with stock internal engine parts, boosting at 0.5bar…. when i install the turbo, my milage just 80,000km …. now after running more then 3 years, my milage already reach 223,000km… with the right setting and tuning, still the engine in very good working condition without any minor or major problem …. just do the maintanance every 5000km …. so for me , im not agree the statment that turbo is higher to maintain compare to NA engine … also you can view my waja turbo setup here:
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2969189
"Companies like Toyota and Honda which have not followed this downsizing trend would be smiling at this piece of news as well."
Yes, because Toyota has currently a market share of 5.3 percent in the whole EU:
http://www.reuters.com/article/GCA-autos/idUSTRE5…
And Honda has a market share of 2 percent… ;)
Dear brothers, have a look at your warranty booklet. sometimes the manufacturer only warrant certain parts until 200k km. In the end when u wanna claim the warranty, they come back to you ahhh..
Sorry sir your engine is warrant until 2 year only….
the one under extended warranty is only valid for bla bla bla… Sigh
PROTON Powertrain's engineers, please take note for this issue for the Campro Turbo Project… Thanks for the info Paul! :)
using 308 turbo… no problems
have to echo what mouse says..
not worried about the engine but more of the gearbox
FYI, for Japanese or old turbo engine u might need to install turbo timer
so after a hard run it will let the engine continue running to pump oil engine to lubricate the turbine shaft, before turning off the engine
in modern turbo.. European especially, example like 308.. after a hard run the ECU will detect that engine temperature is high, so even after the engine is turned off.. the engine fan will keep on running and the engine oil pump will also keep on running to feed oil into turbine shaft until temperature have come down sufficiently .. so no turbo timer needed
so long as u follow maintenance schedule evething should be alrite
308 thp oil change every 10k km
Imagine the complains if Proton put turbo in their cars…
I think better follow Honda's Toyota way. Make it fuel efficient as possible rathen than adding a pump which puts in more air into the chamber
even mercedes that using kompressor/supercharge can get kong that things, after 5 years need to replace the kompressor.
but that things help the small engine pushing hard like bigger engine although periodically have to replace the kompressor
waranty direct??
right… of course… they would published something like this..
especially in europe where people loves turbo cars (turbo diesel, turbo petrol)..
since now they can get people to buy their waranty..
right… I can only take their advice with lots of salt and MSG because I find it hard to swallow..
I dont care, if it can provide more power, its a small cost to pay. I want turbo
If looking at most manufacture's specs, the low-pressure turbo will be the best for small engine to increase the engine horsepower. As Exora BOT project done by proton was producing 280bhp, but for production is was reduced to 160++bhp. So my assumption the boost pressure is at most 0.5 bar, which abit higher from low-pressure turbo.
The benefits of small engine turbo in Malaysia is mostly on the road tax and excise duty, cause you don't have to pay 2.0l tax and excise for the 2.0l akin powered engine.
Having had several turbo cars, and some modified, reliability is not bad.
Leave it as it was intended and you will have many years of reliable service.
If you ignore maintenance of any engine, you will sacrifice reliability.
I would take that report with a grain of salt. People who end up buying turbo cars do actually end up driving them harder. If you whack your car, you wont expect it to last. However this is usually balanced somewhat by the knowledge to properly maintain the car.
I know. 4.8s to 100 is very grin inducing experience (if you can live with the clutch torture).
My car was making upwards of 300hp and the Turbo on it is 12 years old, and has 230k kms on it. I blew the headgasket once because I had mis-tuned the car by leaning it out too much.
Aircraft engines have been turbocharged/supercharged for ages before jets (they still do now for regional props) and trust me, they work a lot harder than your car's engine.
Look at it this way, it wasn't reliablility (or lack of) of turbo engines that it fell out of favour with manufacturers in the late 90s. Turbo engines had some issues with emissions regulations. Now with direct injection and close coupled Cat converters, much of the emisions issues are dealt with…which is why they are coming back.
ayamxxx said,
December 2, 2009 @ 9:07 am
even mercedes that using kompressor/supercharge can get kong that things, after 5 years need to replace the kompressor.
but that things help the small engine pushing hard like bigger engine although periodically have to replace the kompressor
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Replace the supercharger periodically? Are you kidding?
mystvearn said,
December 2, 2009 @ 8:39 am
Imagine the complains if Proton put turbo in their cars…
I think better follow Honda’s Toyota way. Make it fuel efficient as possible rathen than adding a pump which puts in more air into the chamber
——————
Follow Honda's Toyota way???
My S60 turbo gave me more problems than my wife's S40 NA 2.0
BTW: What are the absolute Numbers of this 'Warranty Direct' study ?
What does 'Average incident' rate mean ?
Take the 26% 'Average incident' rate of a non-turbo petrol car: Does it mean that 26% of all non-turbo petrol cars in Europe, insured by 'Warranty Direct', break down ?
Every Proton Saga from 1985 would be more reliable…
turbocharged makes sense in malaysia, save a lot on road tax
I don't think a car that comes as turbo gives much issue, as compared to BOT cars. Ppl just dunno how to take care when driving it, some like me, use to drive an N/A car hard, right from the moment I start up in the morning instead of waiting foe the temp to reach operation level to step on the pedal, it was horrible of me.
Some award winning small engines have turbo such as the renault 1.2 turbo in Clio (similar to SAVVY) and 1.4 VW TSI. So whats the problem?
The award winning 1.2 engine in clio and VW 1.4 has turbo.
Award winning 1.2 engine in Clio has turbo and VW 1.4 has turbo.
I am planning to get a 2002 Volvo V40. Any advise? What must I check as part of the due diligence? The Gear box? The Turbo??? Help!
I want suggestions on my Skoda – Laura L & K manual, 2006 Model, the engine goes off stating check emmision. Again if I start, it;’;s on for few minutes and goes off. Please advice the probable cause of the above captioned topic.
Warm Wishes.
Banerjee