The deadline for the announcement of Proton’s new partner is coming soon, but talks do not seem to be conclusive for favorites Volkswagen and PSA Peugoet Citroen. Previously, Second Finance Minister Nor Mohamad Yakcop said Proton’s foreign strategic partner would be announced by the end of this month. This bad news adds more grief to the recent announcement of Proton’s 3rd straight quarterly loss.
Business weekly The Edge reported that talks between Proton and Volkswagen have hit a bumpy patch, and Volkswagen seems to be getting less and less keen as time passes by. It’s said that Volkswagen’s recently changed top management never really did agree to the Proton idea as much as the previous management did, so the deal might just be off if whatever problems the discussions are having right now are not sorted out quickly.
As for PSA Peugeot Citroen, it’s CEO Christian Streiff told newspaper Le Figaro that the French automaker has dropped all talks with Proton over a possible alliance. “Concerning alliances, I do not want to extend them to new partners. I would rather continue to get the most of out of the best alliances we have at the moment,” said Streiff, further reinforcing the statement that PSA would have nothing to do with Proton. It already has an alliance with a Malaysian automaker, Naza, which assembles the Peugeot 206 for local consumption as well as right hand drive exports.
(6/3/2007) UPDATE: An official press statement by PSA Peugeot Citroen continued to add that “PSA Peugeot Citroen has decided to discontinue the discussions launched in September 2006 with Proton. The talks focused on a possible co-operative venture to support the development of Peugeot and Citroen in Malaysia and to serve as a production base for the marques’ sales operations in the ASEAN region. An in-depth study of the automobile market and the economic conditions for co-producing vehicles with Proton concluded that the conditions for the project’s success were not present.”
News about Proton-General Motors talks have been almost non-existent, and GM is most probably having it’s hands full with the possible acquisition of Chrysler from DaimlerChrysler. So where does this put Proton?
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When will our gov wake up from their denial of reality? Proton is in no position to bargain. On hand they wanted money and technology from prospective partners, on the other hand they want NEP style control. Who on earth would agree to that kind of condition?
Paul: So where does this put Proton?
Somewhere precariously near the edge of a cliff :p
govt should just relinquish control of proton. live or die its up to how the company plans its future. i know it may sound cruel to the ppl working in there but i suppose they hv no choice. they must let market forces decide. if they make crap stuff, then change it to sell better. why must they develop niche models when they do not even have a strong foothold today is beyond me. and through their greed to make more per car, they have to push other car prices up. perhaps its best left to market forces to decide the company's fate? if the performance of proton overseas is an indication of things to be, then the govt might as well sell it off cheaply now and cut losses early and at least save some jobs and not to mention the much wanted 'face'.
Im not being Bias, but if Tan Sri Nasimuddin can established Naza from nothing, by nothing i mean NOTHINGGG! He came from a poor family. Why not give him a chance of running Proton? At the same time, Naza should get support from the govt + One strategic foreign partner for developments, utilization of platforms for cost effiency etc. what say u people?
i respect tan sri for what he's achieved, but saying he started from nothing is untrue, he started from nothing and APs.
Where to put P1, gone with the wind lah!
Lol hehe :)
true paul, but it takes more than APs to build what he has.
Back to Proton, i think all they need is good management. Honestly! How can u move forward when the chairman and MD dont even talk to each other?
Proton going to sold to WV for 1 pound soon….. lolz
Tan Sri Nasimuddin started with nothing, then the boom of second hand cars in the 80's, then the AP "besan" a.k.a menantu stuff then now.
Hi All,
All wayang kulit will start its transmission again when the deadline approaching. maybe VW and PSA is playing jual mahal.
imho, if tan sri Nasi win, his most logical strategic alliance would be PSA. The PSA CEO did mentioned he would rather continue to get the most of out of the best alliances they have at the moment. The fact is NAZA is one of alliances that they currently have (if it not limited to one-off deal for the 206). So, NAZA-Potong-PSA relationship is valid.
But you know lah M'sia.. Malaysia boleh… anything can happen.
However, beside this piece of news, "all is quite on the western front"…. its like calm before the storm.. eerie..
Most of us been waiting for this moment for a very very long time. The possible demise of the original Potong. The very existance that deprieve most of us quality automobile at affordable, if not, make sense cost.
But just have the thought at the back of my mind that the G surely gonna disappoint the rakyat again like what they blatantly plan and did with the bloody NAP.
Good luck to the real rakyat.
i'm tired of listening to proton besok lusa attitude and muka tebal tak tau malu. I bet those stupid cabinet minister will pull in the sleepy bumiputra involment to run proton. If Proton don't merge before June, they are as good as dead. The rakyat will be summon to pay the royalty fees to bring up proton.
I can't understand why G so SLOW and thinking their Proton a gem in motoring world. Delaying just make matter worst. VW 'need' Proton to penetrate Japanese market (as benefit from Malaysian-Japanese FTA) as well as their presence in Southeast Asia (or Asians sans China market).
Proton's Tg Malim plant too give them edge provided everything (market environment) alright. The PROBLEM is Proton is nowhere in auto industry though they got Lotus in their hand. Lotus nowhere near BMW's MINI future (strong positioning and fans as retro car). Even VW's Beetle mark II don't enjoy privilege of MINI under BMW.
For me let market forces decide! Period. Though hurt but what matter most is BUSINESS SENSE/POINT OF VIEW. We can't simply include "NEP" features merely to protect incompetence business related to Proton. I already talk to a Proton manager back in 1999, they (Proton) have no (sound) marketing strategy. Proton only afford to force poor rakyats to buy their undesired cars (some later models pretty OK, like Neo though not enough to command substantial market share).
If G not too demanding, l guess VW will happy to take Proton and turn it around like Czech's Skoda or Spaniard's SEAT, especially the former. VW not enjoy same league like their Germans brethrens, BMW, Mercedes or AUDI but enough to topple brand like Fords, GMs, due to their quality and they enjoy premium compare to these brands. For instance Focus eand the likes always cheaper than GOLF.
My 2 sen
Well… always dignity and face.. they are scare what are show from the Thai's people of what their ex-prime minister done to them. But their market are more better then us. After their thai government open market, their currency are more stronger then us day by day ( Last month friend change RM1 to 8bath only, not 10bath anymore..) If u got some time go to bangkok and see those companies and buildings but not those ladies. I will tell u, bangkok are now more advance then KL.. Even Thai ppl are more better then us, Taxi are Toyota Altis and a whole city trip only cost less then RM20. All the new cars can be seen over there like Nissan TiiDA, TEANA ( Facelifted already!), New Frontier even better with 144hp and 6 speed manuals, Toyota Fortuner 3.0 turbo diesel, New 2007 vios, Camry also got 3.0 v6. That why those Islamic rebel's are jealous to the government and lunched attack to those innocent people.. Money and face are now in the government hands.. the oldies will want the P1 to be control by Malaysian, But for those people who learn modern business and economics will want VW to join with P1. See at what Skoda done.. Even their quality, safety, engine performance and overall rating are more better then any P1 cars… What lotus handling.. Even lotus u cant handle well and the basics are shaking.. Hei! P1 GO BACK TO THE BASIC MAN! AND GET A PERSON TO COOPERATE! YOU ARE NOT SUPERMAN AND DON'T WASTE OUR TAX MONEY! PERODUA CAN SURVIVE AND LIVE BETTER THEN U! LOOK AT THE MIRROR AND TELL ARE U DOING THE RIGHT THING FOR THE PEOPLE OF MALAYSIA! STUPID NAP AND AP's.. I think i will support the opposite parties next election.. Rumours also said this may will be a selection coming…
its vw definatly , u wait til 1st march n see…..!
Seems now that people are shying away from getting involved in P1. Paul what about P1's savings … all depleted by end of March? People keep chanting VW, VW, VW like a mantra but I don't think VW has the model lineup to compete in the where Proton is. Furthermore Proton did nothing to stop P2 moving out from the under 1.0L segment (or am I mistaken? Did they do anything?) and now they are paying the price. The real competitor for Proton is P2.
Better sell all the proton's share before too late…
Potong will be soon appear on our school's history book.
TUTUP lah, malu!
I do not undestand why we should give praise to Naza!! To Proton is bad, but Naza is worse. Proton at least not direct re-badging the car and sell. But Naza only go short cut by re-badging the car and sell 30% cheaper. Our NAP help to push the car price by 100%, and Naza is given a right to re-badge it and sell 30% cheaper, so they still make 70% higher margin compared to oversea's market. Come on, even a dump can make tons of money with this type of arrangemnent.
i heard yesterday news, saying govt is preferring PSA over Volkswagen. dont know the detail tho
Believe me, business can only be done by the business people, not the G. Period.
That why those Islamic rebel’s are jealous to the government and lunched attack to those innocent people
CAN YOU IN FUTURE NOT TO USE THIS KIND OF STATEMENT.APOLOGIES WILL BE ACCEPTED , I'M NOT A REBELS BUT TO USE THE ISLAMIC AND REBELS TOGETHER NOT SO COMFORATBLE TO READ.
Layman – Sorry but how long has naza been in the market 4 years? Proton = Like forever?
Im not being bias with Naza, thats my personal opinion. Proton started with rebadging as well and now theyve developed their own models. And im happy for Proton but theyre not cost efficient.
The amount they spent vs The amount of units that are sold are just not wise.
Instead of competing with one another, i think naza and proton should share platform to promote cost effectiveness. Then both of them can make money and compete not only locally but internationally.
If bigger companies like PSA, Citroen and Toyota are willing to do joint development, i dont see why Naza and Proton cant.
Come on people! I want out automotive side to grow and i think they have potential. Just gotta get the right people
carlover, how to share platform between P1 and Naza since non of them have platform that can be share and achieve economic of scale. Naza have none (all rebadge) and P1 (Gen-2?, Savvy?, Satria Neo?), even there is a benefits of doubt about their claim these cars is based on their platform/chassis!
P1 close shop, dismantel NAP and every customer and tax payer happy. At least remove the burden on the rakyat to paid NAP tax and use their tax to prop up P1. If P1 want to survive, let them export and earn foreign currency, not suck local RM to be in existence!
When PROTON has experienced of sold off the AG Bike company for 1 Euro, NOw EVERYbody is Waiting for the BIG NEW YEAR SALE again.
Tengku, DRB, NASI, PSA and VW are waiting for the Sale…………
Come on Proton, Sell to me lah, I willing to pay you 2 EUROs. 100% higher then your offer value.
Joe Ooi, its definitely their platform. Gen 2, Waja and if im right satria neo is on the same platform that was developed in conjuction with Lotus.
Even if im wrong, Naza and Proton can buy a platform to be shared. You can buy them nowdays easily, trust me i know :)
But yea, it not as easy as it sounds…but i just both of them can collaborate
This current scenerio is expected even at the beginning of negotioans to decide and determine Proton's position.
As how i commented before and still insist that this Peugeot and VW will not materialise.Reasons i cannot disclose due to confidentiality.
IMHO a Japanese based automaker will most likely be Proton's main partner.Although theres no media coverage on this and no concrete reports that theres a possible tie up to any Japanese sdn.bhd.
It has also come to my knowledge that P1 and P2 indded are working togather behind all these puppet shows but as to platform sharing or otherwise it cant be verified specifically.
They do have collaboration and technology sharing done on a regular basis but most likely related to manufacturing facilities capabilities as P1 Tg.Malim plant is adopting the latest TOYOTA Production System (TPS). Correct me if im wrong on this.
Maybe Paul has a better source :)
To the best of my knowledge, Waja is based on Lancer platform but I don't have info on Gen-2 and Savvy. Anyway, there are even P1 saleman told me Satria Neo platform is based on Satria (the lenght is same). Anyway, what I know is to share platform, it must be on global scale (export market) as to achieve cost efficient. It must be selling at least 500,000 units just to recoup the investment ( – profit) during the life cycle of those model, normally up to 5 year only for Japs car.
ben_g_khorkhor said,
"This current scenerio is expected even at the beginning of negotioans to decide and determine Proton’s position.
As how i commented before and still insist that this Peugeot and VW will not materialise.Reasons i cannot disclose due to confidentiality."
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What kind of confidentiality since it is "open secret" about P1's "rock-head" on maintaining NAP, "pride, national icon, local product" etc, etc, etc. The man on the road do not required CEO from Fortune 500, Carlos Ghosh or the like or need Peu or VW to tell us why it is not materialize. Look at quality, safety, NAP, cronies, AP king, croc any saint investor will shun this kind of entities without conrolling stake!
Joe Ooi said,
What kind of confidentiality since it is “open secret†about P1’s “rock-head†on maintaining NAP, “pride, national icon, local product†etc, etc, etc. The man on the road do not required CEO from Fortune 500, Carlos Ghosh or the like or need Peu or VW to tell us why it is not materialize. Look at quality, safety, NAP, cronies, AP king, croc any saint investor will shun this kind of entities without conrolling stake!
__________________________
Bro Joe , thanks for the heads up.
Yes i am well aware of these "open secrets".The open secrets are just rather some of the minor contributing factors related to this tie-up deal.There are other major factors involved which like i mention i cant say.Certainly theres a whole lot more beyond the NAP,national pride,buatan malaysia etc..etc..etc.
As i mention previously, P1 does not function as a business entity rather a political entity of sorts thats the source of side income for certain groups of people with the expense of the now famous word TAXPAYERS money.
Malaysia Lu Memang Boleh!
Potong involve too much politic, it is not wise for business, always business first, too much politic, it corrupts the proper business system.
Whatever, I just to have cheaper car, we have suffer too long with this ridiculous car price…
PS: Not everyone in bolehland make 10k per month.
Layman I think ur wrong, cos P2 is doing the same thing and making even more profit.
No wonder why Proton higher-ups are leaving…
PROTON is an abondon child now. Nobody wants…