Proton is in the red again for the financial year 2008/2009 after a short stint of profitability for the 2007/2008 financial year. Profit of RM144 million in the previous financial year dropped to a loss of RM338 million for the financial year ended 31st March 2009.
Chairman Dato’ Mohd Nadzmi Mohd Salleh says the results are primarily due to impairment of property, plant and equipment (PPE) and inventory write-down of certain models impacted by volume contraction, and is reflective of the current global economic condition.
He added that the second half of the financial year was dversely affected by the accelerated amortisation of certain dies and jigs as well as the increased costs of components and raw materials arising from higher foreign currency exchange rates, particularly, the Japanese Yen and the US Dollar.
He noted that despite the loss, revenue had actually improved from RM5.62 billion in FY2007/2008 to RM6.49 billion in FY2008/2009, an increase of RM864.98 million. Proton currently has a cash balance of RM899.5 million, down from RM1,173.9 million in FY2007/2008. They also expect to receive a RM81 million R&D grant through the National Automotive Policy for the financial year.
“As a fully fledged automotive company, we spent a substantial amount on the development of new models such as the Proton Exora and Lotus Evora during the year. While this had affected our cash reserves, we will be able to recover when the cars are sold,” said the group’s managing director Dato’ Haji Syed Zainal Abidin.
Dato Haji also adds that Proton intends to double their total sales volume by 2010, with the bulk of improvement coming from improvements in export market sales. The Proton Exora will be launched in Indonesia in July 2009. Proton sold 156,845 cars in FY2008/2009, up from 139,942 in FY2008/2007. Out of that amount, 16,746 or just over 10% were export cars and 2,280 were Lotus cars.
In other Proton related news, the Proton Exora is now eligible for the Proton Xchange programme effective immediately, where customers will be able to trade in their old cars with minimum lifespan of 10 years for a RM5,000 discount.
Look after the jump for the full Q4 results announcement by Proton.
Looking to sell your car? Sell it with Carro.
Well, tentatively the net loss is due to the impairment. Not an operational loss.
first!
hehe..
keep it up Proton!
In these hard times.. if you were not affected that's a lie..
coz Proton is much smaller car maker compared to the giants in the industry.
At least the total revenue improved..
Just one thing.. when planning for a new model please choose a better dashboard design.. copy a bit from other makes is ok lah. Choose better materials.. of course it's quite costly and reduce profit margins.. but it's still profits right?? The total volume sales will make up for it because to me what proton lacks is in the interior design..esp the dashboard facia.
Pity Proton Employee… I wonder SAGA and EXORA are selling well… but when they announce loss… it means there goes the employee bonus, benefits etc… gone in the drain. ANyway… next time GADGET Next Time….
[quote comment="242205"]Well, tentatively the net loss is due to the impairment. Not an operational loss.[/quote]
care to explain more about the "impairment" in a simple way?
cheers!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revaluation_of_fixed…
It's like the value of property dropping.
it was normal…we as a tier1 also same like that.For example, when economics going down, we had a problems with cash flow. Where we got a lot of jobs, but short of cash flow. Customer delayed the payment, and we can't pay our toolmaker. That why, many small tool maker now "gulung tikar"
Well, the goverment can pump in more ''R&D grant'' again, maybe another $339 million will be enough (at the moment)….for sure your losses is not due to your brain, it is due to something else….
Never give a damm about proton gains or looses, but please dont use the tax payers money to cover the loss!
Don't give some lame excuses that proton still new in the market, need more time, blah blah blah, if you couldn't make your living in the car industry market, you better do something else or just gulung tikar
I think it's bull. I think the loss has something to do with the Koreans. The Koreans are getting better, and less expensive.
well, lets see if perodua is losing any money. but i think a well managed company arent supposed to lost money, since, in malaysia the automotive industry arent really affect (look at the sales ).
but, any how, perodua still is the top seller, and despite how many products proton trying to sell, still the name is stinked already.
a 3 months old persona of my colleague are with so many problem, and the mechanic need to go to drink tea and let my fren waited for so long.
good job proton. let see how many quarters can you lost money and see how many times our EPF can bail you out.
i'll bet exora will be full of problem), because if you cannot make persona( which is GEN2-with butt) problem free, and still cannot fix power window on a persona, then, this company are going to suffered in this flat world.
exora should get 2.4 liter mitsubishi engine, just like the china (Cherry 7 seater), that could help the sales a bit.
proton going down~!!! yeah!
[quote comment="242218"]it was normal…we as a tier1 also same like that.For example, when economics going down, we had a problems with cash flow. Where we got a lot of jobs, but short of cash flow. Customer delayed the payment, and we can't pay our toolmaker. That why, many small tool maker now "gulung tikar"[/quote]
hi, do not worry, EMS is going to be fine now, the sales are coming back and saw a lot a lot of orders and new projects coming in.
by the way, your tool maker taukeh is still damn rich la, just fired all the poor worker to cut lose only, but when the market is up, they will hire all back!
For this financial year, Proton is expected to receive a research and development grant from the Government under the National Automotive Policy amounting to RM81mil.
Is funny tho.. Since a few month back they mention they are growing strong with Saga & Exora sales… Now when the result came out still in loss… How to explain to those investors? Oh wait, they are GLC so never mind.. Still can ask for stimulus to help the company…
Besides that, they are enjoying tax break, "investment" from NAP and also the exchange programme.. (I think due to not much sales, now they allowed all model to enjoy it ). Sadly i can say that, in a protective situation still making loss for 2008/2009…
Anyway how about Perodua? I wonder did they made any loss or not?!? Since everyone here mention that the economy is worst, maybe Perodua will effected also.. If Perodua is making money (still profit), i dont think Proton can give much excuse about economy bad..
This report doesn't differ much with last year report, the year before, another last year report, etc.
All making losses…
GLC – Gov Loss Concern – Make loss, MATI OOOooooohh…….
loss is normal..nest time try to minimize it. they should come out with car like blm..value for money..cheap to produce at the same time looks nice.
michaelooi, what make you think and try to relate proton loss to Koreans better product and less expensive! This is the greatest joke of the highest order? Puke ………
So the Proton Chairman said the caused was "impairment" is bullshit and what you said is holy right!
Well this proton basher is like that, Toyota also lose money ba nvr see there comment also lol.
That see how it earn this year since ba….
[quote comment="242249"]loss is normal..nest time try to minimize it. they should come out with car like blm..value for money..cheap to produce at the same time looks nice.[/quote]
yea, and thats a car costs rm40000++, last time the old proton saga is bigger, better engine and can seat 5 person, is costs about rm20k.( dont say inflation la, your gaji got naik meh? but car in USA still same price ma after 20 years)
BLM is value for money? same money we can buy vios in Thailand, and thats a pity to malaysian.
Toyota makes great quality cars which have earned the hearts of many! Proton makes unreliable, unsafe and expensive cars which only frustrate people!! Imo!
[quote comment="242256"]Well this proton basher is like that, Toyota also lose money ba nvr see there comment also lol.
That see how it earn this year since ba….[/quote]
kebodohan tak terhingga, toyota lost moeny, got use their japanese hard earned income tax money to top up for 30 years or not? b0d0h!!
————————
i'm not a proton basher, i'm a taxpayer , are you a taxpayer? are you out of your mind when ppl are fooling around with your money? if you have money too much, i have some real business plan that can at least keep your money and i'll be grateful if you let me use your money to create money for you.
did proton say thank you to malaysian when we supported them for 30 years??
every car owner supported proton. because you pay extra TAX and AP for the money.
so those illiterate forum reader pls bear in mind, this is our money( if you can afford to pay tax la) and this is not about a fxcked up car company, this is a company belongs to malaysian.
You think japan put money in to set up proton ar? you grandfather and your father hard earn money la. Even selling pisang goreng also contribute to our economy one, go learn economy before talking la, blind proton supporter.
support buta tuli, as if you're driving a very good car from proton la.
saga blm= toyota vios price
gen 2 = toyota altis price
waja = toyota camry price.
malaysian also can make car for toyota ma, just like thailand and indonesia. proton what so good? give you any thing extra? what? free umbrella? petrol voucher?
lucky malaysia have sarawak and sabah for the resources that become there back bon for them to do a stupid business to play off if the like Singapore sure there die dont not to where already but it will b soon or later if there never change there attitude n always think there still can n alot off pig like us to pay a income TEX for them to do a stupid business.
Exora kenot help? Saga is oso not helping? Shit. I'm driving a Protong now.
Maybe by end of the year, comes 3rd economy stimulus package to rejunevate the sagging -ve growth, Proton is bail out like US GM or Chrysler is allocate RM 2 Billion tax payer monies. So, next year the rosy story go on by declare proton in Black again – creative accounting will do the trick.
malaysian goverment taxed us when buying cars.
and taxed again when you receive your income,even if you use your income to pay car loan.
taxed 2 times!!!!!
so, only those doing business can escape some of the tax, those lower/middle income are dead becos of the payslip. pity!
last years profit was not really a profit either….it was due to the 100mill++ they received from the govt….
who cares about toyota loss, they never ask money from the gov or ppl's money.
kenapa org malaysia ramai benci kat proton, sepatutnya contohilah macam rakyat korea dan jepun. Mereka support product mereka dari awal dan hinggalah sekarang, walaupun masa tahun 40an hingga 80an produk mereka jauh lebih teruk dari produk Europe.
Berkat kesabaran penduduk Jepun dan Korea serta dari bantuan dan perlindungan kerajaan mereka selama berpuluh2 tahun, mereka telah berjaya dgn cemerlangnya.
Sebagai contoh, di Jepun mereka tak pernah mengutuk pasukan bola mereka, walaupun pasukan mereka kalah, mereka tak pernah mengutuk kata permain tu kaki bangku atau sebagainya.
Tapi di malaysia perangai/sikap rakyatnya sungguh berbeza….
to_p3noy…panas btol aku ngan ko ni…ko seronok ke tgk proton bankrupt…support our indstry…no support mean no development can be done…u have money, ok then go buy toyota or honda…jangan perlekehkan proton..buatan sendiri..malu r sket..
so many shit here. fuck off
P1 mentality all wrongla – tidakpo attitude, corruption with vendors etc.
Kick out the lintangs 'n put in true blue professionals with good work ethics.
But will not be done…, 'cos polititikus animal. Instead of a chaebol they created a bloodsuckin' c***bai!
Damn right we should angry – subsidize here and there with taxpayer's 'n anyone that buys those timebombs – pays for exporting! What happen to that 'halal' P1? My Iranian frd oso laffing with his toes!
Pada yg mampu tu, atau monthly income lebih dari RM5 ribu sebulan belilah brand/product lain janganlah nak racun org kat sini.
Proton sememangnya perlukan support dari rakyatnya sendiri.
Pada yg incomenya kurang dan taknak kpd produk proton anda bolehlah beli perodua yg sebenarnya masih lagi produk daihatsu/toyota tu. Walaupun Perodua sudah wujud dari 1993 (16 tahun) masih lagi takda produknya sendiri dan masih lagi rebadging hingga sekarang ni.
Jangan haraplah kalau takda proton, kereta di malaysia ni akan turun harga dengan banyaknya. Cukuplah guna isu ni utk berhujah…
OMG!!!
What? LOSS ONLY 338 MILLION! Please make it 1 Billion next year.
Don't panic, just minor hiccup
[quote comment="242307"]OMG!!!
What? LOSS ONLY 338 MILLION! Please make it 1 Billion next year.[/quote]
Tak payah lah perli teruk2 sangat. USA yg kononnya pandai dan bijak tu pun kerajaan/tax payer jugak yg tolong bailout.
Proton is still ok and their cash flow pun still ok jugak…
The loss for Proton is reasonable and acceptable and thus not to poor management fault.
[quote comment="242313"]Don't panic, just minor hiccup[/quote]
Minor hiccup for many years.. until major hiccup LOL~!
It's totally pathetic. We pay SO MUCH for a car here because of TAXES, and yet again, it still suffer losses due to some impairment of property, plant and equipment (PPE)..blabla..imagine that if gov doesn't provide protection on proton, how worse can it be? Its not a 338 million, it maybe a 338 billion.
US gomen mati2 dont want GM to tapau. Why? Obama administration can easily says "this is not my job, so let them die, Toyota/Cherry/Fiat can take over the plant if they want to" but he did not. He knows Detroit blue collar are one of the main contributors to his winning and they are part of US Dream. Rather high percentage of US economy is generated by auto industries alone. The whole value chain – from raw mat to tool maker, assembler, tier 1,2 3 vendor, service centre, dealership, financial institution, magazine/critique, media, logistic/freight forwarder, port authority, carrier, energy provider, lube and mineral dep. This is what we are trying to emulate. WE have shortcomings here and there, but the job created by these 2 companies (P2 &P1) is just too huge. If we rely too much on import from other companies, stop thinking that the whole value chain can survive. You dont need 10,000 jobs just for import and delivery, but you can feed 10,000 families by having it MANUFACTURED here (doesn't really matter if it was rebadge or not) and that spurs money. You think your current job not really affected aa when these 2 companies tapau and you can still drive BMW at 80K? Bloody selfish. Pls check on how gomen of Japan support Toyota and gomen of Thailand amend the rules there to support Toyota (held at ransom).
How about Lotus?
only 400 milion… nice
[quote comment="242295"]kenapa org malaysia ramai benci kat proton, sepatutnya contohilah macam rakyat korea dan jepun. Mereka support product mereka dari awal dan hinggalah sekarang, walaupun masa tahun 40an hingga 80an produk mereka jauh lebih teruk dari produk Europe.
Berkat kesabaran penduduk Jepun dan Korea serta dari bantuan dan perlindungan kerajaan mereka selama berpuluh2 tahun, mereka telah berjaya dgn cemerlangnya.
Sebagai contoh, di Jepun mereka tak pernah mengutuk pasukan bola mereka, walaupun pasukan mereka kalah, mereka tak pernah mengutuk kata permain tu kaki bangku atau sebagainya.
Tapi di malaysia perangai/sikap rakyatnya sungguh berbeza….[/quote]
that was a main problem.
Patriotic is must to support our OWN product.
Believe ourselves, then you will success.
[quote comment="242329"]US gomen mati2 dont want GM to tapau. Why? Obama administration can easily says "this is not my job, so let them die, Toyota/Cherry/Fiat can take over the plant if they want to" but he did not. He knows Detroit blue collar are one of the main contributors to his winning and they are part of US Dream. Rather high percentage of US economy is generate job created by these 2 companies (P2 &P1) is just too huge. If we rely too much on import from other comToyota and gomen of Thailand amend the rules there to support Toyota (held at ransom).[/quote]
abang, their ford is how cheap you know? you know what? if la, your gen2 is actually selling at RM30k la, without gomen tax extra rm8k la, you one month save how much in your car loan? one month you spend how much paying for funny car??
In malaysia, our car is 3 times more expensive, and our income is 3 times less than them, so….are we 6 times away from US or 9 times? i also dunno. but, ok la, malaysia boleh la, nvm la, buy proton now, if later can afford, buy toyota/honda second hand la, tak apa la.
the whole factory of proton can convert to toyota, and you can keep all supplier and all worker. dont be so stupid that, buying toyota means direct import from japan la, even china/USA also use local worker to make the car ma. Korang semua kerja kat mana? tak der orang kerja kat MNC ar?? semua kerja kat Kedai Ah beng,Kedai Ahmad??
If the whole world can outsource so many jobs to malaysia, means malaysian can make car for toyota also la, let japanese design the car la, come on, Ferrari ENzo also design by japanese la, Malaysian attitude of tidak apa cannot make car la.
we make so many electronics stuff here, what makes you think we cannot make toyota here, and need to import? mmg tak pandai la.
proton= monopoly, not efficient, lousy quality, tak-apa attitude.
to all that supported proton, if you can buy, you sure buy honda one la, dont bullshit la.
scottloeb, you talk kok la, buy toyota=direct import? mercedes also can assembled in msia la, S500L somemore la, read from internet la, pls, mmg …
proton should learn from produa, by using japanese to control the quality, and holding 51% share, the quality is controlled.
Proton is using our money to make fun, to make experiment, and yet ppl keep on giving chances, so, malaysian deserves this. Padan muka.
Mahathir said " orang malaysia senang lupa" .correct.
[quote comment="242325"][quote comment="242313"]Don't panic, just minor hiccup[/quote]
Minor hiccup for many years.. until major hiccup LOL~![/quote]
cannot die one la, we can use EPF and Petronas and Khazanah money ma.
malaysia kaya tau!
orang biasa pakai motor everyday, only drive proton on weekend. very very pity. pls come to penang bridge every morning, and see for yourself. see how those poor driving bike during rain. pls come
OK….ma! GM already bankrup ma…!!!!!!
[quote comment="242295"]kenapa org malaysia ramai benci kat proton, sepatutnya contohilah macam rakyat korea dan jepun. Mereka support product mereka dari awal dan hinggalah sekarang, walaupun masa tahun 40an hingga 80an produk mereka jauh lebih teruk dari produk Europe.
Berkat kesabaran penduduk Jepun dan Korea serta dari bantuan dan perlindungan kerajaan mereka selama berpuluh2 tahun, mereka telah berjaya dgn cemerlangnya.
Sebagai contoh, di Jepun mereka tak pernah mengutuk pasukan bola mereka, walaupun pasukan mereka kalah, mereka tak pernah mengutuk kata permain tu kaki bangku atau sebagainya.
Tapi di malaysia perangai/sikap rakyatnya sungguh berbeza….[/quote]
———–
some Malaysian BODOH SOMBONG.. they think they r clever…
example here.. even that guy dont have engineering background, interior designer, designer or economic, they still complain and comment like and expert..but the reality is.. they are BODOH but SOMBONG to said they ara BODOH..
so, that's why they were so called "BODOH SOMBONG"..
if Proton bankrupt.. do you know how many people loss their job? and worst come to worst.. the automotive industry in malaysia become the worst in history… think about it… i can buy estima, i can buy civic, but i still buy persona.. i want to help my country.. for those who think they are smart enough, please migrate to other country.. yeah..u can get what u want.. i hope so.. :)
[quote comment="242299"]to_p3noy…panas btol aku ngan ko ni…ko seronok ke tgk proton bankrupt…support our indstry…no support mean no development can be done…u have money, ok then go buy toyota or honda…jangan perlekehkan proton..buatan sendiri..malu r sket..[/quote]
kawan, you pi la tengok siapa bina jalan raya, siapa bina rumah, siapa bina bangunan tinggi. semua buruh asing, apasal tak mintak orang malaysia pi kerja? sebab dia orang murah la!!!! apasal tak support buatan sendiri, pi la minta orang tempatan kerja kat situ, pi la.
jangan nak gila kata support buatan tempatan, tapi jual begitu mahal. pi la compare satu rumah boleh beli berapa kereta.
kat US, satu rumah boleh beli 10 honda accord/ civic. USD200000 Vs USD 20000
kat malaysia. 1 rumah RM150000 beli berapa proton??
kawan, 3 proton saja boleh beli. 3 gen2 boleh beli satu rumah dah!!!!!
you punya kereta lebih bagus ker, you punya rumah mahal?? compare la cam ni.
buat kereta mahal, susah kan semua orang, nak kata support barang tempatan lagi.
Come on. The multiplier effect by the P1 and P2 to ou economy is super large. Dream on if some of you think if there are no P1 & P, you ca drive Altis and Civic at RM60K.
And please remember one of the Japanese company try to fix the price when they launched their popular model here with the other ones only for the latter to rebuff it as it was devising a strategy to gain top spot on non national car segment.
[quote comment="242345"]Come on. The multiplier effect by the P1 and P2 to ou economy is super large. Dream on if some of you think if there are no P1 & P, you ca drive Altis and Civic at RM60K.[/quote]
this, i think is correct. the AP sales and car tax is so much, gomen will not abolish it. unless we change gomen. last time i do not believe we can change gomen, after 2008, i believe we can.
100 years ago, ppl dream to fly. and they did it.
if you do not dare to dream, you have no hope.
Honda last time make motor cycle only, honda cab ma. now they make car, they make F1 engine, they make even boat engine. "the Power of dream"
Now proton make car, next time donno what they can make, bicycle?
wooo. 81 million grant from the NAP.
thats a hefty sum.
kenapa benci proton? kasi lj quanlity car force you to buy, make other good car price high, 20 yrs + only can make a stupid campro?! Hope it go bankrupt! is a another fail project.
apa takut , kerajaan akan bantu lagi macam mas…..buat apalah kereta buat motor lah kasih semua mat rempit lumba sampai mati….
No doubt Proton will post losses .Mainly due to the development of the Exora.Obviously,since it is Proton's first MPV,more monies had to be spent in the R&D sector.
Having said that,its hard to see Proton recovering soon.The Exora is not selling well.IT is selling,but its no where near the so called 10,000 +++ bookings it so called has received.
The main reason is people are waiting to see if Perodua comes out with a better car.
So proton posting huge losses was expected.
[quote comment="242295"]
Tapi di malaysia perangai/sikap rakyatnya sungguh berbeza….[/quote]
org jepun & korea berkerja bebas 'adil' di negara mereka. siapa saipa yg ada bakat boleh kerja , tapi tak sama sini,
one more BODOH SOMBONG.. he want to change the Gov because want to get cheaper car.. He He He!.
Malaysia Boleh.
if you do not dare to dream, you have no hope.
Honda last time make motor cycle only, honda cab ma. now they make car, they make F1 engine, they make even boat engine. "the Power of dream"
Now proton make car, next time donno what they can make, bicycle?
If we look at the financial statement, the big chuck is the impairment of PPE. Thats sums of it, together with some provisions. Its just paper/statement loss. Cash flow is healthy, Equity is good and some provisions in B Sheet. Its good move to write down your B Sheet items during bad times …as everybody reported bad result anyway.
[quote comment="242265"][quote comment="242256"]Well this proton basher is like that, Toyota also lose money ba nvr see there comment also lol.
That see how it earn this year since ba….[/quote]
kebodohan tak terhingga, toyota lost moeny, got use their japanese hard earned income tax money to top up for 30 years or not? b0d0h!!
————————
i'm not a proton basher, i'm a taxpayer , are you a taxpayer? are you out of your mind when ppl are fooling around with your money? if you have money too much, i have some real business plan that can at least keep your money and i'll be grateful if you let me use your money to create money for you.
did proton say thank you to malaysian when we supported them for 30 years??
every car owner supported proton. because you pay extra TAX and AP for the money.
so those illiterate forum reader pls bear in mind, this is our money( if you can afford to pay tax la) and this is not about a fxcked up car company, this is a company belongs to malaysian.
You think japan put money in to set up proton ar? you grandfather and your father hard earn money la. Even selling pisang goreng also contribute to our economy one, go learn economy before talking la, blind proton supporter.
support buta tuli, as if you're driving a very good car from proton la.
saga blm= toyota vios price
gen 2 = toyota altis price
waja = toyota camry price.
malaysian also can make car for toyota ma, just like thailand and indonesia. proton what so good? give you any thing extra? what? free umbrella? petrol voucher?[/quote]
do u know japanese keep 20% of their saving in bank to support R&D/investing/etc of their country even though their bank only pay like 0.1/0.2% per annual?
BTW vios selling at waja/gen2 price not BLM price at thailand 50k-69k depend on spec
I am not a tax payer cause my income not high enough to pay tax. I do reject proton on their worst time… and i slowly gain my trust back when there start doing well. this article just show it lost 3xxm till march 2009 and there still have 8xxm cash flow… so there won't need help at moment. non of us will know what happen in future right. (it just between either chose to trust or to lose hope) since this company already in this country for 25 year and it is already a one of main root of our economy…. non of us hope it down so easily…. even USA need do so much thing before GM bankcrapt to decrease the side effect. IF our gov so easily let this P1 down when there is still hope how much thing will suffer later on? Non of us will know also.
Do u think toyota/honda will take over our current facility even our gov offer them? Since there already have facility at thailand/indo there…. Will them can 100% use our own malaysian when there can pay foreign worker for cheaper? Since when gov offer, there sure will make some rule that benefit them more… which may not benefit us also…. Do u think our import car can go cheaper in 1 – 5 year even gov close down P1…. No T/H will still maintain their price to protect themselves for being curse by exbuyer….. and earn more.
A CBU lancer GT only sell at 12x compare other brand CKD will also selling at similiar price. Hmm
Don't always hope other country company will benefit us when there come here, what there want is $$$ and mostly $$$ there earn also go back their country. When we buy proton at least mostly of the earning (not all for sure) will still flow in Malaysia. even ther earning fall to some datuk hand and one of the datuk buy house at here it still benefit our local contractor.
Well may part of my thinking is wrong i welcome anybody to correct me
[quote comment="242205"]Well, tentatively the net loss is due to the impairment. Not an operational loss.[/quote]
Loss is loss, be it impairment or in any other form. Sack the bunch who made the lousy acquisition.
What I dont understand is…proton sell cars expensive but use cheap materials and cheap labour with little or nothing on research & develepement.Same mould being used from saga to waja.But loss in profit.Who is the dumb ass here?Malaysian goverment protect proton so that ppl have no choice but to buy the rip off protons.But if you look properly the MALAYS are the ones who drives BMWS,MERC,VOLVO,AUDI,other imported cars.While hard earners like me only can effort a 2nd honda which is almost 14 years old but still sold at RM32k.Funny right.Malays are stupid but belagak macam pandai and the bloody media always potray them as RICH and famous.Use proton car la why use ALPHARD?If anyone out there think otherwise.I have no comments.
[quote comment="242372"]
do u know japanese keep 20% of their saving in bank to support R&D/investing/etc of their country even though their bank only pay like 0.1/0.2% per annual?
BTW vios selling at waja/gen2 price not BLM price at thailand 50k-69k depend on spec
I am not a tax payer cause my income not high enough to pay tax. I do reject proton on their worst time… and i slowly gain my trust back when there start doing well. this article just show it lost 3xxm till march 2009 and there still have 8xxm cash flow… so there won't need help at moment. non of us will know what happen in future right. (it just between either chose to trust or to lose hope) since this company already in this country for 25 year and it is already a one of main root of our economy…. non of us hope it down so easily…. even USA need do so much thing before GM bankcrapt to decrease the side effect. IF our gov so easily let this P1 down when there is still hope how much thing will suffer later on? Non of us will know also.
Do u think toyota/honda will take over our current facility even our gov offer them? Since there already have facility at thailand/indo there…. Will them can 100% use our own malaysian when there can pay foreign worker for cheaper? Since when gov offer, there sure will make some rule that benefit them more… which may not benefit us also…. Do u think our import car can go cheaper in 1 – 5 year even gov close down P1…. No T/H will still maintain their price to protect themselves for being curse by exbuyer….. and earn more.
A CBU lancer GT only sell at 12x compare other brand CKD will also selling at similiar price. Hmm
Don't always hope other country company will benefit us when there come here, what there want is $$$ and mostly $$$ there earn also go back their country. When we buy proton at least mostly of the earning (not all for sure) will still flow in Malaysia. even ther earning fall to some datuk hand and one of the datuk buy house at here it still benefit our local contractor.
Well may part of my thinking is wrong i welcome anybody to correct me[/quote]
Your comment… I like…
[quote comment="242336"][quote comment="242329"]US gomen mati2 dont want GM to tapau. Why? Obama administration can easily says "this is not my job, so let them die, Toyota/Cherry/Fiat can take over the plant if they want to" but he did not. He knows Detroit blue collar are one of the main contributors to his winning and they are part of US Dream. Rather high percentage of US economy is generate job created by these 2 companies (P2 &P1) is just too huge. If we rely too much on import from other comToyota and gomen of Thailand amend the rules there to support Toyota (held at ransom).[/quote]
abang, their ford is how cheap you know? you know what? if la, your gen2 is actually selling at RM30k la, without gomen tax extra rm8k la, you one month save how much in your car loan? one month you spend how much paying for funny car??
In malaysia, our car is 3 times more expensive, and our income is 3 times less than them, so….are we 6 times away from US or 9 times? i also dunno. but, ok la, malaysia boleh la, nvm la, buy proton now, if later can afford, buy toyota/honda second hand la, tak apa la.
the whole factory of proton can convert to toyota, and you can keep all supplier and all worker. dont be so stupid that, buying toyota means direct import from japan la, even china/USA also use local worker to make the car ma. Korang semua kerja kat mana? tak der orang kerja kat MNC ar?? semua kerja kat Kedai Ah beng,Kedai Ahmad??
If the whole world can outsource so many jobs to malaysia, means malaysian can make car for toyota also la, let japanese design the car la, come on, Ferrari ENzo also design by japanese la, Malaysian attitude of tidak apa cannot make car la.
we make so many electronics stuff here, what makes you think we cannot make toyota here, and need to import? mmg tak pandai la.
proton= monopoly, not efficient, lousy quality, tak-apa attitude.
to all that supported proton, if you can buy, you sure buy honda one la, dont bullshit la.
scottloeb, you talk kok la, buy toyota=direct import? mercedes also can assembled in msia la, S500L somemore la, read from internet la, pls, mmg …
proton should learn from produa, by using japanese to control the quality, and holding 51% share, the quality is controlled.
Proton is using our money to make fun, to make experiment, and yet ppl keep on giving chances, so, malaysian deserves this. Padan muka.
Mahathir said " orang malaysia senang lupa" .correct.[/quote]
who talk kok? ko pernah kerja dgn automotive industry? ko tau ka apa yg diorang nak? ko tau ka toyota berapa percent local content? ko tau tak berapa besar kilang Toyota kat Bangkok outskirts dengan kat Cikarang (Daihatsu ngan Toyota)? Ko tau transmission untuk IMV datang dari Philippines? Apa yg kita buat kat sini pasang, assembly. Diorang dah spend millions for these facilities, nak buat apa lagi kat Malaysia, non cost effective. AFTA requirements min 2 kilang sahaja di ASEAN, so dia dah ada lebih dari enough. Starting from 2010 almost all model will be CBU so kilang kat Malaysia pasang mostly Vios sahaja untuk local market. Sapa yg kerja? output kilang Toyota kat Shah Alam dari 100,000 per annum drop to 50,000, mana ko nak buang staff 3 shift nih? Supplier nih semua ko nak buat apa? soh diorang makan pasir? Sedar lah diri rinngit ko kecik, US gaji berapa, kereta dia berapa. Kerja kat Jepun gaji berapa, local gomen tax berapa. Beli kerta hutang 10 tahun, mmg la harga mahal. ko berani soh gomen jgn tax tapi max loan tenures 3 tahun, tak berenti semua business? Multiplier effect semua, pikir la sket org cari mkn kat supplier service semua. Kalau takat pasang macam MBM kat Pekan tak payah cerita la. Ko nak ckp pasal kilang electronic ko tau berapa ramai org kena berhenti? gd friend of mine dah few months out of job from Flex Shah Alam, anak dia 2, rumah, kereta nak bayar pakai apa? VSS 2-3 bulan gaji saja (Thanx to Proton, dia dpt job sbb Proton Quality dept expanding and bnyk engineer trained by them highly sought after by co lain). Panasonic, Texas Instrument sebualn kerja 2 minggu ko tau ke? Seagate tutup kilang kat Johor, Penang pindah China pasal tak cost effective tak pikir ke bang?
Don’t panic, we will pay for it. Please support our national pride, Proton will success one day like Korean's and Japanese's, so please make sure your life are long enough until that day. Proton is for Malaysian, please buy Proton's.
some of you who actually compares a 1st world country product and a 3rd world developing country is dillusional. obviously the standard of living is higher over there thus they can afford to build a better car with better technology with the same amount of money.
the primary reason why GM goes bankrupt even after more than 80 BILLION us DOLLAR government aid is because they got complacent, they think that they could sell the products without much R&D for a better technology. they were once the no.1 car manufacturer yes, but because of their lazyness and not thinking well such as having too many brands and not focusing on a few that is actually useful such as good performance/cost ratio and such.
look at them now, toyota overtook them as the no.1 manufacturer in the world. GM goes bankrupt. their own people cant support them anymore. thousands of jobs are lost. foreign manufacturer are controlling the car market in the US.
do you want the same thing to happen to malaysia? think about it. we came along way from having a proton saga to having our own designs, engines and everything. from rebadging to making our own car and exporting them? are you not proud of how far we came?
and now it is the recession. a lot of companies are making losses. ALL IT and manufacturing companies are making losses except for APPLE. it is normal due to supply/demand at this stage. economy is recoviring. the fact that protons revenue is increasing is a good sign that they will do good in the future. they spent alot on R&D for exora, which is good, so that WE MALAYSIAN can compete in MPV sector now. new product = value for the company.
so those of you bashing proton for the sake of bashing and dont have a good reason to support it, think again!
For me, I think government should improve the public transportation so that we no need to heavily rely on car as mode of transport. This should be the way as currently in city centre especially KL where traffic jam is common issue.
[quote comment="242299"]to_p3noy…panas btol aku ngan ko ni…ko seronok ke tgk proton bankrupt…support our indstry…no support mean no development can be done…u have money, ok then go buy toyota or honda…jangan perlekehkan proton..buatan sendiri..malu r sket..[/quote]
demi proton owang melayu gadu sama owang melayu .
i juga mandu proton.
org cakap proton mahal Berukdua engin kecik jual lagi mahal x ada org komplen.
I memang tak ada problem dgn mana mana kereta.
janji ada kereta pandu .
kalo proton tutup , perodua pon maahal , baek beli kereta 2nd hand.
Aiya, why some peeple here so stoopid! Nobody ask anybody to take oer P1 ler. Nobody wants rubbish! All we want is better quality, safety, dependability and service-lah. After 22 yrs still like bayi how – lampim here, tahi there, how to tahan?
Blardy system korupt and karat lah – no good attitude!
P2 different system, but oso tin-can but at least reliable and service better.
[quote comment="242364"][quote comment="242295"]
Tapi di malaysia perangai/sikap rakyatnya sungguh berbeza….[/quote]
org jepun & korea berkerja bebas 'adil' di negara mereka. siapa saipa yg ada bakat boleh kerja , tapi tak sama sini,[/quote]
haha complain lagi… kesian…
try to think that what you have and don't always think on what you don't have…
Perhaps make your life more happier..
after 22 years still like bayi? where do u get this from? after 22 years we could design our own car, manufacture it, have different segments = value, and could even import and plus create thousands of jobs locally.
is that not improvement? is that not achieving something? think before you talk please. if u wanna complain, compare with other 3rd world country car manufacturer.
who? thailand? indon? china? philippines? …
think first please
Impak kerugian industri automobil ini bukan hanya belaku pada proton sahaja. Pengeluar dari Jepun dan Amerika juga turut menghadapi krisis yang sama. Salah satu sebab juga daripada pembiayai R&D sesuatu produk yang tidak sekata dengan jualan produk yang dihasilkan. Sebab itu proton terkena juga impak ini sebab proton menjalankan R&D tetapi rakyat Malaysia masih memandang rendah buatan mereka, tidak mempercayai dan sentiasa memegang stigma bahawa produk Proton tiada perubahan. Sedangkan generasi kedua proton "persona, saga, satria neo & exora" telah dipertingkatkan mutu dan diakui tinggi mutunya. tetapi Rakyat malaysia masih berpegang dengan stigma lapuk "Proton tidak bermutu".
Jika rakyat negara lain sanggup memberi sokongan kepada produk negara mereka ketika jatuh dan bangunnya industri mereka. Mengapa tidak kita juga berpendirian bergitu. Walaupun ada sesetengah pihak tidak suka proton tetapi sedarlah sekurang-kurangnya negara kita mampu membuat R&D dan menghasilkan kenderaan tanpa dipengaruhi kuasa asing.
Yup, Proton deserve not to be supported. As there are losing our hard earn money, for a long time and for what?!? National Pride?!? Look at PKFZ, what do you all think about our money wasted there?!?
See what GM/Chrysler doing, bailling out so much money but in the end? Now they stating to issue bangkrap, coz the G have given enough money to them! Enough is enough! I felt better that GM where sold to any other manufacturer as their quality in US are not on par even to Japs!
But Proton how? Leaching year by year? In the name of NAP?!? National Pride?!? In the end, are we normal Malaysian will untung or the cronies?!?
[quote comment="242389"]Aiya, why some peeple here so stoopid! Nobody ask anybody to take oer P1 ler. Nobody wants rubbish! All we want is better quality, safety, dependability and service-lah. After 22 yrs still like bayi how – lampim here, tahi there, how to tahan?
Blardy system korupt and karat lah – no good attitude!
P2 different system, but oso tin-can but at least reliable and service better.[/quote]
come on ..takkan lah proton that junks.. no wonder "The Junk Car Club" (TJCC) was born ….
http://tokmoh.wordpress.com/2009/03/15/tjcc-tts-w…
Try also appreciates our proton cars with love and care….
kalau mau org support, tunjuk lak kebolahan dan keluarkan product yg berkualiti…..20 tahun satu enjin campro. asyik sanjung setinggi tinggi….pikin malu saja! sebab mau jaga satu dua orang yg tak ada kerja mau rugi sampai bila?
sebenar exora adalah contoh paling bagus- it is the good car compare yang lain proton yg ada.
[quote comment="242393"]Yup, Proton deserve not to be supported. As there are losing our hard earn money, for a long time and for what?!? National Pride?!? Look at PKFZ, what do you all think about our money wasted there?!?
See what GM/Chrysler doing, bailling out so much money but in the end? Now they stating to issue bangkrap, coz the G have given enough money to them! Enough is enough! I felt better that GM where sold to any other manufacturer as their quality in US are not on par even to Japs!
But Proton how? Leaching year by year? In the name of NAP?!? National Pride?!? In the end, are we normal Malaysian will untung or the cronies?!?[/quote]
hehehe when Proton become a subject it's a hot debates..
anyway littlefire, have u got your driving licence now?….
[quote comment="242339"][quote comment="242325"][quote comment="242313"]Don't panic, just minor hiccup[/quote]
Minor hiccup for many years.. until major hiccup LOL~![/quote]
cannot die one la, we can use EPF and Petronas and Khazanah money ma.
malaysia kaya tau!
orang biasa pakai motor everyday, only drive proton on weekend. very very pity. pls come to penang bridge every morning, and see for yourself. see how those poor driving bike during rain. pls come[/quote]
it is not about car expensive,it is pretrol. those guy hv New car too.
[quote comment="242396"]kalau mau org support, tunjuk lak kebolahan dan keluarkan product yg berkualiti…..20 tahun satu enjin campro. asyik sanjung setinggi tinggi….pikin malu saja! sebab mau jaga satu dua orang yg tak ada kerja mau rugi sampai bila?
sebenar exora adalah contoh paling bagus- it is the good car compare yang lain proton yg ada.[/quote]
Macam ni lah as a reader nak baca, kutuk2 juga at the same time give them some credit also. Be more reasonable, even how bad Malaysia is, it's still our beloved country.
Proton is the only one of our National Car project and maybe perodua also, so we do our best in brain storming and provide them critics so they will improves further..
Next year 2010 a turbo also coming for Proton… so ok lah tu… kira progress in our own little scale lah tu…
[quote comment="242386"]For me, I think government should improve the public transportation so that we no need to heavily rely on car as mode of transport. This should be the way as currently in city centre especially KL where traffic jam is common issue.[/quote]
ini pun idea yg bagus, sy duk jepun ni dah 9 bulan, hari-hari naik train/public transport dan jalan kaki.. tp sini sejuk jalankaki pun tak berpeluh..tak perlu pun ada kereta…
Masalahnya bila kerajaan sebut nak buat projek, semua kroni2 fikir nak komisen tapi malas buat kerja lansung.
Harap2 Malaysia cepat2 lah berubah…biarlah pemimpin2 kita lebih amanah dan jujur…
best giler baca komen kalau pasal proton…tax issue mesti ade punye..hehe..Agaknya kalau duduk kat US br dorg ni bersyukur dengan sistem tax kat Malaysia ni….
[quote comment="242394"]
come on ..takkan lah proton that junks.. no wonder "The Junk Car Club" (TJCC) was born ….
http://tokmoh.wordpress.com/2009/03/15/tjcc-tts-w…
Try also appreciates our proton cars with love and care….[/quote]
Proton cars are so specially species as a junk in the Earth.
(/'p')/*Junks spirit rocks*('q')
tax_nonstop,
please think before you talk or else you make a fool out of yourself!!
yes we can assemble toyota here…but remember..toyota price a car not only based on the cost of assembly but the real cost of car
1.design
2.development
3.testing
4.production
5.price of raw material
6.marketing
7.advertisement
8.profit
9.R&D funding for the next product!!
and etc
so if toyota do assemble car here..the main cost will still go to japan and japanese will get richer and grow bigger!!!
and there almost too few countries in the world who sell cars tax free!!!!!
lastly…
if you think proton were to close shop and NAP abolished…do you think you will get cheaper car???
the answer is impossible..now the price of foreign makes are priced competitively because the competition with proton!!if there is no proton in our market…they can price the car anyhow they like and they will control the market!!
just assume..if toyota can sell a vios now at rm80K,and if proton is no longer here…and NAP is gone..
and toyota makes just say rm 30k per car profit..do you think they will bring down prices if they dont have competition??
they can sell 3 times lesser car rather than bringing down the price to rm
60k!!!
be happy you have proton because we still can control car prices of foreign makes…
otherwise we will be out of control and they will be in control!!!!!
one last thing is..dont be fool by thailands sucess of housing all the major automotive players in their country!!this was due to cheap labour cost and etc…
but in 5 to 10 years time they will shift to africa or some former soviet union contries because their labour cost will be cheaper!!!!
then thailand will be back to agriculture!!bare that in mind!!!
dont just look thing as short term..think ahead and long term!!!
people around the world were talking the same about koreans..and now look at them!!!go find out how japanese G and korean G protect their automotive industry!!!the internet is all urs!!see how raw materials in japan is given discount or tax exemption,find out how japanese G dispose their cars to 3rd countries and encourage their new car sales…see how their G give out research grants for cleaner engines,greener engines..and etc!!!!!!
get those facts before you talk!!!
and learn about money mechanics…money=debts….if there is no debts there will be no money(cash) circulating in the country!!!!
read more and gain some knowledge before coming out with unlogical comments..pls!!
[quote comment="242325"][quote comment="242313"]Don't panic, just minor hiccup[/quote]
Minor hiccup for many years.. until major hiccup LOL~![/quote]
Proton not that vulnerable compared to international players as most of their cars are sold in Malaysia. Just like our banks, mostly domestic market. Some banks bankrupt still our banks business as usual
[quote comment="242240"]
exora should get 2.4 liter mitsubishi engine, just like the china (Cherry 7 seater), that could help the sales a bit.
proton going down~!!! yeah![/quote]
Why shall Proton use Mitsubishi engines ? To help them out of their 54.8billion Yen losses in 2009 ?
'For Mitsubishi it marked the first net loss in three years – a loss of Y54.8billion, a huge drop from its Y34.7billion net profit just one year earlier. Much of that loss has come in the Jan-March quarter with a Y50.1billion group net loss. Its operating profit has sunk by 96 per cent to Y3.93billion with sales declining to Y1.974trillion down from Y2.682trillion.'
Source: http://www.thegreencarwebsite.co.uk/blog/index.ph…
I always wondered why Mitsubishi Motors is so overrated in Malaysia…
[quote comment="242443"]tax_nonstop,
please think before you talk or else you make a fool out of yourself!!
bla..bla..bla..
more and gain some knowledge before coming out with unlogical comments..pls!![/quote]
——
simple..
Do not allow T brand to Monopoly malaysian automotive industry… Just let them compete each other like Celcom, Digi, and maxis.. so the consumer will get the benefits..
Anyway i am driving a problematic Proton Wira 1.6L, once done the loan thingy. No more Proton Wira, or at least transplant the engine to 4G93T half-cut directly from Mitsubishi.
the reason given why Proton loss is developing new moels (exora & lotus)? what an excuse? other launched nw model to make $. it simply tell us proton is running out of products where when invest in new model the present sale cant cover-up the investment. the only solution is to get a good partner to help up. no more jatuh-muka reason to reject any more, loosing out VW alreasy a big lost in opportunity, dont repeat same mistake twice.
[quote comment="242479"]Anyway i am driving a problematic Proton Wira 1.6L, once done the loan thingy. No more Proton Wira, or at least transplant the engine to 4G93T half-cut directly from Mitsubishi.[/quote]
still u used proton as your transport. Malaysian still prefer proton as 1st own car even they said proton bad & junk (even 2nd car also prefer proton). I have put my book on exora but prefer manual. so the booking are hold for manual that will available starting in this month. RM338M lost are normal if u have still RM800M cash flow. Adat berniaga memang macam tu. kalau untung saja macam mana nak kaji kesilapan plan perniagaan. Car industry not like goreng pisang panas ( goreng pisang kat sec 19 komuter sedap), kena buat kaji selidik apa yang pengguna nak. GM bungkus sebab buat ikut sedap ati diaorang aje. However, Proton still have long journey to achived like big player. But the achivement Proton have for past 14 year ( after produce own design) are impress if compare like other that have in industry more than 40 year. Look G still trust proton to move with out bill out.
[quote comment="242514"]the reason given why Proton loss is developing new moels (exora & lotus)? what an excuse? other launched nw model to make $. it simply tell us proton is running out of products where when invest in new model the present sale cant cover-up the investment. the only solution is to get a good partner to help up. no more jatuh-muka reason to reject any more, loosing out VW alreasy a big lost in opportunity, dont repeat same mistake twice.[/quote]
Err…. actually VW want more than 50% share, so if that no more PeRusahaan OTOmobil National (PROTON). G don"t want lose other national car coz of "Tamak" atau "Greedy" dlm bahasa omputeh. :)
[quote comment="242234"]Never give a damm about proton gains or looses, but please dont use the tax payers money to cover the loss!
Don't give some lame excuses that proton still new in the market, need more time, blah blah blah, if you couldn't make your living in the car industry market, you better do something else or just gulung tikar[/quote]
… tell that to GM and Chrysler =)
Many country in this world does not have their own national car. I dunno much about business knowledge as I'm just an ordinary earn salary technical guy. But what i had in mind that solve this problem is simple, in business we talk about competitive, got competition, price will falls.:P Let the market who control the price. What we are talking here is that to making cars CKD. If government can come out with a policy that if any brand of automotive comes out with vehicle, 80% parts must source from local made to enjoy the same tax rate with our national cars. Who says that many people will be jobless in Malaysia if proton falls. It will just encourage those brand come and setup in Malaysia. As what i see from other place, resident's transportation main based on private vehicle is very unhealthy. If our government is good, just use those money to fix public transport laa. If public transport is so convenient like HK/SG.. who in this country will first think of buying a car when they come out to work? Less vehicle means less pollution. Yes i agree that even US or Japan provide all those incentive and extra cash for the japanese or americans to buy their country made cars. BUT PLEASE BEAR IN MIND THAT THEIR VEHICLE IS CHEAP. In US, less then USD20K they can buy a nice and decent car and that applies to JAPAN. But in our country, what can you get will the price less then 20K? Nowadays not even a basic PROTON BLM. Some more with all those problematic.
WE NEED CHEAP AND GOOD QUALITY NATIONAL CAR. NOT A PROBLEMATIC CAR THAT KEEP ON ASKING US TO SUPPORT THE NATIONAL PRODUCT. OUR MONEY IS HARD EARN MONEY. NOT LIKE SOMEONE WHICH MONEY WILL FLOW TO THEM. Actually that day when i was in HOMETOWN, i saw something quite FUNNY, I saw a TOYOTA FORTUNER WHERE STICKER OUT OF THE CAR IS "BELILAH BUATAN MALAYSIA" and it is a gov's car. I really feel FUNNY, they keep on asking ordinary people buy local product but even their car is USING TOYOTA INSTEAD OF PROTON. How are they going to convince other people?
Almost everyone here has got internet but don't read about what's happening around the rest of the world? Obama and the US Govt tried to save GM, Chrysler but failed? What about Opel – the German Govt broked a deal to save Opel, mainly due to jobs it offers to thousounds of people. The Koreans, Japanese, Australian, and many other Govts in the world are protecting their home automotive industry using some kind of trade barrier or the other. Don't be so naive as to think the government of other countries are not protecting thier own auto industry. Understandbly many can calim to be taxpayers and want ot know where their money went. But i would be concerned more by bad management and conflicts of intrest like the PKFZ issue, and not caused by the current downturn of worldwide economy.
this is about brainless people… only care about their own pocket…. dia ingat toyota n honda boleh tlg kalo economy msia merundum… hhehe… poyo la " we deserve the best" … then compare ngan thai n indonn… better get lost from msia…. we are not welcome this kind of citizens….
[quote comment="242375"]What I dont understand is…proton sell cars expensive but use cheap materials and cheap labour with little or nothing on research & develepement.Same mould being used from saga to waja.But loss in profit.Who is the dumb ass here?Malaysian goverment protect proton so that ppl have no choice but to buy the rip off protons.But if you look properly the MALAYS are the ones who drives BMWS,MERC,VOLVO,AUDI,other imported cars.While hard earners like me only can effort a 2nd honda which is almost 14 years old but still sold at RM32k.Funny right.Malays are stupid but belagak macam pandai and the bloody media always potray them as RICH and famous.Use proton car la why use ALPHARD?If anyone out there think otherwise.I have no comments.[/quote]
I pity you..you are out of touch, maybe just out from PNG jungle! Proton had spent millions on R&D facilities and manpower training. Where were you when they had their "Technology Week" open day at Proton last year? You can check out for yourself the facilites at their R&D complex and see how a car is developed. Even Pual Tan was there. Ooops, i forgot. You were in PNG.
[quote comment="242521"]Err…. actually VW want more than 50% share, so if that no more PeRusahaan OTOmobil National (PROTON). G don"t want lose other national car coz of "Tamak" atau "Greedy" dlm bahasa omputeh. :)[/quote]
Please tell me, why Proton end up with Mitsubishi in past? Cuz it got the Lotus?
[quote comment="242537"]Many country in this world does not have their own national car. I dunno much about business knowledge as I'm just an ordinary earn salary technical guy. But what i had in mind that solve this problem is simple, in business we talk about competitive, got competition, price will falls.:P Let the market who control the price. What we are talking here is that to making cars CKD. If government can come out with a policy that if any brand of automotive comes out with vehicle, 80% parts must source from local made to enjoy the same tax rate with our national cars. Who says that many people will be jobless in Malaysia if proton falls. It will just encourage those brand come and setup in Malaysia. As what i see from other place, resident's transportation main based on private vehicle is very unhealthy. If our government is good, just use those money to fix public transport laa. If public transport is so convenient like HK/SG.. who in this country will first think of buying a car when they come out to work? Less vehicle means less pollution. Yes i agree that even US or Japan provide all those incentive and extra cash for the japanese or americans to buy their country made cars. BUT PLEASE BEAR IN MIND THAT THEIR VEHICLE IS CHEAP. In US, less then USD20K they can buy a nice and decent car and that applies to JAPAN. But in our country, what can you get will the price less then 20K? Nowadays not even a basic PROTON BLM. Some more with all those problematic.[/quote]
1) At the end of the day, the PPP adjusted spending power of malaysians is only ~33% that of people in developed first world nations.
2) Proton car prices are, believe it or not, competitive. They are cheaper here than anywhere else in the asean region. They are competitive in Thailand…where the prices of foreign brands are, believe it or not, more expensive than in malaysia. Ask your friends working in thailand how much an accord costs there. The prices of foreign makes for <2L cars are not much lower in other parts of the world. Australia recently mandated all manufacturers to put OTR prices…not the artificially cheap showroom price. So yeah, go check out the websites… An auto VTI Jazz now costs over $24000AUD (RM72k)… unlike the prevoiusly advertised $21000AUD (RM63k).
3) Public transport will never be as efficient in Malaysia as HK/SG because THOSE COUNTRIES ARE CITY STATES. Malaysia is simply not like that. Things are far more spread out…and the cost for enabling MRT like systems in malaysia, purely due to the fact that we are more spread out… is exponentially higher and unfeasable.
[quote comment="242617"][quote comment="242521"]Err…. actually VW want more than 50% share, so if that no more PeRusahaan OTOmobil National (PROTON). G don"t want lose other national car coz of "Tamak" atau "Greedy" dlm bahasa omputeh. :)[/quote]
Please tell me, why Proton end up with Mitsubishi in past? Cuz it got the Lotus?[/quote]
no there end up because mitsubishi is not moving the tech to proton but just order proton to build card like 1+2=3 but no explain why 1+2=3 so proton just like puppet, that why there end.
BTW recently news say there cooperate agasint for platform sharing :)
[quote comment="242635"]
1) At the end of the day, the PPP adjusted spending power of malaysians is only ~33% that of people in developed first world nations.
2) Proton car prices are, believe it or not, competitive. They are cheaper here than anywhere else in the asean region. They are competitive in Thailand…where the prices of foreign brands are, believe it or not, more expensive than in malaysia. Ask your friends working in thailand how much an accord costs there. The prices of foreign makes for <2L cars are not much lower in other parts of the world. Australia recently mandated all manufacturers to put OTR prices…not the artificially cheap showroom price. So yeah, go check out the websites… An auto VTI Jazz now costs over $24000AUD (RM72k)… unlike the prevoiusly advertised $21000AUD (RM63k).
3) Public transport will never be as efficient in Malaysia as HK/SG because THOSE COUNTRIES ARE CITY STATES. Malaysia is simply not like that. Things are far more spread out…and the cost for enabling MRT like systems in malaysia, purely due to the fact that we are more spread out… is exponentially higher and unfeasable.[/quote]
Dear Ezra,
I agree with what you mentioned about comparison in car price pre tax is not much different comparing proton with other brand. But you might also need to bared in mind that their equipment put into the car and quality build of the car is also different from what we get here. With the price that they pay, specs, equipment, accessories is different as well.
What I'm asking is that just be fair to the people. ABS, AirBag, VSC all these technology is use to save our lives, not luxury stuff. When my dad buy MYVI, the salesman tell him that Air Bag and ABS seldom used. So no need to have. But what was in my mind is that I would never want to use them. Cos if i really need to use them, that means i'm in great danger, life is definately more precious with so called national pride.
And then rise another question, how come our currency last time exchange rate to SGD is about 1.0-1.0, but now change to 1.0-2.5 ? Is our country not competitive enough? We don't have the knowledge like what SG ppl have? This I don't understand.
2. Public transport is not just talking about MRT/LRT, it is talking about the whole system which include busses, MRT route, train and others. Just ask yourself, at the place that you stay, how often you will see the bus move around? And where did the bus went to? And have you been to HK? do you know how big is HK? yes, i agree that HK island is quite small, nothing much can be say but how about Kowloon? I like they public transport system is that all bus are linked nicely where if the place is not reachable by MRT, bus can reach there and the most important thing, then frequency and punctuality is way better the what we get over here. If the public transport is good, I myself definitely don't want to drive. Driving in KL area is a nightmare, believe me.
point 1. tukar gomen, sebab gomen ini, bazir duit rakyat. Dia simpan proton, supaya boleh tax kereta, supaya boleh bagi AP kepada anak buah nya. supaya boleh keluar model lama(saga&wira&waja), charge harga baru.
2. simpan proton, sebab dengan monopoli, apa pun boleh buat, kereta mahal pun, orang kena beli. Kalau altis sama harga dengan waja, you beli waja , itu patriotik, kalau altis mahal, you beli saga blm, sebab you tak mampu, jangan confuse.
3. Supaya boleh tipu korang, sekarang loan 9 tahun, you orang miskin boleh beli kereta tau??
tapi apasal nak beli kereta? sebab you tak ader bas. Kalau you kilang operator boleh la, naik bas kilang, kalau you diploma kerani, yang gaji rm1500, mampui dah you, sebab you kena beli kancil RM30k, yang guna 20 bulan gaji.
4.Tak boleh compare dengan USA, sebab kita bodo, ok ,tak apa.
you tahu tak, berapa negara yang ada brand kereta sendiri?? kawan? siapa tau? lebih kurang 11 negara ada kereta jenama sendiiri. negara yang paling miskin dalam 12 negara tu, malaysia la, siapa lagi.
taiwan= no national car ( all kilang macam perodua, rebatch)
australia= no national car( holden= ford rebatch)
china= negara yang paking banyak cash tu, sekarang baru ader brand sendiri,tu cherry la ( tapi ader audi rebatch, BMW local made, mitsu rebatch,honda rebatch,toyota rebatch, daihatsu tak da, subaru tak da,nissan rebatch)
singapore, thailand,indon,UK,spain (jugak rebatch), korean tu ( kereta die, kerajaan korean jugak pakai)
apasal negara yang kaya sikit, tak buat brand sendiri? sebab kereta ini, high tech. Apasal malaysia tak tanah beras banyak sikit, nak beli dari thailand? beras beli dari thailand, kereta pun beli dari thailand, durian pun beli dari thailand, ini kerajaan buat apa?? makan nasi paprik,nasi pataya lagi.
kita kat kampung pun, bukan juara dah!!!!
5. jangan marah tak menang, minta orang balik negara apa. ini negara saya jua, i pun harap die jadi bagus. you tengok, 20 tahun dah, ada kah bus & public transport jadi banyak sikit?? dulu you pi shopping center boleh naik bas, sekarang boleh kar??
jangan perli orang penang, kedah, semua pemimpin dari sana. Tunku abdul rahman, razak, mahathir, abdullah semua orang dari utara. Dulu KL pun jungle, siapa yang bangunkan, tau la.
6. tanya sendiri, tanya bapak, dulu die bayar car loan, senang tak?? sekarang you bayak car loan senang tak??
you boleh afford kereta bukan sebab you gaji banyak, sebab gomen bagi you hutang banyak tahun sikit, bagi bank untung interest la, kawan, you sekrang kerja untuk bank saja tau?? apasal bagi 7 tahun 9 tahun? kalau tidak, macam mana you pergi kerja? gomen tak bagi bas/LRT pun!!! gomen tak buat dia punya kerja, jadi, dia minta you pi la, pinjam kat bank la, pi la, hutang banyak sikit la.
macam your boss, tak bagi you computer kat office, jadi, minta you, pi la, pi kedai beli computer la, boleh bayak 24 bulan kan?? jadi, you milik computer bayar 24 bulan, ader rasa bangga tak??
7. pi la kira, satu rumah boleh beli berapa kereta. I dun care how poor your country is, if you ringgit kecik, no value, macam tu, mesti rumah tu, murah kan?? tak kan kat africa yang kebuluran tu, rumah mahal, kan?
kat US 1 house = USD 200000 (rumah tapak)
1 car = honda accord = USD 20000
1 house = 10 cars
KAT malaysia,
1 house = rm150000 (rumah tapak kat kampung saja.)
1 car= RM 50000 ( gen 2, bukan branded macam honda accord yang sama, ok, sebab kalau compare kereta sama, nanti you susah hati. Jangan kata besi mahal, raw material mahal, kalau cam tu, siapa mau pi China buka kilang, lepas tu ship ke US, bazir poslaju duit kan? )
kat malaysia
1 rumah = 3 kereta sahaja. RUmah ni, you orang malaysia yang bina, harga tanah, batu bata, semua malaysia kan??? Kereta ni, besi juga dari malaysia kan?? apa yang malaysia tak der? apasal kereta mahal sangat??
WHY IF WE MAKE OUR OWN CAR, WE OURSELVES CANNOT AFFORD IT??
pi la tengok graduan sekarang pakai kereta apa,hutang berapa banyak loan. Pi la compare dengan negara lain, jangan lepas compare, tipu sendiri lagi.
8. untuk negara perancis, semua polis pakai kereta dia pa. US president, pakai kereta US.
Malaysia
JPJ= toyota fortuner (rm200000 ++ )
jabatan kesihatan= toyota fortuner, Nissan x-trail ( RM150000 ++ )
Kastam= volvo XC90(4 wheel drive)
polis= ok la, waja, tapi banyak sangat ni. tapi motosikal besar tu, nak lumba ker apa??
kalau sebuah negara start korup, you boleh tengok kerajaan bangunan & kereta besar dan cantik, tapi rakyat biasa miskin rumah pangsa buruk, kereta kecik.
jadi, nak pakai kereta cantik, pi la kerja kat gomen, at least waktu kerja, pakai kereta besar. Lepas kereta, bawak motor buruk balik rumah.
[quote comment="242599"]this is about brainless people… only care about their own pocket…. dia ingat toyota n honda boleh tlg kalo economy msia merundum… hhehe… poyo la " we deserve the best" … then compare ngan thai n indonn… better get lost from msia…. we are not welcome this kind of citizens….[/quote]
apa kata, you design your own computer?? you design your own mouse, monitor.
You tak boleh compare dengan thai dan indon, sebab you rasa malu. Yes we welcome those stupid and quiet citizen, after we cheat their money,they dare not complain, and we can cheat them again and again.
no money, change your life style. No money buy rice, eat shit la.
Kena VSS?? gomen kata apa? ok, house loan hutang lagi satu tahun, tak payah bayar….interest macam mana? lagi tinggi. kalau mau, pi la guna credit card bayar saman, bayar income tax. Pi la pinjam kat bank untuk bayar gomen. pi la hamba untuk bank. I gomen ni, nak buat policy untuk senang kan anak buah saya. Duit tak cukup, pinjam kat bank.
Tak der bas pi kerja, beli kancil, hutang 9 tahun la. tak pa, you ok, sebab you boleh beli kereta dah. bila pencen, apa pun tarak, tinggal kereta buruk dan EPF sikit, sebab, dah bagi proton untuk R&D and bagi LOTUS R&D ma.
you tolong pi la, tengok gomen, ada apa yang dia beli tu, untuk kepentingan you?
tengok orang besar VIP VIP semua pakai kereta apa, tolong la, pi la tengok. Ferrari, range rover, bentley, and kucing korup macam kita ni, pakai kereta buruk dan overprice, defend dia pa lagi.
ada apa VIP dan anak VIP yang pakai kereta proton?? lawak la korang. lawak.
SIapa tahu PROTON CEO Pakai KERETA PROTON, sila bagi tau. sila bagi tau.
[quote comment="242390"][quote comment="242364"][quote comment="242295"]
Tapi di malaysia perangai/sikap rakyatnya sungguh berbeza….[/quote]
org jepun & korea berkerja bebas 'adil' di negara mereka. siapa saipa yg ada bakat boleh kerja , tapi tak sama sini,[/quote]
haha complain lagi… kesian…
try to think that what you have and don't always think on what you don't have…
Perhaps make your life more happier..[/quote]
correct, if i'm the your boss that
bayak sikit, minta kerja banyak banyak, kerja OT free untuk company.
dan i bagi tau " you ni, lucky tau, banyak orang tak der kerja, jadi, jangan complain, kerja banyak sikit, ".
Oh, i lupa, Boss tu, "BAYAR GAJI".
Gomen tu minta GAJI "Income tax"(gaji)
i tau banyak tak bayar income tax, tapi, you ader bayar highway kan?? kalau gomen yang bina highway, kita tak payah bayar kan?? apasal gomen tak bina??? dia minta orang lain bina, and kutip duit bayar dia. Untung banyak ni….
gomen kata, ""you tengok, kita income tax bayar sikit saja, kat US, bayak banyak tau? """ tapi, you minta highway kutip tax untuk you. you minta toyota honda proton produa kutip tax untuk you.
nak guna highway, kena bayar kan? gunala jalan kampung kalau nak free, tamak sangat ni!! oh macam tu……
nak minta polis tangkap pencuri, nak bayar tak?? rumah api nak minta bomba mai, nak bayar tak?? masuk hospital nak mati dah, nak bayar tak? nak minta kad kredit tak?????
apasal polis tak efficient, tapi, LHDN tu, banyak banyak efficient? hairan kan? kena pencuri samun, kena bunuh tu, polis tak tangkap, tak pa, asalkan income tax bayar secepat mungkin.
jangan complain banyak ni, nanti kena tangkap .
pi la, hujung bulan baru dapat gaji, pi la shopping sikit, nanti bulan tengah, duit habih.
sembang kuat pun, bukan kita orang biasa boleh buat apa apa. kena beli kereta paling murah jua.
=sekian terima kasih.==
[quote comment="242669"][quote comment="242635"]
1) At the end of the day, the PPP adjusted spending power of malaysians is only ~33% that of people in developed first world nations.
2) Proton car prices are, believe it or not, competitive. They are cheaper here than anywhere else in the asean region. They are competitive in Thailand…where the prices of foreign brands are, believe it or not, more expensive than in malaysia. Ask yo
3) Public transport will never be as efficient in Malaysia as HK/SG because THOSE COUNTRIES ARE CITY STATES. Malaysia is simply not like that. Things are far more spread out…and the cost for enabling MRT like systems in malaysia, purely due to the fact that we are more spread out… is exponentially higher and unfeasable.[/quote]
Dear Ezra,
I agree with what you mentioned about comparison in car price pre tax is not much different comparing proton with other brand. But you might also need to bared in mind that their equipment put into the car and quality build of the car is also different from what we get here. With the price that they pay, specs, equipment, accessories is different as well.
What I'm asking is that just be fair to the people. ABS, AirBag, VSC all these technology is use to save our lives, not luxury stuff. When my dad buy MYVI, the salesman tell him that Air Bag and ABS seldom used. So no need to have. But what was in my mind is that I would never want to use them. Cos if i really need to use them, that means i'm in great danger, life is definately more precious with so called national pride.
And then rise another question, how come our currency last time exchange rate to SGD is about 1.0-1.0, but now change to 1.0-2.5 ? Is our country not competitive enough? We don't have the knowledge like what SG ppl have? This I don't understand.
2. Public transport is not just talking about MRT/LRT, it is talking about the whole system which include busses, MRT route, train and others. Just ask yourself, at the place that you stay, how often you will see the bus move around? And where did the bus went to? And have you been to HK? do you know how big is HK? yes, i agree that HK island is quite small, nothing much can be say but how about Kowloon? I like they public transport system is that all bus are linked nicely where if the place is not reachable by MRT, bus can reach there and the most important thing, then frequency and punctuality is way better the what we get over here. If the public transport is good, I myself definitely don't want to drive. Driving in KL area is a nightmare, believe me.[/quote]
Car price in malaysia is highest, and then singapore and hongkong car are also expensive.
but, there is a reason for SG and HK to tax heavily on cars, because they prepared very very efficient MRT/Train system in their island, and to prevent trafficc jam, they impose heavy tax, to encourage ppl to use public transport, becos it is so good.
In this small city of kl, we have 4 company for LRT
Star
putra
monorail
KTM
semua rugi duit.
why small KL need 4 company?? so we can have 4 CEO, 4 Directors, 4 more ways to waste money.
we earn less than hongkong and Singapore citizen, but our car is same price/ more expensive than them.
THeir car second hand value very very low. THats because luxury item depreciate very fast. Here vios and city after 5 yrs still rm50000, because this is a keperluan.
Thats why singapore and hongkong a lot ferrari and porsche, because, cars are luxury item.
Only malaysia full of motorcycle and cars, last time we compare with taiwan, china,singapore,thailand.
now we compare with vietnam, myanmar, pakistan.
in future we compare with africa??
dulu, juara kampung, lain kali, budak kampung saja.
[quote comment="242706"][quote comment="242599"]this is about brainless people… only care about their own pocket…. dia ingat toyota n honda boleh tlg kalo economy msia merundum… hhehe… poyo la " we deserve the best" … then compare ngan thai n indonn… better get lost from msia…. we are not welcome this kind of citizens….[/quote]
apa kata, you design your own computer?? you design your own mouse, monitor.
You tak boleh compare dengan thai dan indon, sebab you rasa malu. Yes we welcome those stupid and quiet citizen, after we cheat their money,they dare not complain, and we can cheat them again and again.
no money, change your life style. No money buy rice, eat shit la.
Kena VSS?? gomen kata apa? ok, house loan hutang lagi satu tahun, tak payah bayar….interest macam mana? lagi tinggi. kalau mau, pi la guna credit card bayar saman, bayar income tax. Pi la pinjam kat bank untuk bayar gomen. pi la hamba untuk bank. I gomen ni, nak buat policy untuk senang kan anak buah saya. Duit tak cukup, pinjam kat bank.
Tak der bas pi kerja, beli kancil, hutang 9 tahun la. tak pa, you ok, sebab you boleh beli kereta dah. bila pencen, apa pun tarak, tinggal kereta buruk dan EPF sikit, sebab, dah bagi proton untuk R&D and bagi LOTUS R&D ma.
you tolong pi la, tengok gomen, ada apa yang dia beli tu, untuk kepentingan you?
tengok orang besar VIP VIP semua pakai kereta apa, tolong la, pi la tengok. Ferrari, range rover, bentley, and kucing korup macam kita ni, pakai kereta buruk dan overprice, defend dia pa lagi.
ada apa VIP dan anak VIP yang pakai kereta proton?? lawak la korang. lawak.
SIapa tahu PROTON CEO Pakai KERETA PROTON, sila bagi tau. sila bagi tau.[/quote]
hahaha…aku rase kalo ko ade duit pon…ko pkai kereta besar, ko akan buat cam org2 kaye skang nie,…sesapa pon akan jadi camtuh bile kaya…
kereta bentley, rolls royce tuh kn ade klas tersendiri…
xpe2…nnti kite same2 buat kereta yg same class ngan bentley…rolls royce..
pastu kite jual kat rakyat malaysia murah2…
profit xpenting bagi kite kn drink_tea?!
eee…xsabala nak buat kete same2 ngan drink_tea
majulah drink_tea & saya utk negara
ohh btw…kalo nak carik pemimpin yg tul2 x pkai mahal2…
ko contohila ahmadinejad…power tuh…gaji kecik..umh kecik..umh pon ade bpe kerat je bodyguard…
marila same2 contohi ahmadinejad…sbb xgune duit sgt
Hi… drink_tea and drink_tea 2, you make us sick in tea season…
buy a 2nd hand car may be a good choice…
(X.X) (T.T) (>.<''')
apa benda la drink_tea ni cakap……
Ya, Proton CEO memang pakai Proton Chancellor ie Waja executive. Waktu Proton Saga BLM launch tahun lepas, dia slalu bawa Saga RED concept utk promote. Kini, dgr kata dia slalu bawa Exora Prestige.
To all experts out there, let's see if any of u have the balls to change the govt or Proton. Else, take responsibility n just STFU. Your irresponsible "armchair critique" attitude had allowed proton n our country to be in this mess.
Drink_tea2 Bagus ! good Gomen
Jalanraya di Jepun di conquer oleh kereta jepun, jalanraya di korea di conqure oleh kereta korea, jalan di malaysia di conqure oleh kereta……..
kita masih di jajahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Hahaha..
[quote comment="242479"]Anyway i am driving a problematic Proton Wira 1.6L, once done the loan thingy. No more Proton Wira, or at least transplant the engine to 4G93T half-cut directly from Mitsubishi.[/quote]
LittleFire.. pls read this with a very sarcastic intonation..
"that 4G93T is a great engine from Mitsu! go and change to that engine.. from half cut some more! what a bargain since that engine you have now in your wira was designed and produced by Prot.. oh shit.. it was originally a Mitsu again!"
p/s: your comments are so stupid that makes me wanna let you taste & enjoy some of it. seriously.
[quote comment="242706"][quote comment="242599"]this is about brainless people… only care about their own pocket…. dia ingat toyota n honda boleh tlg kalo economy msia merundum… hhehe… poyo la " we deserve the best" … then compare ngan thai n indonn… better get lost from msia…. we are not welcome this kind of citizens….[/quote]
apa kata, you design your own computer?? you design your own mouse, monitor.
You tak boleh compare dengan thai dan indon, sebab you rasa malu. Yes we welcome those stupid and quiet citizen, after we cheat their money,they dare not complain, and we can cheat them again and again.
no money, change your life style. No money buy rice, eat shit la.
Kena VSS?? gomen kata apa? ok, house loan hutang lagi satu tahun, tak payah bayar….interest macam mana? lagi tinggi. kalau mau, pi la guna credit card bayar saman, bayar income tax. Pi la pinjam kat bank untuk bayar gomen. pi la hamba untuk bank. I gomen ni, nak buat policy untuk senang kan anak buah saya. Duit tak cukup, pinjam kat bank.
Tak der bas pi kerja, beli kancil, hutang 9 tahun la. tak pa, you ok, sebab you boleh beli kereta dah. bila pencen, apa pun tarak, tinggal kereta buruk dan EPF sikit, sebab, dah bagi proton untuk R&D and bagi LOTUS R&D ma.
you tolong pi la, tengok gomen, ada apa yang dia beli tu, untuk kepentingan you?
tengok orang besar VIP VIP semua pakai kereta apa, tolong la, pi la tengok. Ferrari, range rover, bentley, and kucing korup macam kita ni, pakai kereta buruk dan overprice, defend dia pa lagi.
ada apa VIP dan anak VIP yang pakai kereta proton?? lawak la korang. lawak.
SIapa tahu PROTON CEO Pakai KERETA PROTON, sila bagi tau. sila bagi tau.[/quote]
u lihat , dulu kawan i bapa foreman x da kereta , kerja bagi org,
lepas tu partner ngan org buka kedai tayar,mereka tinggal dlm kedai je,lepas tu bbeli proton saga executive 2nd hand , skrg pakai city,gen2 auto , honda civic 1.8 baru .
intel penang punya ex VP , rumah masih ada wira salloon.
tu org kerja keras kluar punya . beli kereta mewah x hairan la.
memang hasil keras mereka tu.
macam kat MNC tu ,semua org kerja dari bawah.
x ada cam cina mia company , mereka boss keturunan .
tu la ygn merah mata ni , tu la org mai komplen ni.
ohhh drink_tea…
wanna be my partner…
i wanted to build a new car company in Malaysia….
r u interested?
[quote comment="242749"]Jalanraya di Jepun di conquer oleh kereta jepun, jalanraya di korea di conqure oleh kereta korea, jalan di malaysia di conqure oleh kereta……..
kita masih di jajahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh[/quote]
haha….aku teringat tym blaja sejarah dlu…org2 di malaya punyala suka jepun jajah malaya…haha
Dear drink_tea / drink_tea 2 / hongkong_car / kita_boleh / tax_Nonstop / cheap_Cheap / to_p3noy / whatever your other guises are,
1. It'll be nice if you can stick with just one name. It shows more integrity. And maturity.
2. Read your own comment(s) again. Mostly it's the "people" that you're having problem with, not Proton. Why hate Proton so much? Even if Proton goes down, do you honestly think that the problems will cease to exist?
3. Copying bulat2 from the Jap carmakers is definitely not the way forward. Proton does have the ability and capacity to learn, and we can see that they ARE improving.
[quote comment="242713"][quote comment="242669"][quote comment="242635"]
1) At the end of the day, the PPP adjusted spending power of malaysians is only ~33% that of people in developed first world nations.
2) Proton car prices are, believe it or not, competitive. They are cheaper here than anywhere else in the asean region. They are competitive in Thailand…where the prices of foreign brands are, believe it or not, more expensive than in malaysia. Ask yo
3) Public transport will never be as efficient in Malaysia as HK/SG because THOSE COUNTRIES ARE CITY STATES. Malaysia is simply not like that. Things are far more spread out…and the cost for enabling MRT like systems in malaysia, purely due to the fact that we are more spread out… is exponentially higher and unfeasable.[/quote]
Dear Ezra,
I agree with what you mentioned about comparison in car price pre tax is not much different comparing proton with other brand. But you might also need to bared in mind that their equipment put into the car and quality build of the car is also different from what we get here. With the price that they pay, specs, equipment, accessories is different as well.
What I'm asking is that just be fair to the people. ABS, AirBag, VSC all these technology is use to save our lives, not luxury stuff. When my dad buy MYVI, the salesman tell him that Air Bag and ABS seldom used. So no need to have. But what was in my mind is that I would never want to use them. Cos if i really need to use them, that means i'm in great danger, life is definately more precious with so called national pride.
And then rise another question, how come our currency last time exchange rate to SGD is about 1.0-1.0, but now change to 1.0-2.5 ? Is our country not competitive enough? We don't have the knowledge like what SG ppl have? This I don't understand.
2. Public transport is not just talking about MRT/LRT, it is talking about the whole system which include busses, MRT route, train and others. Just ask yourself, at the place that you stay, how often you will see the bus move around? And where did the bus went to? And have you been to HK? do you know how big is HK? yes, i agree that HK island is quite small, nothing much can be say but how about Kowloon? I like they public transport system is that all bus are linked nicely where if the place is not reachable by MRT, bus can reach there and the most important thing, then frequency and punctuality is way better the what we get over here. If the public transport is good, I myself definitely don't want to drive. Driving in KL area is a nightmare, believe me.[/quote]
Car price in malaysia is highest, and then singapore and hongkong car are also expensive.
but, there is a reason for SG and HK to tax heavily on cars, because they prepared very very efficient MRT/Train system in their island, and to prevent trafficc jam, they impose heavy tax, to encourage ppl to use public transport, becos it is so good.
In this small city of kl, we have 4 company for LRT
Star
putra
monorail
KTM
semua rugi duit.
why small KL need 4 company?? so we can have 4 CEO, 4 Directors, 4 more ways to waste money.
we earn less than hongkong and Singapore citizen, but our car is same price/ more expensive than them.
THeir car second hand value very very low. THats because luxury item depreciate very fast. Here vios and city after 5 yrs still rm50000, because this is a keperluan.
Thats why singapore and hongkong a lot ferrari and porsche, because, cars are luxury item.
Only malaysia full of motorcycle and cars, last time we compare with taiwan, china,singapore,thailand.
now we compare with vietnam, myanmar, pakistan.
in future we compare with africa??
dulu, juara kampung, lain kali, budak kampung saja.[/quote]
Oi apek,
hang nak cakap utara ka, hang nak ckp hokkien ka hang tulis properly. Nak marah proton ke, nak marah gomen? kalau tak pueh hati ngan gomen ckp kat MToday, kat MInsider, Mkini, LKSiang, Harakah Daily. Kat sini kita cerita kereta. Nak tau apsal KL kena ada 4 system yg lain? Tanya MOF tahun 1992-1998. PUTRA – UEM/RENONG (Malay College Co – Umno Co – MOF), STAR LRT – Tabung Haji Consortium – Different group kroni. KTM – MOTransport kroni. Monorail – Starts from DRBHicom in 96 (Late YA – MCOBA) sell KLMonorail to Vincent Tan then sell to Scomi (now lead by MCOBA geng and SDARA). Now all public transport under SPNB (SPV for MOF). Ask MOF la. SPNB is trying to cuci taik org lain (at the same time creating wealth, increasing value – but to own geng la pulak). The pathetic state the public transport lies with both so called great leaders – you name both of them. 2-2 outside the gomen now, 1 pencen another 1 kena tendang (by the pencen).
You tell me sapa punya kroni ? Who teaches all this? Kat Singapore ada lagi bnyk GLC – semua leads to 1 family.
Ini Proton punya thread tapi semua nak tulis pasal politic. GM filed for chapter 11, serves the UAW rights.
I do agree that Proton is learning and improving. But in the same time other brands also improving. We are in a fast moving world. With the current speed that Proton improving and learning, definitely it cannot be one of the top brand in car industry, it will always be a kampung Champion. Just imagine, they use up to 20 years then only can build an engine and some more the technology is not something new. Remember in business, they will never wait until you become good and well known. They will just keep on pushing and find a way to push you down.
LOL, what an interesting read.
On one camp, we have Proton supports bashing basically anyone that point the finger at them (even if there are logic behind them – Proton hiring trolls for forums now?) and on the other, People that just don;'t like Proton because they have been burnt before. The banter between them makes for an entertaining afternoon read.
So proton makes a loss, not surprising given the market conditions. This downturn is hitting everyone equally.
But what is interesting, Proton would have had taken an even bigger hit had not the additional help they are getting (ie. preferable pricing structure, taxation, AP, R&D money..etc)
I didn't expect Saga to be making proton much, as its a low margin car, the Exora on the other hand is handicapped by a lackluster engine, and everyone's notion of "its a proton, beter wait for 2nd batch" (a factor of Proton's own making). The older models are just that, old. All made worst when the automotive market isn't as hot anymore and finance companies being wary in loaning money, especially especially to new proton owners.
As per public transport, don't even get me started. It seems that any GLC or Private with government links can't seem to get anythign working wihout siphoning millions of taxpayer money.
Drink_tea wa salute sama lu. Gua pun dah lama suffer. loan kancil tahun 2002 pun tak abis2 sampai skg. Tahun lepas Gua tak cukup duit nak bayar yuran sekolah anak. Mintak cikgu kelas dia tangguhkan. Sampai skg tak bayar2 lagi tau. Sob Sob.
[quote comment="242810"]Dear drink_tea / drink_tea 2 / hongkong_car / kita_boleh / tax_Nonstop / cheap_Cheap / to_p3noy / whatever your other guises are,
1. It'll be nice if you can stick with just one name. It shows more integrity. And maturity.
2. Read your own comment(s) again. Mostly it's the "people" that you're having problem with, not Proton. Why hate Proton so much? Even if Proton goes down, do you honestly think that the problems will cease to exist?
3. Copying bulat2 from the Jap carmakers is definitely not the way forward. Proton does have the ability and capacity to learn, and we can see that they ARE improving.[/quote]
thanks for paying attention ;) those are merely titles instead of nicknames. and,yea, i'm younger in heart.
i'm tired of talking, but thanks again for everyone that care to take time to read my post.
proton is nothing if its not about its people, a factory can be rebuilt anytime, but its the people that counts and its the people that made proton where it is today.
Germans are very fussy, and they do not accept imperfection, that is why they can make one family of car,better and better and better, like golf, and 3/5 series. Attitude that makes a difference, the same goes to Japanese. They will be ashame of a bad product, that is the correct attitude of manufacturing.
They are improving, but not fast enough. If you wanna get annual promotion, you need to improve annually,right? proton still think like a gomen department. How can it survive in the everchanging automotive world?
Proton market share has dropped from more than 50% to less than 25% through out 20 years. After all the protections, favors, subsidy, they are getting less and less support from their own ppl.
pls take a look at this interesting post.
http://art-harun.blogspot.com/2009/06/proton-saga…
[quote comment="242443"]tax_nonstop,
please think before you talk or else you make a fool out of yourself!!
yes we can assemble toyota here…but remember..toyota price a car not only based on the cost of assembly but the real cost of car
1.design
2.development
3.testing
4.production
5.price of raw material
6.marketing
7.advertisement
8.profit
9.R&D funding for the next product!!
and etc
so if toyota do assemble car here..the main cost will still go to japan and japanese will get richer and grow bigger!!!
and there almost too few countries in the world who sell cars tax free!!!!!
lastly…
if you think proton were to close shop and NAP abolished…do you think you will get cheaper car???
the answer is impossible..now the price of foreign makes are priced competitively because the competition with proton!!if there is no proton in our market…they can price the car anyhow they like and they will control the market!!
just assume..if toyota can sell a vios now at rm80K,and if proton is no longer here…and NAP is gone..
and toyota makes just say rm 30k per car profit..do you think they will bring down prices if they dont have competition??
they can sell 3 times lesser car rather than bringing down the price to rm
60k!!!
be happy you have proton because we still can control car prices of foreign makes…
otherwise we will be out of control and they will be in control!!!!!
one last thing is..dont be fool by thailands sucess of housing all the major automotive players in their country!!this was due to cheap labour cost and etc…
but in 5 to 10 years time they will shift to africa or some former soviet union contries because their labour cost will be cheaper!!!!
then thailand will be back to agriculture!!bare that in mind!!!
dont just look thing as short term..think ahead and long term!!!
people around the world were talking the same about koreans..and now look at them!!!go find out how japanese G and korean G protect their automotive industry!!!the internet is all urs!!see how raw materials in japan is given discount or tax exemption,find out how japanese G dispose their cars to 3rd countries and encourage their new car sales…see how their G give out research grants for cleaner engines,greener engines..and etc!!!!!!
get those facts before you talk!!!
and learn about money mechanics…money=debts….if there is no debts there will be no money(cash) circulating in the country!!!!
read more and gain some knowledge before coming out with unlogical comments..pls!![/quote]
abang, by killing proton is actually implying of abolishing all the NEP,AP,expensive highway,all the bad stuff which is infecting malaysia. You and I both know that, PRoton is not going to die, right? it is impossible. Well, not until your petronas and EPF has gone bankrupt.
so, you are against of attracting foreign investment? so, you do not wish to let jap earn your money, and channel it back to jap right? you think your tiny 25million population can support anything, other than food industry? we dont even have any local shoes brand , and 99% malaysian thinks that "Bata" is malaysian brand my goodness. Ok,jimmy choo is out of reach.
foreign investment is good for slow developing country. if you earn everything yourself, you simply cant, this is a flat world, even chinaman kedai runcit also know that we need to have malay and indian customer.
by having jap/korean/us setting up factories here, we are learning. we're learning faster. You do not need to reinvent the wheel, and you do not need to reinvent poke-yoke,5S, toyota production system, lean sigma, without this, you can only open ah beng kedai runcit, but never open more than 2 ah beng kedai runcit, becos you need to have mature and workable system/culture to run shops/company/factory. See how macdonald works?
and frankly, i simply do not think malaysian can afford a local brand ,self-R&D type of automobile company, a rebatch is way way way better.
how the hell are you going to create a chassis as good as wira(well lancer. or lancer evo) by yourself? other than paying lotus to do it. and how to get good engines? even koreans cannot make a good enough engine.
sometimes, its good to learn from the best, just simply copy bulat bulat from the giant, and hey, you can always make a few tweaking and modification, but build from scratch is the best way to burn all your money.
perhaps proton should study hyundai/kia's history and see how the korean made into US market. IF you cannot penetrate US market, you cannot sell to other part of the world. Simple.
bear in mind, we are a very very small country.
and hey, learn what is outsourcing. before you think africa can make cars. And labor cost is not everything. if labor cost is everything. then why everyone goes to china? they should go to africa in the first place. you can compare africa with china right? you got sense right?
Toyota vios is selling at 80k because of govertment tax, i understand that you're more knowledgable than i do, but it does not reflect in your writing,spelling and the way you express your point. Pls do not insult my knowledge.As i'm sure i read more than you do.
if you wanna tell me competition, US is an open market, pls take a look how much the car is selling over there. In case you never been there.
ok, one Nissan Fairlady is USD30000 only.
one Cheapo car is USD 10000 .
second hand car is very cheap.
what makes you think having proton here will make toyota control/lower their price?
abang, pls ask your father, how much one toyota corolla costs in malaysia last time. RM20k which is same price with Proton saga. Those buying saga at that time is really patrotic.
How much is one Nissan sunny? same price with wira. How much is Nissan sentra now? ( succesor of Sentra)
without proton and if they open the market. price are going down. i understand you do not familiar with economics but you can always learn from the internet. and open market bring the price down.
i may not be in automotive industry, but, hey,
I'm a taxi driver, i have been driving for 20 years, so i'm better than michael schumacher?????
since making cars need so many bla bla bla cost. what makes you think that Malaysia, one small country can afford all these costs? With such a tiny volume? Why not share with the whole whole through Global player( VW,Toyota,Honda). We share R&D Cost among….ahmad, ahbeng, and deva only, and we even pay for LOtus R&D. silly isnt it? did you read economics 101?
and btw, its not good to insult and critic someone's knowledge. as you do not know better than i do.
GM filed for chapter 11, and brings a lot of ppl going down with them. Pls take a look at penang robert bosch , how many malay operator gone jobless. heard they cried when they get the salary( paid 1.5 months of salary only)
Why we talk politics? becos your leader is a politician.
if your leader is an F1 driver, then we only talk about cars.
but, my bad for dirfting all this away from car industry topic. my bad.
cronis? need to teach? need to teach to makan suap? wow….malaysian are so stupid that need ppl to teach to makan rasuah?
well. dont you agree that the "1 family" that rule singapore is better than "many families" that is ruling malaysia?
Oh, malaysia is better than singapore,thailand,vietnam,indon in atttracting foreign investment. Ic.
but why even ARab & brunei also dont wanna invest in malaysia,but they choose singapore? must be the "1 family" rasuah banyak la…..but hey, arab& brunei, not abang adik malaysia? man, we even got road sign in arab words( and never seen any chinese/indian roadsign). opps. drifting away from car topics again.
ok la, proton bagus, exora bagus, but i think when perodua comes out with "Passo Vette" then, exora will suffer like Savvy again. Lets hope it wont lose so bad this time. lets pray for our hardearned EPF money…..damn.
[quote comment="242717"][quote comment="242706"][quote comment="242599"]this is about brainless people… only care about their own pocket…. dia ingat toyota n honda boleh tlg kalo economy msia merundum… hhehe… poyo la " we deserve the best" … then compare ngan thai n indonn… better get lost from msia…. we are not welcome this kind of citizens….[/quote]
apa kata, you design your own computer?? you design your own mouse, monitor.
You tak boleh compare dengan thai dan indon, sebab you rasa malu. Yes we welcome those stupid and quiet citizen, after we cheat their money,they dare not complain, and we can cheat them again and again.
no money, change your life style. No money buy rice, eat shit la.
Kena VSS?? gomen kata apa? ok, house loan hutang lagi satu tahun, tak payah bayar….interest macam mana? lagi tinggi. kalau mau, pi la guna credit card bayar saman, bayar income tax. Pi la pinjam kat bank untuk bayar gomen. pi la hamba untuk bank. I gomen ni, nak buat policy untuk senang kan anak buah saya. Duit tak cukup, pinjam kat bank.
Tak der bas pi kerja, beli kancil, hutang 9 tahun la. tak pa, you ok, sebab you boleh beli kereta dah. bila pencen, apa pun tarak, tinggal kereta buruk dan EPF sikit, sebab, dah bagi proton untuk R&D and bagi LOTUS R&D ma.
you tolong pi la, tengok gomen, ada apa yang dia beli tu, untuk kepentingan you?
tengok orang besar VIP VIP semua pakai kereta apa, tolong la, pi la tengok. Ferrari, range rover, bentley, and kucing korup macam kita ni, pakai kereta buruk dan overprice, defend dia pa lagi.
ada apa VIP dan anak VIP yang pakai kereta proton?? lawak la korang. lawak.
SIapa tahu PROTON CEO Pakai KERETA PROTON, sila bagi tau. sila bagi tau.[/quote]
hahaha…aku rase kalo ko ade duit pon…ko pkai kereta besar, ko akan buat cam org2 kaye skang nie,…sesapa pon akan jadi camtuh bile kaya…
kereta bentley, rolls royce tuh kn ade klas tersendiri…
xpe2…nnti kite same2 buat kereta yg same class ngan bentley…rolls royce..
pastu kite jual kat rakyat malaysia murah2…
profit xpenting bagi kite kn drink_tea?!
eee…xsabala nak buat kete same2 ngan drink_tea
majulah drink_tea & saya utk negara[/quote]
kalau profit tu nak minta sedekah dengan EPF and tax orang biasa/orang miskin, betul, profit tak penting. kalau nak jadi kaya dengan rompak orang miskin, betul, profit tu, mmg penting. Kalau nama tu, kereta nasional, tapi, jual mahal mahal sebab tak tau jimat, mmg profit tu, tak penting.
erm, you missed my point. my point is those so called VIPs are driving big cars not because they are earning it legally or the way common ppl did.
i'm not jealous of those driving big cars.
but are you telling me the Oxford son in law who is driving a Range ROver V8 ( more than rm500k ) is driving that car because he is working harder than you and i ? then i'm wordless.
Who in our government are driving a proton? They travelled in perdana simply because gomen paid for it, and instructed them to use it.
Why our JPJ,Kementerian kesihatan,kastam are driving bigger and bigger cars? while common ppl are driving a smaller and smaller car?
i'm not asking for dirt cheap car. i'm asking for a competitive car.
so, myvi is more competitive than persona/gen2/savvy, because it is selling better at same price.Even if it is a hatchback.
this is called competitive. learn how to be competitive. not how to earn more money through monopoly.
learn how to argue with informative facts, not through insult and bashing, then, both side will learn.
Proton will die if they are not getting more and more competitive in the next 10 years. period.
[quote comment="242739"]apa benda la drink_tea ni cakap……
Ya, Proton CEO memang pakai Proton Chancellor ie Waja executive. Waktu Proton Saga BLM launch tahun lepas, dia slalu bawa Saga RED concept utk promote. Kini, dgr kata dia slalu bawa Exora Prestige.
To all experts out there, let's see if any of u have the balls to change the govt or Proton. Else, take responsibility n just STFU. Your irresponsible "armchair critique" attitude had allowed proton n our country to be in this mess.[/quote]
"dont complain and STFU attitude" is what brings us to this mess, i agree. but if you read some wrong statement, why not correct them, why would you need to swear? Forum is a place to express, and if you do not like this, try www.fmylife.com. it is a great place to go.
swearing doesnt bring any good, are you mad because you didnt get laid last few days? try jerking off maybe?
btw: i heard waja chancellor is a failure right? there goes some EPF money and tax payer money again…..sigh…they never learn….
i was wondering, why british gomen let all their car company being purchased? even poor country like malaysia also can buy Lotus?
is UK so poor? are we better than them? have they lost the skill of making cars and need to buy everycar from japan,us and malaysia? All their money flowing to Jap and US and MALAYSIA!!!!
hahaha, so we can start selling saga/iswara to UK and selling them at RM60000!!! they have to buy, they need to buy, they must buy!
so, now foreign country controlled their car market, damn, they must be driving kancil & savvy to work, and need to pay many years of car loan for a small car.damn. i'll bet a vios is now RM80000 in UK, lol.
i'm sure british citizen need to work oversea as cheap labour already, since, u see, they cannot even afford a car company anymore….thats karma for colonizing the whole world!!!
wow….malaysia is better than UK already. damn, i'm so proud of this.
yes malaysia boleh!
hmmm…
care to elaborate what does the reason for the losses?
1. r&d losses?
2. shrinking market?
haih..enuf with politics.
yg ckp berdegar2 ni pakai kete ape la ye gamaknye?
m5? jag xf? testarossa? nardo?
yg kaya/bos sbb warisan biar la diorg kaya, jgn nk dengki2 pulak.
yg belum kaya/belum jadi boss ni kena la usaha sungguh2.
pd yg kaya warisan, kuarkn la zakat.
pd yg blum kaya, praktisla kuarkn zakat spy kaya nnt senang kuar zakat.
aku pk yg simple2 je.
keyword: SELF-SUFFICIENT
haha…
drink_tea, puas cakap… jadi ahli politik la…
since u r all knowing person…
Politic no need knowing, they need blinder to supports.
Yeah… ^w^)v
We will beat down British closer.
After that, is Japan, hehehe…
Do believing in KARMA. *shine*
lets build a new car company…
who wants to join…??
Gov lost money to Proton just a little penny but if Proton not exist, Gov lost money to foreign country could be much a lot more.
Jap makes car at least 10,000units per month, one year their produce more then 6 new models. Don't compare Proton with Jap.
It is good to have someone that "know-it-all" around here.. i think US fellas should start to talk about "where did our tax monies go?" right now… Every time when they talks about GM and Chrysler, they should included about taxes and politics issues in their conservations…
Drink_tea. I support you. we deserved it.
I guess Proton's problem was developing the Satria NEO & Savvy, both which are aimed at a niche market. The cost of developing new models are very high and they went ahead with 2 niche models. They should have developed the new SAGA & EXORA before messing with niched market cars. Just look at all the new models that are selling well, Persona, Saga & Exora. Malaysians want sedan cars with 4 doors & people movers. Savvy went head to head with all the other Perodua makes and was sidelined. The NEO, being a 2 door car, only catered to the boy racers wannabes, since it's not a sports car. At least they seem to be on the right track… for now. They should seriously roll out a Waja replacement soon and after that a Perdana replacement.
[quote comment="242927"][quote comment="242739"]apa benda la drink_tea ni cakap……
Ya, Proton CEO memang pakai Proton Chancellor ie Waja executive. Waktu Proton Saga BLM launch tahun lepas, dia slalu bawa Saga RED concept utk promote. Kini, dgr kata dia slalu bawa Exora Prestige.
To all experts out there, let's see if any of u have the balls to change the govt or Proton. Else, take responsibility n just STFU. Your irresponsible "armchair critique" attitude had allowed proton n our country to be in this mess.[/quote]
"dont complain and STFU attitude" is what brings us to this mess, i agree. but if you read some wrong statement, why not correct them, why would you need to swear? Forum is a place to express, and if you do not like this, try www.fmylife.com. it is a great place to go.
swearing doesnt bring any good, are you mad because you didnt get laid last few days? try jerking off maybe?
btw: i heard waja chancellor is a failure right? there goes some EPF money and tax payer money again…..sigh…they never learn….[/quote]
What I want is for ppl to have the same perspective as those in Proton management or the govt. It's easy to say "govt shud reduce tax, govt shud sell proton to foreigners, govt shud this, shud that blabla", but if u are the person who's responsible for making such decisions, then you'll realise it's not as simple as that.
So really, if you think you're THAT expert, why not send a resume to be Proton's next CEO? Or contest in the next GE n go for the PM post?
Of course they are not know-it-all, but so are we, so why wanna leave comments in such an arrogant I-know-best-while-they-know-nothing? If wanna correct them, then do so in a mature and realistic manner as if you're talking face to face with them. The Proton CEO does read this blog and motortrader. You can even interact with him in motortrader forum, n he will reply some of them whenever he's free. So go ahead, I'd like to see drink_tea posting in that forum.
Worse still, I see that some ppl are blaming a certain race for this problem. It reflects on their immaturity on their understanding of this problem.
So these experts have presented themselves in a manner that deserves no serious attention, nor the need to be polite with them. If they think malays are the problem, and that they'll get 1st class treatment in Indonesia, Thailand, Australia, USA, Japan, I wish them good luck. I'm replying in this manner cuz I want to make them happy. Well, at the very least, Vios is very cheap in those countries, no?
[quote comment="243005"]
So these experts have presented themselves in a manner that deserves no serious attention, nor the need to be polite with them. If they think malays are the problem, and that they'll get 1st class treatment in Indonesia, Thailand, Australia, USA, Japan, I wish them good luck. I'm replying in this manner cuz I want to make them happy. Well, at the very least, Vios is very cheap in those countries, no?[/quote]
WTH who exactly thinking Proton are Malay problem, except the stupid one/politician. I am too disappoint to you too that I am so very happy to hear "YOU DON'T LIKE IT, YOU CAN GO OUT" bla bla bla. FML? FYL? Calm down man, you are out of your control…
[quote comment="242964"]lets build a new car company…
who wants to join…??[/quote]
Wait me, I am now go to damacai, toto, magnum, genting… to correct $$. FML
[quote comment="243018"][quote comment="243005"]
So these experts have presented themselves in a manner that deserves no serious attention, nor the need to be polite with them. If they think malays are the problem, and that they'll get 1st class treatment in Indonesia, Thailand, Australia, USA, Japan, I wish them good luck. I'm replying in this manner cuz I want to make them happy. Well, at the very least, Vios is very cheap in those countries, no?[/quote]
WTH who exactly thinking Proton are Malay problem, except the stupid one/politician. I am too disappoint to you too that I am so very happy to hear "YOU DON'T LIKE IT, YOU CAN GO OUT" bla bla bla. FML? FYL? Calm down man, you are out of your control…[/quote]
"you tak suka, you keluar dari malaysia"…… kah? hohoho
In this post, anj97 do have a problem with malays… and if u read any The Malaysian Insider's news abt Proton, almost every commenter has. Sorry, but racial discussion ends here.
I've said it that if u really want to help, write to Proton MD in motortrader. Also, have faith in the person you have voted and make it your responsibility that they do their job well.
Ranting endlessly won't help. The world doesn't owe you a living, regardless of where you're born. You don't seriously believe this is a more helpful method than my suggestions, do you?
Due to pressures from many forummers in motortrader, Exora now is eligible for XChange program. Does that not prove my point?
no need to tell proton what to do lah… sudah pandai…. jual agusta RM1 sahaja…..ahahahahahahahahahahahah………….
Almost burning RM1 million per day.
Who’s fault? You lah, because you don’t want support Proton.
You didn’t lose if you buy a Proton. Buy a Proton, you don’t need to pay import tax, you also can save Proton from losing tax money again.
Actually, help Proton = help yourself/us.
*SURELY CAN DO IT*
tutup saja lah , tak guna langsung RM1jual saja wakakakka
Where should i fund the 1000000 ringgit to burn this 1 ringgit? i want got to genting to see Ah Lim this weekend to try mt luck.
[quote comment="243070"]no need to tell proton what to do lah… sudah pandai…. jual agusta RM1 sahaja…..ahahahahahahahahahahahah………….[/quote]
ahahahahahahahaha… r u sure that Proton selling MV Agusta just only RM1? or 1 Euro? ahaks… Proton jual sebab MV Agusta byk hutang.. kalo Proton guna duit byk sgt utk cover hutang tu, nanti korg cakap yg proton pakai duit tax yg ko bayar utk cover hutang tu (byk mana je tax yg ko byr pun).. daripada bayar hutang dan rugi sampai berjuta Euro dimasa hadapan, lebih baik jual 1 Euro dan tak payah tanggung kerugian lagi… ada paham kah? asal cerita pasal proton, mesti ada connect dgn cerita lama.. lepas ni ulang balik pasal tax, koroni, politik, gahmen dan sebagainya…
I hear that Proton buy MV Agusta just only 1 ringgit, even roti telur also 1+ ringgit. How much profit Proton got arr to sell this 1 ringgit? And where is the motor right now, goreng roti?
So Proton is pandai than BMW and Harley? how come they buy? baca bawah :P u tell me…
Purchase and sale by Proton
Heavily indebted, the manufacturer was bought by Malaysian carmaker Proton in December 2004 for 70 million euro. In December 2005 however, Proton decided to cut its ties with MV Agusta and sold it to GEVI SpA, a Genoa-based financing company related to Carige, for a token euro excluding debt.
In 2006 that financing company, GEVI SpA, with 65% of the share capital, had refinanced MV Agusta, and by so doing allowed the company to continue, and brought MV Agusta ownership back to Italy.
[edit] After The Sale
[edit] BMW Buys Husqvarna From MV Agusta
In July 2007 MV Agusta Motor S.p.A, sold the Husqvarna motorcycle brand to BMW Motorrad for an undisclosed amount[1]. Accorting to MV Agusta president Claudio Castiglioni, the sale was a strategic step to concentrate all of the company's resources in order to expand MV Agusta and Cagiva presence in the international markets having more financial resources for new models development.[1]
[edit] Acquisition by Harley-Davidson
Following years of stalled ownership, the Guggenheim's "Art of the Motorcycle" icon, the F4 model, was ready for a refresh but the financial status of the company did not allow it. On July 11, 2008 Harley-Davidson announced they had signed a definitive agreement to acquire the MV Agusta Group for $109M USD (€70M). The purchase has sparked much interest and hope for a new direction for the company. [2][3] The acquisition was completed on August 8. [4
lu ada paham tak tak pandai jaga jangan lah beli bodoh! rugi duit lagi malu negara! kepala otak proton concentrate buat engine baru lah! campro campro
ini kan forum? tak cakap ulang mana you org ingat? kan org cakap Malaysian senang lupa?
I think Proton should start developing the lower cost cars like Tata Nano, it would easy sold in Asia and Africa, because the very only competitor is just only Tata, it make sure that easy to survive.
Proton buy MV Agusta for 70 million euros (RM367.6 million) and decided to sell the stake a year later for just 1 euro (RM5).
1 year before = RM 3,676,000,000
1 year after = RM 5
can order 3 roti telur arr.
The news
http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/index.php/mala…
Don't try too much, learn how to easy forget, life will easy and simple.
BTW, Proton sold MV Agusta for 1 euro to leave the heavily indebted. Don't bash too much, you know how many taxpayer's money save with this only 1 euro? You do. THX god to existence this 1 euro.
81million R&D that is tax payer's money. After so many years of investment from the Government, is it time to let go and let Proton try to stand by themselves and use the tax payers money somewhere else? It has been 20+ years and I wonder how many revenue did the Governemnt recovered from all this years, and if a business is not making money, why doing it? why dont we just give those jobless people RM500/month instead of wasting money here in this auto business again?
With the Auto industry moving to either hybrid or electric car, I think in 5-10 years, Proton can only survived by NAP continue so the rakyat buying expensive, and low-tech car while other part of the world is running petrol hybrid, diesel hybrid or electric car, but we poor malaysian gota drive the expensive petrol car under the "protective industry agreement".
It may look faster than anticipate, just remember how tv changed to LCD and camera changed to digital. Those left behind will go out of business, and Proton will be one of those when the industry shift. mark my word.
shoruyken & drink_tea well said.
but some of people really cant accept the fact proton not able to catch up..
fact is fact remember.
doing business nowadays you think is easier ah??
not easy anymore. nowadays doing business more competitive!
That y people said as long as stay competitive can last u longer.
i know proton is improving but not pace/competitive enough to catch up.
is a reality /fact.
hehe.
STOP FIGHTING LA… WE MUST SUPPORT PROTON AND GIVE THEM MORE TIME.
maybe they need 100 years to make sure the power window doesn't fail,
120 years to make sure the interior dashboard doesn't vibrate after 2 weeks,
170 years to make sure the boot doesn't collect rain water,
200 years to make sure their 3rd brake lights doesn't burnout after 6 months,
you can continue your own listing…
so, we must all support proton. give them all our money. maybe by the end of 1 millennium, we can have a proper quality proton that doesn't have any defects. then only we can talk about protons having a r&d dept coming up with their own designs.
Yeah, after 300 years later can develop Proton BMW, but…
Nolah wei, I don't have much time to waiting and supporting.
Let's boost up 10x $$ to 30 years. Good dear.
If any of Proton management staff or Chairman here, please read on:
First of all, nothing is fair in this world. In the world of commercial world, fairness is not justified. When Intel and Microsoft dominate computing industry, fairness is not justified. Same applied for automotive industry. When Toyota eventually dominates world automotive market share, tell me you accept any selling price posted by them. Thus, when Malaysia initially commenced the Proton project, the government has implemented the notorious automative car policy to groom the national car project. The intention was commercially justifiable. However, after years of sales success, the once brand name every Malaysian proud of has become a financial burden. The tragic of never ending fuzz of all these Proton bashers and supporters began when Malaysian realize that monopoly leads to deteriorating in quality of a basic and decent power window, which also leads to many other indurable components and parts of Proton cars. This unavoidably forced Malaysian to link the poor supply chain to many conspiracy theories, which includes the famous, politics. Proton does not have any competive advantage over its rivals, other than the protective national car policy. Liberalising the said policy would kill Proton instantly without question, even so it could be done in stages. I wonder what is the timeline given to Proton for the liberalisation.
Secondly, by industry standard, Proton fails anyway in any possible ways of making car. The lack of innovative as well as research and development, has since day one destined Proton's fate of today. I am not talking about new car models (if that's what you think it's called new model when the engine is in fact Mitsubishi obsolete technology sold to us for handsome royalty), I am talking about innovative and R&D in terms of engine making, safety improvement, fuel efficiency improment despite engine improment and so forth. Unfortunately, we come up with Campro engine after 20 over years of so called "intensive research and development", which I am sadly to put all Malaysian to shame. Japan was once known as the famous copycat in its technogies once after world war two but the japanese is never ashamed because they know one day they will conquer the world with their continueous hardship and strive for improvements. And today we have Toyota. There is no easy way out from technology other than research and development, and we are talking about billions of capital investment every year. The investment outlay is for long-term as competitive advantage is built through out decades, not years. When Toyota has years entered into hybrid type engine era, we are still struggling with power window issue. What a big let down.
Finally, I always wanted to be a proud Malaysian. But many cicumstances have deterred me to be so. Not many nations could have their owned-brand, at least not for ASEAN countries (Thailand is a manufacturing hub while Korean is not part of ASEAN). And after 24 years since its first model and Proton is telling me that it is able to export 10% of its car. And don't get me wrong, Proton exported models with power steering, ABS and airbags back in the 90s to England when we are wondering what is the big hole in our Saga dashboard for (For your information, it is designed to fit a passenger airbag, just in case you don't know). And for those who own export model, you must agree with me that the car is built more sturdy and with better quality in every possible ways it can as compared with its local variant. It is a true fact I do not criticise blantly and everyone knows about it. Proton has been depriving the benefits gained from its artificial advantages from national car policy and it was hoping to penetrate oversea market by so call "low pricing but same comparatable quality of European car strategy". But it failed miserably and still failing. Why? You must think that the British is an idiot to purchase an obsolete techology despite the attrative cheap selling price (please do not use exchange rate, only politician who does not comprehend economics would uses this stupid excuse to compare our excessive expensive car price with other countries). The world is on constant change and so does automotive technology. We used to think that we are a net oil exporting country and we can enjoy low fuel prices despite we are buying fuel-inefficient car. But by 2010, which has few months to go, Malaysia would become a net oil importing country and with every declining world oil reserve, do you think you can run tap water with your car?
My argument is plain and obvious, let those who knows how to make a car to make a car. By wasting our country resources on a guaranteed loss investment, it's pathetic and saddening. If I were the prime minister, I would give a timetable not longer than 10 years to liberalise the national automotive policy. Stop giving craps like loss of thousands of employments and imbalance of natinoal trading deficit (in fact our country finance position is still in deficit) when we imported cars. Why politicians never think of we could export more cars than we import like what Thailand does? Do you know that by applying purchasing power theorem (one dollar earned in Malaysia is same as one dollar earned in any country), we Malaysian are purchasing car at the rate of higher than house! (Very easy, if compare your car loan instalment with your housing loan instalment, which one is higher? Do not give me stupid reason that housing loan instalment is longer than car loan, even in fact it is. This due to house appreciates in value, car does not. So, tell me why on earth we are paying more for something worths nothing, i.e. car, at the end higher than something worths 50% to 150% more, i.e. house, at the end?!)
I hope Malaysian think better than iraqi people..At LEAST we able to produce
the car…U all think Japan better on quality .that is wrong…quality not from
Japan but attitude of people…whenJapan company assembling the car in Malaysia their made our people like cowww…u know cow (Lembu la) the company put chain on our nose…like shit!!!!That why their got quality…but Malaysian company like proton just give freedom to Malaysian workerrr to do their abilty and limit…(jst lazy people make proton quality drop not all)
I think my friend here betters apply job with proton n then u change the ttotalll problem…just wrote comment my grandma also can la condemn2 habuk pun tarak!!!!
Quality on JAPAN products such Honda n Toyota caused their take our talent…..to do business strategies..
And Conclusion here…Malaysian people in this forum who condemn Proton is the stupid people n the most bloody hell for our country ….Their said I paid tax so much… the bloody hell..man!!!! I work with IRB the most tax payer is Petronas not individual person…..U just paid so little tax to feed chicken man…the petronas money is our belove country right…that ok to help Protonnnn…..
help is ok ma..at least proton able to feed their workersss who are Malaysian
just pay tax a few Ringgit not enough to build even ur toilet…..!!!!!!LIFE PROTON FOREVER……!!!!!
Malaysia mentality:::::
Even illegal immigrant Malaysian say so quality … so U pikir la sendiri!!!!
how about proton which local company….????/ the will condemn until die