Toyotas running away from their owners are occuring at a frequent rate these days, but are all cases genuine or is there something sinister behind the allegations? Could it be like the scandals facing celebrities, where the first few bonafide revelations open the gates for many “victims” trying to “cash in” on the situation?
One James Sikes called 911 earlier this month, saying that his 2008 Prius was traveling at a high rate of speed, the accelerator pedal was stuck, and that the vehicle was out of control and could not be stopped. The operator repeatedly instructed the driver to shift the car into N and turn off the power button. A California Highway Patrol officer intercepted the vehicle and instructed the driver to press firmly on the brakes, apply the emergency brake and turn off the car, at which time the Prius came to a safe stop.
Toyota engineers employed data analysis, static and dynamic testing and inspected all related components of the “problem car”. A final report is not due yet, but there are “strong indications that the driver’s account of the event is inconsistent with the findings of the preliminary analysis”. Toyota believes that Sikes’ assertion that the vehicle could not be stopped with the brakes is fundamentally inconsistent with basic vehicle design and investigation findings. A congressional staff member and NHTSA officers were present during Toyota’s examination, and the latter are conducting their own investigations.
Among the points raised by the embattled carmaker were that Sikes’ car’s accelerator pedal was tested and found to be working normally (the Prius is not subject to the sticky accelerator pedal recall) and the floor mat wasn’t even touching the gas pedal. During testing, Toyota abused the brakes on purpose by continuous light application in order to overheat them. The vehicle could be safely stopped by means of the brake pedal, even when overheated, and there were also no diagnostic trouble codes found in the power management computer.
Read Toyota’s full press release on its findings after the jump. Toyota Offers Preliminary Findings From Technical Field Examination of Alleged ‘Runaway Prius’ in San Diego
Toyota Engineers Conclude Two Days of Investigation; Driver’s Account Of Event Inconsistent With Initial Findings
SAN DIEGO, March 15 – At a press conference today, Toyota Motor Sales (TMS), U.S.A., Inc. offered key preliminary findings of technical field examination and testing that were performed on March 10 and 11 regarding an alleged “runaway Prius” event dramatically covered by national news media.
Toyota engineers completed an investigation of the 2008 Prius driven by Mr. James Sikes that was the subject of a 911 emergency call on Monday, March 8. The driver reported that the vehicle was traveling at a high rate of speed, the accelerator pedal was stuck, and that the vehicle was out of control and could not be stopped. The emergency operator repeatedly instructed the driver to shift the car into neutral and turn off the power button.
A California Highway Patrol officer intercepted the vehicle and instructed the driver to press firmly on the brakes, apply the emergency brake and turn off the car, at which time the Prius came to a safe stop.
While a final report is not yet complete, there are strong indications that the driver’s account of the event is inconsistent with the findings of the preliminary analysis.
Toyota engineers employed data download/analysis, static and dynamic testing as well as thorough inspections of all relative components. In addition, they retraced the reported driving route taking into account driving time and accounts from the 911 recording.
The investigation revealed the following initial findings:
* The accelerator pedal was tested and found to be working normally with no mechanical binding or friction. It should be noted that the Prius is not subject to a recall for sticking accelerator pedals and the Prius component is made by a different supplier than the one recalled. The Prius braking system uses both conventional hydraulic friction brakes and a regenerative braking system which switches the electric drive motors into brakes to generate electricity. The system features a sophisticated self-protection function which cuts engine power if moderate brake pedal pressure is applied and the accelerator pedal is depressed more than approximately 50 percent, in effect providing a form of “brake override.”
This function, which is intended to protect the system from overload and possible damage, was found to be functioning normally during the preliminary field examination.
Toyota engineers believe that it would be extremely difficult for the Prius to be driven at a continuous high speed with more than light brake-pedal pressure, and that the assertion that the vehicle could not be stopped with the brakes is fundamentally inconsistent with basic vehicle design and the investigation observations.
These findings suggest that there should be further examination of Mr. Sikes account of the events of March 8.
NHTSA investigators were present during Toyota’s examination, and are conducting their own investigation of the vehicle and its performance. Toyota’s examination was also observed by a congressional staff member.
PRESS RELEASE
* The front brakes showed severe wear and damage from overheating. The rear brakes and parking brake were in good condition and functional.
* A Toyota carpeted floor mat of the correct type for the vehicle was installed but not secured to the retention hooks. It was not found to be interfering or even touching the accelerator pedal.
* The pushbutton power switch worked normally and shut the vehicle off when depressed for 3 seconds as the 911 operator advised Mr. Sikes to do.
* The shift lever also worked normally and neutral could be selected. The neutral position is clearly marked and can be easily engaged by moving the lever left to the “N” marking.
* There were no diagnostic trouble codes found in the power management computer, nor was the dashboard malfunction indicator light activated. The hybrid self-diagnostic system did show evidence of numerous, rapidly repeated on-and-off applications of both the accelerator and the brake pedals.
* After examination of individual components, the front brakes were replaced and the vehicle was test driven, during which the vehicle was observed to be functioning normally.
* During testing, the brakes were purposely abused by continuous light application in order to overheat them. The vehicle could be safely stopped by means of the brake pedal, even when overheated.
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toyota image is sinking day by day~
deeper and deeper even it is not a malaysian case..
tebabooom !!!
err…how about installing a "black box" to a car?
later if anything happen, investigator can collect data from the black box easily :P
1st
Typical American. If possible, they want to sue everyone.
Remember the case of McDonalds hot coffee spilled between her knees? Later she sued McD because the cup doesn't say the coffee is hot..Doooohhh! Same goes for Toyota. Americans want to save GM, they put blame on Toyota..
I really belive that the driver didn't make up the story. For what? Toyota gonna replace the defact car with a new one…? Yeah right, like that gonna happen. Maybe is not hardware problem…is the software….
looking for easy money.
eleh…toyota upah si Sikes tu utk pulihkan reputasi…nak tnjuk diorg tak salah
:)
Americans taking advantage of the situation… no shame…
farghmee said,
March 16, 2010 @ 3:40 pm
err…how about installing a “black box” to a car?
later if anything happen, investigator can collect data from the black box easily
= = = =
There was a proposal in Europe to do that and the Police wanted the rights to download the data at random from cars as this meant that the Police could have evidence that the drivers were speeding without any form of patrol. Win for the Police.
Immediately shot down by Consumer Groups for loss of Privacy.
Toyota liar + sux
too many political interferences…
Toyota's explanation is sound and logical from and engineering perspective. The basic mechanical function of the brake system on the Prius would allow the driver to slow down the vehicle even if the accelarator is floored. Will be interesting to see what the NHTSA have to report. It could be a genuine software failure, but it does not make sense that the driver could not slow down the vehicle even when instructed by the 911 operator, but miraculously could when the highway patrol showed up.
Toyota builds crap cars, guess I was right about them all along. You don't feel connected when driving a Toyota, the steering feels uncommunicative, the brakes have no feel, the automatic gearbox are slow and the accelerator pedal response is too immediate or sluggish. They need to build their car properly judging from the way their car behaves on the road.
toyota just care about money nowdays
So, how is it possible could the front brakes showed severe wear and damage?
If engine power is cut just by pressing 50% of the pedal.
Unless, "a ghost in the machine".
ooops conspiracy…..I wonder how much did he paid to put down the prius.
Yanks will anything for fame and money…..
People seem to forget that this entire recall mess is from a statistically minute cases of (even unproven) unintended acceleration and brake failure.
I'm not a big fan of toyota but this is going overboard.
True, toyota's are not drivers cars, and precisely the point why they sold well, to old people. Not to point fingers, but the demographics doesn't suggest the best drivers out there….
(at least they are cheap where they are sold – you can't apply Malaysian prices on their cars here and say they are crap, you blame NAP for that …. you can buy a Corolla Altis 1.8 starting from 16k in North America)
I've driven a car safely (more like limped) home with a 50% stuck throttle before. The car had 300 + hp.
What so serious about unintended acceleration again?
4G63tDSM said,
March 16, 2010 @ 6:11 pm
…. you can buy a Corolla Altis 1.8 starting from 16k in North America
———————————-
Please, I hate to see people referring to car price outside but only looking at one side of the issue. I don't have to elaborate much, it’s just make more sense by checking the price of Toyota cars in Thailand.
All price in thai:
Vios (J) = RM51K
Vios (G) = RM70k
Altis 1.6 (J) = RM 72.5K
Altis 1.8 (G) = RM99K
Can you buy Altis at $16k or RM53k?
Toyota people are the worst drivers said,
March 16, 2010 @ 5:37 pm
Toyota builds crap cars, guess I was right about them all along. You don’t feel connected when driving a Toyota, the steering feels uncommunicative, the brakes have no feel, the automatic gearbox are slow and the accelerator pedal response is too immediate or sluggish. They need to build their car properly judging from the way their car behaves on the road.
—————————————————————
does this apply to all toyota models?
not an expert in cars, but i thought the pedal response can be adjusted by adjusting the free play of the pedal?
this is not a minute case when an entire family died.
one thing: SUE, SUE & SUE in a typical american fashion. america is a SUELAND.
I hope I am fair when judging on cars but it is absolutely true. I've known a couple of our Malaysian journalists here and tested in their loan cars and I have to say Toyota cars doesn't bring excitement and not connected at all. Guess Toyota cars are selling because of their brand name just like National/Panasonic is the preferred, safe choice if not boring because of the loyalty of their customers to the brand. Question is, there are many more exciting products that is already here. For the same price would you rather have the Avanza or the Alza? Innova or the Kia Rondo or the Livina? Kia Forte or the Vios? Would you have the Corolla Altis or the Peugeot 308 or the Mitcubishi Lancer? Would you rather have the Mazda6 or the Toyota Camry? It is obvious that Toyota doesn't have any interesting or good car in their model line-up currently. People are blinded when purchasing Toyotas because of their loyalty of the brand. I am a loyal Nikon camera brand but recently Nikon cameras aren't as good as Canon. Why would you want to pay more for something less?
Quotes:
Toyota has blamed the problems on faulty floor mats and defective accelerator pedals, but some believe a problem with the vehicles’ electronic throttle control system is behind the problems.
Some models are currently being given new brake override software as part of the recall, along with the Lexus IS and ES.
The brake override software is designed to automatically reduce the engine to idle when both the brake and the accelerator are depressed. According to the Times, some safety experts are concerned that the brake override software may in fact cause more problems by adding a new layer of software to the system.
There are new indications that Toyota's recent floor mat and accelerator pedal fixes meant to end problems with sudden acceleration MAY NOT be working. According to The Los Angeles Times, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) has received SEVEN new complaints in the last two weeks from Toyota owners alleging that their cars surged out of control after they underwent recall repairs.
Source: http://www.yourlawyer.com/articles/read/17611
With regards to Prius, here's the fact:
On February 8, 2010, Toyota recalled more than 400,000 hybrid vehicles, including the 2010 Prius and the Lexus HS250h, to fix their breaks. The NHTSA said it had opened an investigation into the 2010 Prius relating to reports of MOMENTARY LOSS of braking capability while traveling over an uneven road surface, pothole or bump. The NHTSA said it had received 124 reports from consumers, including four reports alleging that crashes occurred.
A week after the recall was announced, complaints spiked, with the NHTSA now logging a total of 1,120 complaints alleging 34 crashes and six injuries involving Prius brakes.
I BELIEVE IT HAS SOMETHING TO DO WITH THE vehicles’ Electronic Throttle Control System, not just a mechanical issues with pedal or sticky carpet.
The ETCS-Intelligent System, the vehicles’ electronic throttle-control system is considered a major suspect, and some experts maintain that vehicles equipped with such systems have a dangerous propensity to suddenly and unintentionally accelerate.
They point out that unintended acceleration complaints began to increase significantly in 2002, when Toyota began installing the ETCS-I in a broad range of its vehicle lines
In one particularly tragic incident, an off-duty California Highway Patrol Officer and his family were killed when their 2009 Lexus ES 350 sped out of control, plummeted over an embankment and burst into flames. As the vehicle sped out of control, the family desperately called 911, and they can be heard on the 911 tapes asking each other to pray only seconds before their deaths.
Many auto experts doubt both the sticky accelerator pedal and floor mat excuses put forth by Toyota, and believe one or more issues related to electronics are behind unintended acceleration problems.
Possibilities include the complicated electronic sensors that relay the message from the gas pedal to the engine, the design and location of the sensor system, or a lack of a fail-safe override mechanism.
i believed if someone died or 2 or 3 in malaysia due to SAP.
then we will see how many of toyota owner later will claim they also got the same accident tooo! (maybe YB nizar is one of them?).
It's a common T fan, they wont agree their T car are bad and such rubbish because they paying high price for it (even tho overpriced).
But lucky thing.. not many malaysian can afford Prius and camry. else we can see T fanboys 'killed by toyota car' here.
But hey!. don't worry T fanboys!, your beloved Toyota not be blamed by the accident.! but you're! You the one to will be blamed as bad drivers somemore try to con insurance money laaa… good one!
So it is not a remote incidence after all…
So people be careful…there a lot of Toyotas on the road.
conspiracy everywhare..can't decide who to believe now..i guess i'll take side for toyota then..
soikes actually has financial difficulties
he may lied to get some $$$
~Toyota people are the worst drivers~
Man whats it with you and toyota's? Am not a toyota fan even tough i am forced to drive for the past 5 years or so. Seriously agree that its not an exciting brand? but hey i believe that is not the their business model as well. My 5 years of experience:
1.Boring!..
2.Boring!
3 Boring!
That about it
But on the other side, not even 1 single malfunction. Everything works as how it was intended too. And best of all, is thier customer care, do you know that they actually give a courtesy car to you if your service takes a longer period of time. Never heard this on other car companies.You are comparing avanza and alza, man please do some researchla, both are from the same company la fren. comparint the innova to rondo, have you ever been in an innova, for the amount of space, think can park the rondo inside it and camry against mazda 6? fren just compare the price la wei both accord and camry 2.4 is very much cheaper than the mazda la wei! Resale value?
To be honest, i love honda's why because they are exciting, i have the previous version 2.0 civic. Man the rear power window has jammed. Rear lamp is leaking.The engine will turn off automaticly when in traffic lights. never skipped a service, religously maintained. and its only 4 years old.
If you are looking for excitement in toyota than you are in the wrong plce, If you are looking for refinement,less head ache, after sales and resale value, Toyota is for you!but any way they are boring la.
Dont just post your comments based on your bias thoughts.
They are world number 1 for a reason!
american fuckin conspiracy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXOvLJuRG8w&fe…
Lolz,all these people just want to cash in on the situation faced by toyota.They want to be in the limelight and attract attention.
IMHO,i think that the guy faked his story !
so they do 'simulation' based on that guy's report or something
well, since they are damn on fighting that guy's report with fact, i believe they should simulate 'death' as well.
ya la, maybe people actually not that dead. maybe they die because of heart attack or something
GM is at the edge of survival, now is the time to kill the japanese
@M16
salute!!! nice to read ur comment..yes,dugong is dugong..but not much complain aside of it's look.
@MI16 – Ahh.. sounds like a typical Toyota driver throwing tantrum. What you might not know is UMW Toyota are good at hiding their flaws for the sake of their reputation, I guess Toyotas are known for spoiling their customers very well indeed even with their inferior poor quality products. Toyota drivers are playing safer than Durex.
niamafufu, thanks for the links. Luckily I'm not, and will never be a Toyota fan :)
conspiracy? lol!.. poor T salesman and T blind supporter..
because of 1 scammer / conman, so you think you angel toyota is innocent?
let me laughs loudly when you got killed in your toyota when SAP happen to you at karak hiway, ramping over the barrier on the way down from genting then jump over it down to 100ft down there.
let see if you can defend toyota again after that.
the problem is getting more stickier now for toyota when mr. james 'sicks' reveled his don't-know-true-or-fake facts. even the report from toyota's engineer is sound and logical, but never ever underestimate the potential destructive power, be it from the problems of the vehicle itself or the revelation from the owner himself, that a seemingly minor problem can cause, as there is a famous saying of chinese proverb which literally means: a spark can start a fire that burns the entire prairie.
american conspirasy part 2.
part one – world trade centre/ 911
Now Toyota car owners can claims from Toyota if caught with speeding summon. Reason is unexplainable car speeding up by itself ( non-driver error).
Maybe later, Toyota cars are exempted from abiding roads and highway speed limit.
I want an exciting sport car, rest of my family (4 people) just want a normal boring reliable car from A to B. Why would toyota care about fraction of people who want exciting car when toyota can make more profit by creating simple boring car? profitability wise, go figure
want an exciting car? dont buy toyota
@ Toyota people are the worst drivers said,
if toyota so crappy, go buy a F*cking alza then or kia … you comment have nothing to do with the safety of prius …
Stupid typical american.. High tech hybrid cars like prius is full-packed with self diagnostic & car overall management system which they can retrive all the old/previous datas of the car.. So do you think you can cheat on that?? That is the most simples untechnical general terms that i can share with all of you guys..
Unexperience and "unaffordable" group of people in malaysia always talk rubbish and full of s**t as they know nothing actually about cars.. Cheers!!
~X-Senior Toyota Engineer~
I dont think too much of GM conspiracy. When Toyota quality issue prop up, the biggest benefactor is Hyundai and Kia with their 'exciting' range and long-lasting warranty. Read through the American motor forum and you'll understand the 'peace of mind' that Hyundai offers in the States. So GM still losing money as truck is dominated by Ford F series, and cars are moved from Camry to Sonata/Ford Fusion. Kudos to Ford as their new product are good, as good or even better than their Japanese rivals.
Actually it's good for Toyota owners also, nowadays when i see a Toyota coming fast from behind I fast Fast give way, making sure i m not blocking their 'way'…u just never know Who or What is 'Moving' the toyota 'Forward'….
Toyota : Moving Forward !
hmm it is so hard to push to neutral?
its as easy at fasting your seat belts..
.. this is what happened when you forget to drive a manual..
*with a manual car, you can just press the clutch and voila.. engine is not getting power to the wheel..
**americans are dramatic, reality tv worshippers…
drive by wires cars beware!!!
unintended accelaration are part of the risk!!!
go back to mechanical linked accelerator pedal and manual shift..
if these cases are true…i bet u will nvr wan to be the victim of the car which gone crazy…wahaha
hmmm….no matter what happen, there will always somebody that will defend T…i don't know the reason but i'm guessing they already buy T for high price and is losing face coz of this…
one said,
March 17, 2010 @ 8:29 am
Stupid typical american.. High tech hybrid cars like prius is full-packed with self diagnostic & car overall management system which they can retrive all the old/previous datas of the car.. So do you think you can cheat on that?? That is the most simples untechnical general terms that i can share with all of you guys..
Unexperience and “unaffordable” group of people in malaysia always talk rubbish and full of s**t as they know nothing actually about cars.. Cheers!!
~X-Senior Toyota Engineer~
—————————————————————
Well put bro….some ppl talk as if they know about cars. You talk to people in the automotive industry will you will get a different perspective.
This has gone far eanough and now people are talking advantage.
Agree, Toyota build car because wanted to make money only. Look at the Vios J spec, no air bags, How could a Jap selling their car in Malaysia without air bags? is make the same unsafety car like our local brand car without airbags on those lowest price car. Toyota just selling this Vios J spec because they knew alot of Malaysia can afford a standard vios, thats y they come with this unsafety car with just u can get it with rm69! For me this is just want to make money without thinking of the passenger safety. But they make a right choice if their intention is just money because you can spotted 8 – 10 vios J spec everywhere nowadays in the same road! especially white color.
more than 99% of us here don't own a prius.
l like nissan's car over toyota.
as a consumer, i buy product for the features i want.
the fact is that i like the prius not for the look or performance, but its fuel efficient technology.
we can argue over the prius 3 (2009-), but pity prius 2 (2004-2009) which is the real warrior of hybrid tech, has been popular world wide with no major failure.
whatever it is, given the price, toyota still has the best quality to offer.
we cant denied that its consistency has brought the toyota brand to this popularity.
whats wrong with the boring look, at least it is a pure own design.
Sikes is a money sucking whore.
Interesting article:
http://www.forbes.com/2010/03/12/toyota-autos-hoa…
(what happened to the URL?)
http://www.forbes.com/2010/03/12/toyota-autos-hoa…
Toyota people are the worst drivers said,
March 17, 2010 @ 12:13 am
@MI16 – Ahh.. sounds like a typical Toyota driver throwing tantrum. What you might not know is UMW Toyota are good at hiding their flaws for the sake of their reputation, I guess Toyotas are known for spoiling their customers very well indeed even with their inferior poor quality products. Toyota drivers are playing safer than Durex.
———————————————————-
Man… flabergasted by your stupid comments again. Spoiling customer's , better know as CUSTOMER SATISFACTION,,Why not i paid them my with my hard earned money.you own a P1 0r a P2 is it, sounds like you are craving for some customer satisfaction here, Infirior poor quality? please do some research la, tolong keluar dari tempurung, Honda ,GM,Ford,PSA and many has recalled as many cars as tyt world wide and today odessey for brake issues, would you say the same against them? Safer than durex? when you wish to be safe with durex, why not be safe your second biggest commitment? I believe you own UMW !! to be telling out a trade secret of UMW…Hiding flaws to cover thier rep, did toyota malaysia or asia recall any of the model here?
Enough with that crappy comments…
Toyota definately screwed this time, but i definately respect on thier work to regain customer confidence, and what the hell, sales for feb, jumped 50% higher than jan.
Toyota people are the worst drivers said,
March 17, 2010 @ 12:13 am
yala, bro MI16 here just giving his opinion, why flame him…
toyota is quite in trouble now but hopefully they can come back stronger la.. must give other carmakers competitions so that the consumers will gain.
just seeking for an opinion, is newer toyota less long lasting than older ones? seems older corollas are amazing as they hardly give any problems, especially the power windows are still working perfectly after 15+ years (my dad's)… but a 5 year vios, the rubber on the windows (driver's side) hardened after prolong sun exposure, causing the power windows to get stuck.
haha…
ridiculous…..
now Honda's turn…..
aiyah…all product will have some defect one lah….
as long as the percentage is minimal….
our car is sooo….good in quality…. as no complaint go up to global press…
people say that we are toyota fans while actually we are not..it's the other way round, some (maybe most) of u guys are toyota haters..haha..i notice this since the introduction of vios dugong version..a lot of haters pop up..hm,curios2..are u in for the quality problem or just hate their design because if u are, then u are off topic..
This is a funny story,,, The reason the driver lied about his prius cos he is bankrupt and one of the creditor is Toyota Financial Services. He owe Toyota 20K….ha ha ha ….
anyway, i still want this prius… ;-)
In USA it maybe a CONspiracy but in Malaysia we do have LEMON Toyota Vios and UMWT do nothing to restore those victims. At least I'm happier at Nissan ETCM.
Wonder if anyone has noticed that Wish is no longer on the model list at Toyota Malaysia website, stop selling already? signs of a downturn?