Proton disposes of MV Agusta for 1 Euro
Proton Holdings has sold it’s 57.57 percent stake in MV Agusta Spa to an Italian company Gevi Spa. Gevi Spa will assume MV Agusta’s debts and working capital requirements totalling 139.44 million euros, as announced today to Bursa Malaysia by Proton Holdings as part of it’s non-core asset divesting exercise.
Interesting to note that Proton originally acquired MV Agusta Spa last year on July 7 2004 for 70 million Euro, and finally sold it for a token sum of 1 Euro (RM4.48).
December 28, 2005 @ 9:38 am
i can buy also liao..!
December 28, 2005 @ 9:47 am
Though Proton couldnt do much with the book, its better late than never.
December 28, 2005 @ 10:14 am
wah..so cheap, RM4.48 only…
December 28, 2005 @ 10:18 am
huh… ya… Selling price is only 1 Euro, but the buyer has to assume all and any debts that the company has. Would you still wanna buy it?
This is something like Tony Fernandez buying the airline company that he turned into Air Asia la… That fella’s business acumen can be considered legendary now… How he managed to turn a near bankrupt company into the most sucessful budget airline in Asia is amazing.
Hopefully whoever who bought MV Agusta can do the same thing.
December 28, 2005 @ 10:21 am
Bought at RM 313,600,000.00 and sold at RM 4.48! What a damn big looser.
December 28, 2005 @ 10:22 am
Good money down the drain as always and we will all forget about this and no one will claim responsibility
Now this is what i call a culture of excellent
December 28, 2005 @ 10:44 am
Proton …good Move…. bring more good quality n technology to Malaysian n overseas customers….
December 28, 2005 @ 10:44 am
Bought at RM 313,600,000.00 and sold at RM 4.48!
Shame on “Potong” that waste the money for nothing.
What the hell are they doing, shame for the country.
Why Goverment still want to buy “Potong” share while they know they are the big looser and no brain fellow running the company.
How can they dump in the $$ without details study first.
Someone got to responsible for this!
Just like the case of MAS, why keep loosing $$, where else AirAsia can make profit.
MAS get full support from Goverment, yet still loosing $$, AirAsia is on their own but can survive, and bold at the end of day.
Come on, MAS, don’t make anymore excuse, U are wasting Rakyat “bloody” money just to fill up your pocket.
How can they say paying $7k+ to maksalik is a special case, are you trying to fool us, who will believe.
December 28, 2005 @ 10:49 am
Come on Rakyat Malaysia!! Post your unsatisfy sound here, so “They” will know we are concern and we are unhappy about it.
And hopefully they will be more caution on all the decision make in the future for the benefit of Rakyat.
December 28, 2005 @ 11:47 am
A good decision for Proton. Rather than continuously getting suffer, a one time “cut-throat” pair is a must. At least we start to see Proton really dare to change, thus showing some improvement of Proton in making decision.
December 28, 2005 @ 11:53 am
——Jenssss said,
December 28, 2005 @ 10:21 am
Bought at RM 313,600,000.00 and sold at RM 4.48! What a damn big looser.
ello brader….. do you think it easy doing bussiness…….. this is proton(risk N return is different) not pisang goreng stall…… if easy i dont think lotus shareholder sold it share to proton……..
December 28, 2005 @ 11:54 am
Next up on the board; Malaysia Airlines.
Can I have the first bid for this award-winning airline?
December 28, 2005 @ 11:59 am
Berikutan pengambilalihan itu, Gevi akan mengambil alih hutang MV Agusta berjumlah 106.94 juta euro (RM478 juta), di samping menyediakan keperluan modal kerja sebanyak 32.5 juta euro (RM145.3 juta).
Xoomie nak beli? Beli 1 euro, hutang 106.94 euro..!
December 28, 2005 @ 12:01 pm
Paul, would you have a point-of-view on why MV Augusta was acquired in the first place? (i mean a 18-month devaluation of 69mil euro is quite a bit…)
December 28, 2005 @ 12:11 pm
Proton bought at 70Mil Euro but sold at 1Euro, there should actually be an inquiry into this. Even though Proton is a so called “private company”, it still derives most of its benefits and owe its very existance to the Malaysian public at large.
Sound to me like there is hanky panky going on at the very beginning of this so called MV Augusta purchase. Someone must have benefited from this purchase in the first place.
In 2006-2007, we would hear that proton want’s a soft loan from the government and at the same time, the government would try their best to convince the public to buy a piece of crap for transport. Another MAS story.
December 28, 2005 @ 12:19 pm
Suckers!
December 28, 2005 @ 12:32 pm
Dulu BMW ada jual Rover dengan harga 1 pound sterling. Beli 600 juta pound. Sekarang Rover pun dah muflis.
December 28, 2005 @ 12:54 pm
where is ACA, ACA, ACA!
December 28, 2005 @ 1:08 pm
hope this will be one of the good decisions that the new ceo is going to make.
December 28, 2005 @ 1:08 pm
cosmo : what talk you? No matter what business you are into, COMMON SENSE applies. The question is: why Mahaleel made the purchase in the first place? They can’t even produce a decent car, let alone producing motorcycles? Why wouldn’t they just concentrate on CARS in the first place? And what english are you sporting? Involved in rojak business? I understand
December 28, 2005 @ 1:12 pm
a bad move in my mind. both business-wise and integrity-wise ( not in a “national company” way , but more of the image of PROTON as a brand worldwide).. I wa quite surprised that they did not even considered changing the business scope a little bit. no flexibility on the knid of produts MV could design. It seemed it was a waste of money, time and honour..
December 28, 2005 @ 1:21 pm
1 Euro? WTF.
December 28, 2005 @ 1:22 pm
Cosmo brother, they should void this huge mistake at first place. Why bought? Used that money to build better and reliable transport to Malaysian rather than most of what other basher mention before.
December 28, 2005 @ 1:38 pm
Jenss!
Who can predict the future.. there’s always risk on investment. I believe Proton has done lot of investigation and analysis before they bought MV Agusta at the 1st place. But again, you cannot predict the future. Even BMW lose some ammount of money when they sold Rover..
Common ah Jess it always easy to talk talk talk especially when it doesnt involve thinking
December 28, 2005 @ 1:58 pm
JESS,
The problem is Proton didn’t do much thinking - that’s is why within a year they lost much. Perhaps they think with their balls/ego not with their brains.
BMW bought a car company, wisely or unwisely, but still part their core business.
Proton bought a bike company (also built aicraft apparently) wtf for when they are still struggling and a car manufacturer?
December 28, 2005 @ 2:11 pm
I agreed with KetukKepala.
Why MV Augusta was acquired in the first place? Who make the decision.
Can anyone comment on this?
December 28, 2005 @ 2:27 pm
agree with u jess N cosmo.
who can predict the future……unless proton built TIME MACHINE…….. ahak ahak ahak….
if i can predict the future, better i invest in bursa malaysia ( stock market) or 4 DIGIT or TOTO …… for sure make money…… after that i can buy proton N make MURAH N QUALITY car…….
like i said be4, this is big bussiness not selling nasi lemak…….. a lot of decision maker involve……. at that time the risk involved was lower(minimal) but the degree of risk keep changing….
others view…..i think proton want to get the technology. they want to compete with other and build better car 4 malaysian…… but no luck ma…..
HIGH RISK HIGH RETURN….. dare to change…. ahak ahak ahak
December 28, 2005 @ 2:42 pm
Even Mecedes wants to dispose all 37% shares in Mitsubishi, why? because mitsu wants more money to be injected into them.
December 28, 2005 @ 2:42 pm
Muthu said, “who can predict the future……unless proton built TIME MACHINE”
Macha, that also will break down and those using it will be surely be lost somewhere in time la! Aren’t they already?
December 28, 2005 @ 2:55 pm
What Tengku Mahalel want was “Malaysian product, lotus handling, italian design” I guess…..
December 28, 2005 @ 2:57 pm
Wonder will there be any independant audit investigation ? This is serious money being lost here.
December 28, 2005 @ 3:14 pm
Create customer loyalty and their own core brand wisely. In business easy to convince previous customer rather than new one…..This part missing from proton marketing strategy.
They can build high perfomance bicycles, high perfomance sport cars and superbike but how many of us wanna buy……together with their average build quality, parts and services reputation.
Build better saga, wira, perdana etc. …….
Ho…..hooo….. HAPPY NEW YEAR!
December 28, 2005 @ 3:17 pm
Man said,
December 28, 2005 @ 2:42 pm
Even Mecedes wants to dispose all 37% shares in Mitsubishi, why? because mitsu wants more money to be injected into them.
—–if i not mistaken Mitsubishi have bankrupt status(financial problem)……. they want proton inject more fund so that Y proton BLAH( terminate JV)……… so this was the right decision…….
December 28, 2005 @ 3:19 pm
Homer Simpson said,
December 28, 2005 @ 2:42 pm
Muthu said, “who can predict the future……unless proton built TIME MACHINEâ€
Macha, that also will break down and those using it will be surely be lost somewhere in time la! Aren’t they already?
ello brader…. how R U know…. U hav time machine ……? or U r NOSTRADAMUS……..? ahak ahak ahak
December 28, 2005 @ 3:48 pm
If POTONG is a real public-owned company, I wouldn’t mind a bit. But they’re using people’s money to squander.
Stupid Investment.
Wonder what this so called ” POTONG adviser” has to say about this?
I guess very little.
APANAMA APANAMA.
December 28, 2005 @ 3:49 pm
Muthu said, “who can predict the future……unless proton built TIME MACHINEâ€
Emm.. the next time I make a stupid decision I can borrow this line.
December 28, 2005 @ 3:56 pm
Oh god i cant believe people would knock them just because they dropped a joint-venture deal? Aww cmon. There are many smart comments on here on the volatility of business, getting out early before further losses, etc which i totally agree with but yet there are the unashamed (and irrational) bashers!
Take Jenss for example:
“Cosmo brother, they should void this huge mistake at first place. Why bought? Used that money to build better and reliable transport to Malaysian rather than most of what other basher mention before. ”
Avoid a huge mistake? Yes we all should. You should too. I should as well. But hey, shit happens and it could have been a well thought out venture, and educated guess-timate on Proton’s behalf. But still, as when you and i cross roads or walk around daily, we cant always avoid tripping up and falling on our faces occasionally. Shouldnt we be given clapclaps for knowing how to pick ourselves up, brush the wound off instead of slobbering and whining on the sidewalk?
As for that statement about building better/ reliable, well, maybe they re still acquiring transport-building knowhow.. Like via lotus and mv augusta?
KetukKepala was being equally dramatic:
“The problem is Proton didn’t do much thinking - that’s is why within a year they lost much. Perhaps they think with their balls/ego not with their brains.
BMW bought a car company, wisely or unwisely, but still part their core business.
Proton bought a bike company (also built aicraft apparently) wtf for when they are still struggling and a car manufacturer? ”
Look, horizonal expansion/ acquisitions are not unheard of, nor are they doomed failures. Saab and BMW were in aviation, before they acquired more resources and built cars.. If they hadnt the “balls/ego” and only your definition of “brains” then we d be without them Ultimate Driving Machines no? Tsk.
Besides, wtf do we TRULY know about the auto industry anyway (please excuse me if you re a vet in the business - if you are i m sure you understand the following).. I dont think its as easy as we say it is. Which explains the many Mitsubishis, Saabs, Skodas, (at one point) Kia, Rovers of this world - look its a tough balance. These car makers have had exemplary models, even pseudo class leaders (re: Evo-series) but yet are in the financial red? Take a moment and let that simmer. Dont be smug. It certainly aint easy.
(Disclaimer: Criticisms are always a good thing. But its gotta be constructive, rational and at least given some thought)
That said, Proton has had its fair share of mistakes and they do without a doubt, need positive moves in the right direction.
Like dumping a bleeding, burdening loss-incurring investment?
Hmm
December 28, 2005 @ 4:08 pm
ello aik……
agree with U lah……like i said B4……. cakap2 kosong ma…… at the N of the day nothing happen but mr PAUL screaming….” what happen 2 my blog…..”
lot of BASHERS here……. relax braders……. it only talk from unimportant people here who think they have voting right in PROTON…. ahak ahak ahak.. pity 4 u PAUL.
December 28, 2005 @ 4:14 pm
well , these bashers are the ones that have been supporting POTONG all this years.
So, basher or not, should respect their views. People got tired after 20 years driving the 20 year old best selling car in Malaysia.
BMW or other makes , they lost money but it’s not the people’s money.It’s their shareholders.And they always bounce back with better products.
WOKAY!!!
December 28, 2005 @ 4:15 pm
errr…me just change my scooter rims..bling-blings ones….anyway good move by proton…HIDUP WIRA se !!..
December 28, 2005 @ 4:17 pm
what a waste. buy 140 mil euro, inject money to mv agusta some more n then sell to other people for 1 euro. so? what did proton got from mv agusta?? mv agusta was already in debt at first when proton got it right? so why didnt proton buy it with 1 euro at the first place??? or may be proton did buy it with 1 euro, but another 139,999,999 euro went to somebodies pocket… i smell prawn behind the stone
btw, good business italians!
proton, b4 cut throat by mitubishi. now by mv agusta, AGAIN… n after this by a bug perhaps?
December 28, 2005 @ 4:40 pm
mv agusta was tengku mahaleel’s project just like lotus. italian designing capability. however b4 tengku mahaleel cld work on mv agusta to be a ‘core asset’ (designing is a core), he got kicked. so now the management decide to scrap what they called ‘non-core asset’. PROTON, are u blind? work yet to be done n u call it ‘non-core’.
btw proton, if u cant do car business, just stop. be a charity.org or chettier instead
December 28, 2005 @ 5:20 pm
Good call for proton….By buying MV Augusta we did manage to come up with the proton chancellor after 18 mths….Now if, DMC is still around and Rover is still up for grabs, we can buy more of this companies and transfer back some of their technology….
I agree with what someone said about spending more money to earn more money….It reminds me that we Malaysians like to take more money out of our pockets and invest it in something like proton and skim cepat kayas…
December 28, 2005 @ 5:34 pm
there goes our Tax money ..
December 28, 2005 @ 5:38 pm
I agree with Twoxer Hayzen..
Next is Malaysia Airlines..can I also bid for it? hahaha..
Bought at RM 313,600,000.00 and sold at RM 4.48..hmm I wonder where did their accountants get their degree from?
December 28, 2005 @ 5:49 pm
Hi KetukKepala ,
“Proton bought a bike company (also built aicraft apparently) wtf for when they are still struggling and a car manufacturer? ”
Good statement (5/5) ..when they cant even handle the car industry,they want to acquire other stakes and now sell it for a price which is cheaper than my daily average lunch..silly..really silly…
Patrick…i support you all the way man!!
December 28, 2005 @ 5:56 pm
tell me which national company/project didn’t make huge story!
UEM group? Perwaja Steel? Bakun? MAS? Proton? Bernas? Petronas?
bleh…
however, Proton have showed they’re ready to make the changes, hopefully light will prevail at the end of the dark tunnel.
December 28, 2005 @ 5:57 pm
Although BMW sold Rover for 10GBP, but BMW retained Land Rover, take up all their technology, developed BMW X5, sell like hot cakes, then sell off Land Rover to Ford with a hefty amount.
Proton…. Proton….. hahaha~~ if i am Proton, I’d sell it off with 1 Million, also a token sum already, but still, RM999,999 more than now; can pay salary for many already. Stupid Proton, saw BMW sell Rover for 10GBP, they want to be better than them, can make news; hence people know Proton, then Proton hope to increase popularity, and sell more cars. Ok, i was joking, but i really wanna bash Proton~ hohohohoh I hate Proton, not their cars. Their cars are innocent babies from STUPID PARENTS. Lolololol ….. Proton owners are kind adopters.
December 28, 2005 @ 6:33 pm
There is nothing wrong with “proton bashers” giving their views. i have, and still own a proton, and i also have more than my fair share negative views on the products and brand. But this all boils down again to what those ‘views’ actually are, and it relates to the “proton-basher” topic that paul started.
quoted from ZIE, “So, basher or not, should respect their views.”
If those views are total rubbish, and does not constitute any intelligent or educated comments, are we, the rest of the internet public, supposed to respect it? Sure, we have “free speech”, but that is a right we are privileged to have, and should not be abused.
To say things like “just close POTONG down tommorow, and we all get cheaper cars lah” is rubbish. We are stuck with proton whether we like it or not and we have to make our comments based on that reality.
The reality is, no matter what the future holds, proton bought MV, lost a whole load of money, thats the reality we cannot change, and the only good thing to come out of it was to sell it ASAP. better to stem the bleeding quickly. At least someone bought it.
December 28, 2005 @ 7:14 pm
no comment… nanti Paul erase my comment about Proton. he he ha ha
December 28, 2005 @ 7:40 pm
First & foremost, it makes perfect business sense to divest off non-core assets when a corporate restructuring is taking place. I’ve personally seen companies selling off prime properties, lands, motor vehicle, etc etc back when I was working as an auditor. For this step, I have to give the management a pat on the back. Better cut loose than lost even more in the future !
Next, the question……… are Proton really this short of capable brain-power ? We’ve seen numerous times somebody capable is put in charge of turning ailing corporation around. Auto industry should be familiar with Goshn name. A classic example of turning a business around ! If Proton were able to put someone right (and for once forget about the god damn politics) at the top of MV Agusta, the venture should prosper !
Nissan was there last time ….. on sale to Renault at a rock bottom price & assuming the debts….. In goes ‘Le Cost Cutter’ down goes the debt and up goes the value of the company…….
To sum it up, Proton make a right move now abeit a PR disaster one ! People all walks of life will conclude that Proton is incapable accross all layers of management !!! It definitely dented the credibility of the management of Proton.
My 2 cents
December 28, 2005 @ 8:08 pm
Mayb alot of ppl will compare this with BMW buying rover. but unlike proton which got burnt without getting anything in return, BMW took out Land Rover and also the MINI marque out of the rover group b4 letting it go for peanuts. now it still owns the MINI marque (along with other obscure marque’s like healy and such, but only in the name) and sold Land Rover to ford for a profit.
Proton?
December 28, 2005 @ 8:12 pm
I think a more pertinent question we should be asking is, does this deal affect us, the ordinary folk? The answer is yes, it does. Whether directly or indirectly because whatever affects Proton’s bottomline will have an impact on their overall performance. As it is, they are already being protected by the govt via import taxes and so on for their non-national competitors and this affects our choice.
So the money Proton loses will have to be further subsidised by the govt, maybe not directly but somehow will have to be. Maybe a further delay in the implementation of AFTA.
A deal like this must have been carefully thought out and to those of you who says no one can tell the future, then obviously you know nothing about business because no one will put money into a company without knowing what the returns are going to be like. This looks more like a case of mismanagement to me.
December 28, 2005 @ 8:31 pm
Hello Aik , the problem of this Proton investment is the rationale behind the acquisition in the first place. If the reason and objective is clear , fine , go for it. But for all you & I know is that mv augusta has a rich history in racing and design full stop. Business acutement … I am no corporate figure but I do know the basic between dare to vision , dream and make a mission out of it WITH sini tikam sana tikam … sini masuk sana masuk ma.
You said it right that even when crossing the road there is the occasional fall flat on the face. That is not the problem. The main thing is what was the purpose you were crossing the road. I mean if you kept crossing the road only to check how many ants and bugs was dating on the road , you were lucky not to be hit by by a proton , of all so many thing , forking T-Bike !!! Who to be blame ? An idiot who for no reason kept on crossing the road or a incompetent LUXURY cyclist .. tsk tsk tsk..
Of course there is no guarantee profit/success in investment or business except maybe expressway concessionaries. Key word is what was the reason for the investment ? For the design or the see how to match the bike colour onto SRM launch car tsk tsk tsk… think !
I am not bashing proton. I am saying whatever the reason, someone has got to stand up and take the heat for this pile of shit. This shit may cause us to continue subsidising our NATIONAL car into the next millenium and there goes my MAZDA 6 tsk.. tsk. tsk.. think!
December 28, 2005 @ 8:41 pm
guys, no use to say who right who wrong, who basher who not… u right, he right, everyone right. everyone wrong too.
is a huge lost to PROTON (i use PROTON here becoz…), but at least they sell this MV Agusta from getting more lost, and i believe this is becoz PROTON new mgt know that they can’t improve anything on MV Agusta in short period. since they want to improve their annual report in short period, sold off this company will seems to be a good decision.
but what ‘MutantTomato’ said is attracting me… will MV Agusta become another Airasia? i wondering if it happens, how the MV Agusta mgt manage to do it? while PROTON can’t? of coz it means something that PROTON lack about, am i right? if the new holder can’t improve MV Agusta also, then at least PROTON clear its shit already.
loss mean loss, forget that, and look to the future is the only way here. just hope next time don’t be the same. we can’t always ‘tahan’ a story like this. 1EURO? wat lao eh…
cheers…
December 28, 2005 @ 8:43 pm
So, if you criticise Proton then you are labelled Proton-basher?
Just like what G.W. Bush said, “either you are with us or you are with them” (or something like thatlah) ?
The current management is right to bail out from this deal. But the issue many people have including myself is, why and how the deal which appears dodgy, was struck in the first place. It raised a many eye brows then, including so called industry analysts.
Are we suppose to just say “takpe lah” , “nasiblah”, “they know what they are doinglah”.
70 mil Euro investment (mainly taxpayer money mind you) comes to almost nothing in such a short time is scandalous.
Horizontal expansion only at the appropriate time. Otherwise the company will go “horizontal”. Appropriate or not judge for youself.
December 28, 2005 @ 8:53 pm
Guys,
There’s an interesting debate on http://www.jeffooi.com on this issue.
Check it out.
December 28, 2005 @ 9:19 pm
it’s both stupid and wise.
stupid for not being able to look in the long run, stupid for not doing anything to improve that debt-laden company other than pumping in money. i dont wana explain panjang lebar on normal processes an acquiring company would do to a newly bought company and successfully turn it back to black, but i’ll just say, proton didnt do anything like them. ’nuff said.
wise bcoz it has finally disposed of that company, even at a huge, heavy loss.
anything more? alot… but now i malas to write. nobody would listen to a PBâ„¢ anyway…
December 28, 2005 @ 9:47 pm
Well….yet another dumb decision by good old proton..
Com’on, will proton ever give up to be a ‘car giant’ …either be ‘mini-me’ or closed the bloody hello down.
December 28, 2005 @ 10:29 pm
Twoxer Hayzen,
Read the blog you mentioned. Got to agree with you.
It’s interesting and kind of makes me think .
December 28, 2005 @ 10:30 pm
Well, for those of you who want to support proton the national cars to improve our economy, go ahead lah by all means.
It’s so pathetic when someone would want to compare this incident to emron, giving the excuses it also happened to the mat salleh world.
People in the bolehland, if u want to be the best in this planet, embrace the good and discard the bad.
hopeless….
December 28, 2005 @ 10:57 pm
waaa just buy n sell like jual kacang wut a bloody fool people in proton.r they bought their cert wut a shit old man
December 28, 2005 @ 11:19 pm
lol… last joke of 2005……
December 28, 2005 @ 11:52 pm
A good decision to release all stake inside MV Agusta. Luckily its was 1 year Proton was involved in MV Agusta. Thus they got the technology but their core business is more on car. A big applause for P1. Although they lost couple of mils but they are not lost bils yet. So pl out there pls do not blaming on them because they already admits their fault and pls do give them a chance to prove it again. I believe that P1 can do better in future.
The fact is Proton still can maintained it Vehicle Registration above 5000 units per month for Klang Valley areas!!! Who said Proton can’t sell!!!!!! This means P1 can sell more than 60, 000 units per annum. Dude, this number really big……Toyota & Honda can’t beat this figures!
For Toyota lovers, TOYOTA IS REALLY CRAP!!! A PIECE OF SH*T! F**K TOYOTA!
December 29, 2005 @ 12:26 am
another rm 300 million down the drain..
perwaja
bank islam
mas
potong
..and all other mega-projects that lost money
all the taxpayers money…
bangunan tertinggi di dunia, tapi jalan berlubang tak mau hirau atau repair…
tak ada orang sue tengku mahaleel ke?
December 29, 2005 @ 12:32 am
4G93-SC said -
“The fact is Proton still can maintained it Vehicle Registration above 5000 units per month for Klang Valley areas!!! Who said Proton can’t sell!!!!!! This means P1 can sell more than 60, 000 units per annum. Dude, this number really big……Toyota & Honda can’t beat this figures! ”
It’s because of all those “Pengguna Bijak” that is Malaysian carbuyers and the EVIL tax protection enjoyed by Protong that make this possible. Protong still can sell even though they r CHEAP (quality wise) is because they r CHEAP ($$$ wise).
About 6 months ago, I was told by many Protong sale reps that Protong have stopped the production of Wira sedan, n they r goin to stop the Wira Aeroback VERY soon. Wonder why the Aeroback is still around, and the sedan is reappearing in the showrooms?
>>>Waja and Junk2 is NOT selling enough to support its revenue!!!
December 29, 2005 @ 12:37 am
Almost all big companies, conglomerates, corporations and the like have made some really stupid mistakes in their business history. Stupid not because of the execution and the idea but because the idea wasn’t well thought out.
A few examples off the top of my head:
1. Colgate made some foodstuff. It didn’t sell well because people associated Colgate Palmolive with toothpaste and other soaps.
2. Heinz made bottled food for adults. The problem was the packaging was similar to their baby food line. Once again, this product failed.
3. Premier made smokeless cigarettes. The flavour was locked in a capsule and the cigarette paper was a special kind that didn’t emit smoke. Problem was it took too long to light and people just prefered seeing themselves blow out smoke!
In our own country, we can see many examples of such mistakes. For example:
1.Pepsi coming up with stupid drinks like Pepsi Tarik, Pepsi Fire
2. Maxis buying ADAM (they really got a can of worms there!)
I don’t think Proton did a mistake when they bought MV Augusta. The mistake they made is that they didn’t do anything with the company besides pump money into it, as quite a few people have said. If they had utilised the company’s technological background, designing expertise and so forth, they could have at least got something out of it. That would have also raised the price of the company.
Lastly but not least, 4G93-SC, don’t make comments like your brain is in your ass! OBVIOUSLY Proton would have high selling numbers in Malaysia! Its the cheapest damn car you can buy! There are many people out there who would much rather buy something else but they just don’t have the cash to do so!
And uhmm… “TOYOTA IS REALLY CRAP!!! A PIECE OF SH*T! F**K TOYOTA!” Wow…. What an astute comment… Must have taken you a reeeeeeeaaaaalllly long time to come up with such a good, informative comment…
December 29, 2005 @ 12:39 am
see fat said- “…bangunan tertinggi di dunia, tapi jalan berlubang tak mau hirau atau repair…”
Typical “heritage” left over from Mahathir-ism style of doing things - Stuff that can be seen from a macroview (KL Tower, KLCC, KLIA, Sepang F1 Circuit, Putrajaya, etc)r ALWAYS “Boleh”, stuff that can only be seen from a microview (roads, drainage, etc) and that affects the Rakyat r treated with the Malaysian trademark “Tidak apa” attitude…
Apa boleh buat? Dah jadi culture…
December 29, 2005 @ 12:48 am
This sorry episod happened when politics interfered with commercial decisions. No political will to dispose those lousy crap POTONG vendors producing cheap skate bl***dy auto parts.
So afraid to let the mat saleh to lead our national company.Instead,still clinging to the belif that a historian graduate can lead an auto company.
Wherethe hell is the culture of gemilang dan terbilang.
Mostlt NATO ( no action,talk only)
This POTONG is going down.i
December 29, 2005 @ 1:15 am
i agree with mutant tomato…the biggest mistake was proton din utilise the company’s technological background, designing expertise and so forth..when tengku aquire it, i am sure he got some plans for it..but b4 he could start his plans, he was forced out of proton..so end up with MV agusta being a white elephant..tengku focus more on Spottiness, so MV agusta is really a good investment..but since the new MD took over, he focus more on practicality and affordability..and he finds tat no use keeping MV agusta..
December 29, 2005 @ 7:13 am
i agree with infinity… yeah maybe the new MD goes for ‘practicality n affordability’ which is typical malaysian instead of ‘expanding and moving forward’. his a perodua guy! yup its ‘practical n affordable’—–> just copy japanese cars AKA perodua. BTW proton’s boards and management decision on mv agusta was utterly naive. are they expecting mv agusta investment going to bare fruit in merely 1 YEAR????? ok, invest in my ASB n i gerenti next year get profit…..
December 29, 2005 @ 7:29 am
Proton boight it for 70m euro. They keep pumping money into the company, paying their debts. Finally they sold it at 1 euro + 106.94m euro of debts = 106.940001 euro. Finally a wise decision also it is a little bit to late. I hear the same goes with Lotus. But please Proton, make sure there are some real technology transfer. We don’t even have to buy a high profile company. Maybe buying some patented stuffed will help us. Remember. The Japanese is the master in copying at their early stage. Learn from others, learn from mistakes. Meanwhile, whoever said Korean cars are better than locals I agree with them. But Korean automobiles industry has gone almost 50years. It is only in the last 5-6years recently their quality top mark other marques. Korean cars like Kia and Hyundai (One conglomerate actually) go a long way to achieve their status right now, not just 20 years. For Proton, 20 years is a short time. If we learn from others, we can cut it. Learn from the experience. Can u imagine to learn mathemathics by yourself instead learning it from a teacher? Think again We can cut short the time we need from our experience itself. Try other’s experience. Learn and listen, the improve. Proton is a Malaysian company. It is ours. Listen to the rakyat Proton.
December 29, 2005 @ 8:03 am
Assuming they will actually listen….
Its good that they finally bit the bullet and stop the hemoraging, but then again, the venture was a little suspect in the first place. Why would Proton stray away from the car business is beyond me (why they planning to jump ship and start making bikes?). This is different from buying Lotus. Sure its still loosing money but last time I checked, Lotus was still building cars…nice ones at that.
300m goes a long way to improve the already dissapointing range of cars Proton has.
This is the reality of Globalization. Whether we like it or not, its a global market and you WILL have to compete with the chinese and Koreans. If you can’t even compete locally in a fair manner, how does Proton plan to exist? Yes, 20 years may not be long in the car industry, but 20 years is long enough for the rakyat. If you loose our support (as in buy your products) you DIE.
Imagine if a baby is born in 1985 into a family with a Saga, he would probably end up buying a Saga after he graduates from college when he/she starts working, not because he/she wnts to, but probably the only car he/she can afford.
Maybe some of this has sunk in. I can see Proton reverting to cut-throat pricing to lure in customers and clear inventory.
Maybe this a wake up call, but then again, we all know how comatose Proton can be when it comes to the needs of the Rakyat.
December 29, 2005 @ 9:14 am
it has take a while from rebadging Mitsu cars to design (or part design) own cars. Just do a google and you can see how long other makes do such thing. Technology is not something that is easily available… may be you can do a patent search on what kind of IP MV Augusta has… the small engine category. With those kind of expertise Proton shpuld be able to do small engine easily.
However, since Perodua man is in charge, he might not want P1 to have own capability in small engine, but to let P2 do his business there (small engine category) enriching Toyota in the process.
P1 is doing the right thing according to the industrial masterplan, movin from labor intensive to knowledge intensive part of the industry. Although it take 20 yrs b4 start taking the 1st baby step.
We M’sian generally do not appreciate this kind of thing, prefering quick gains then long term gradual gain.
December 29, 2005 @ 9:19 am
ahak ahak ahak………. proton want 2 diversified it bussiness ma….. but unsystematic risk govern their portfolio…….. nobody should blame each others………
it also happen when late tan sri yahya want 2 buy LOTUS, everybody not agree with his ideas….. now we know what we get from lotus……
after that tg mahalel took over, so DARE TO CHANGE bought MV( he has long term planning…..) but failed…..
now new bos. Sell AGUSTA, what next…….He dare to change?
RAMBUT SAMA HITAM TAPI IDEAS LAIN LAIN ahak ahak ahak……
December 29, 2005 @ 9:31 am
aiyoh, just let the public be the major shareholder of Proton, then the public, which is WE can control the company’s future! Now all of you spit your words in this place, will it change anything?????????
December 29, 2005 @ 10:01 am
My fren Mutant Tomato,
Dude, look…. Its true that Proton didn’t utilised the technology of MV Agusta…But you know y the’ve to released it….That’s not their core business, their core business is more towards car..and they dun hv much time to focus on the bikes…hey man!! look i’ve been through the automotive line and i knw hw they works…if you dun knw nothin please shut up! and look after your stupid ass!…. Dude, they bought MV because Tun M wanted to try on others things besides cars…they can bought jet ski company too…but as we knw that Tun M really loves in motosports thus Proton can’t perform in car race then they involved in superbikes race as u knw that the superbikes mkt share in M’sia very niche. Thats y Tun M & his apprentice Tg Mahaleel bought MV to show to the world that Malaysian can win in World Championship race ….
The same thing also happened to Petronas when they produce their RM 100 over thousand of FP-1….U think the bikes can sell??? Bikes cost about RM 100,000 over…. As we knw that petronas core business was petroluem and gas but when they produce the FP-1 its totally a failure project and they is no people to take care of the project…Just leaving to the engineering department… I think Proton should released all stake inside MV because they can’t concentrate and Malaysians keep blaming them because they making loss…. Hey dude….Proton didn’t used the ppl moneys (e.g. tax)…. Ppl paying tax for govt. dude not for proton… And Proton also have to pay tax to govt dude….Tax from the car ppl bought is used by P1 to pay to Govt… Govt takes our tax and pay for the Police & Army forces…For their salary….Y u guys wanted to blamed on P1….. Do u guys knw hw P1 was setup??? Hey dude, if there’s no P1…can we b proud of being Malaysian….
YEs, i hate Toyota & Honda because y…..They killed us….Y we wanted to buy a car from outside and let our ringgit value decreased…Y we wanted to support the Nippon cars…??? Gimme a reason Mutant Tomato….R u Malaysian enough???
Now you speak to me Mutant Tomato…so do infinity and whoever support the Mutant Tomato statement…..
What the he*l if you dun knw the industry Mutant Tomato!!!! Keep your ass off k….
December 29, 2005 @ 10:01 am
Wah lau eh…
New boss next move acquire P2 & learnt their quality control… toyota quality control methods. What TUV really helps for proton?? We still can’t see anythings. Any new proton owner want to make some comment on your newly proton baby.
December 29, 2005 @ 10:24 am
ello brader 4G93-SC
gua salute U…….. i will rank your comment as A+(my view). so patriotic…….. this is what we call good statement, but i’m affraid others will not get the points…….
another salute 2 you……..(TABIK SPRING BEB-3X)
December 29, 2005 @ 10:27 am
Bravo! Proton should not have acquired MV Augusta in the first place. We have no business in them. Proton should invest into Malaysian companies that supplies parts to their vehicles. Support the Malaysian manufacturers to help improve the quality of parts needed to build Proton’s, get better value and better quality.
December 29, 2005 @ 10:37 am
kody said,
December 29, 2005 @ 10:01 am
Wah lau eh…
New boss next move acquire P2 & learnt their quality control… toyota quality control methods. What TUV really helps for proton?? We still can’t see anythings. Any new proton owner want to make some comment on your newly proton baby.
—-ello brader, last time we always heard that people complaints about proton quality, so they bring TUV 2 overcome this problems, take time ma……. so look at SAVVY, the quality is very good…….
December 29, 2005 @ 10:51 am
4G93-SC, your logic is mind bogglingly stupid! Here’s what I mean:
“YEs, i hate Toyota & Honda because y…..They killed us….Y we wanted to buy a car from outside and let our ringgit value decreased…Y we wanted to support the Nippon cars…??? Gimme a reason Mutant Tomato….R u Malaysian enough???”
————————-
Whooooaaaaa!! So if we buy foreign cars, our Ringgit will devalue? Hmmm… So that means, every country excluding Germany is devaluing their currency for buying BMW and Mercs right? Or every country except France is devaluing their currency for buying Citroen and Peugeot right?
Funny isn’t it? The Govt. makes a KILLING from taxes imposed on those Jap cars… Yet, you see SO MANY people owning/driving them… e.g. the price of a brand new VIOS in Thailand? RM45000. A brand new VIOS here? RM82000. I do not “support” “Nippon” cars, but I will choose a car that gives me my money’s worth. Right now, I don’t see anything from Proton being of money’s worth. If I am not pressed to buy a Proton, why should I? Why can’t I get a Jap car or a Conti car or something for the money I am paying?
I drove a Wira for 8 years. I had a Satria before that. I am basing my comments on personal experience. The build quality is terible! The spare parts are damn expensive! Tell me why Proton headlamps are more expensive than the lamps for the Corolla SEG… The power windows fail, the rubber seals leak after awhile (Less than 5 years), the car body rattles, etc etc etc…
Here’s the clincher though… I drove a Proton Persona and a Satria Gti when I was in UK… Comment? They were excellent! No complaints! So now, let me ask you, who is forking who over? Are we forking over Proton by not supporting them, or are they forking us over for giving us the “tak lulus” batch of Protons and sending the best ones overseas?
“Hey dude….Proton didn’t used the ppl moneys (e.g. tax)…. Ppl paying tax for govt. dude not for proton… And Proton also have to pay tax to govt dude….Tax from the car ppl bought is used by P1 to pay to Govt… Govt takes our tax and pay for the Police & Army forces…For their salary….Y u guys wanted to blamed on P1….. Do u guys knw hw P1 was setup??? Hey dude, if there’s no P1…can we b proud of being Malaysian….”
————————–
Ok, I’ve read this part about five times over and I finally have an idea what it is you’re trying to say… Anyhow, this is what I gather… Proton was set up with the ambitious idea of producing our very own car. A very good idea I must say. Your logic of “We pay Proton for cars, they pay Govt. for tax, Govt. uses tax to pay civil servants” is relatively correct. However, we ALSO pay income tax, quit rent, loan repayments, assessments, service tax, government tax, import tax, etc etc etc… Those also are used by the Govt to fund projects and pay salaries. Proton is not a service. Proton is a business. The tax they pay to the Govt is far lower than the profits they make. “Hey dude, if there’s no P1…can we b proud of being Malaysian….” Are you telling me that you are incapable of seeing ANYTHING else we have besides Proton to justify your pride for Malaysia? Our world class islands and resorts? Our culture? Our infrastructure? Our advancements in the past 30 odd years? There are so many other things that make me proud to say I AM A MALAYSIAN….
Lastly, please don’t make stupid statements like “R u Malaysian enough” just because I choose not to support Proton… If you’re such a patriot and “Malaysian” and hate foreign products so much because they “let our ringgit value decreased,” then do this:
1. Don’t wear jeans, t shirts, shirts, trousers, ANY Western clothes.
2. Don’t eat ANY fast foods like McDonalds, KFC, Pizza Hut, etc.
3. Don’t use household items like soap and toothpaste that is made by Colgate or Proctor&Gamble, etc.
4. Don’t consume Panadol or any other foreign owned medicines.
Remember, I am using YOUR logic i.e. if you do all the above, then you are letting our money go out of the country and are making foreigners rich while “our ringgit value decreased.” Now, if you think my reasoning is stupid, its because YOUR logic is stupid. If you think I am right, its because YOUR logic is right…
Think about it…
December 29, 2005 @ 11:03 am
Dear 4G93,
Quote: the fact is Proton still can maintained it Vehicle Registration above 5000 units per month for Klang Valley areas!!! Who said Proton can’t sell!!!!!! This means P1 can sell more than 60, 000 units per annum. Dude, this number really big……Toyota & Honda can’t beat this figures!
Agreed. PROTON can sell their cars, despite the decreasing numbers over the years.
The big picture is if you bring car prices down to realistic levels (without exorbitant tax protecting the national industry), it is doubtful PROTON would sell.
Price is a key concern for automotive buyers. It has always been said next to a house, it would be the second biggest investment/purchase by a person.
Before we get into a debate about quality, it mustbe clarified that PROTON’s quality is fair. It’s not Chinese quality, but then again its not BMW or Mercedes either.
But the issue of quality in PROTON is its inability to address the poor quality areas. The list always begins with power windows, and goes on. It affected even the first batch of Gen.2s.
So if you were to put the Gen.2 against the City &Vios, plus the Waja against the Civic , Sentra & Altis, and remove protectionist polices, I’d venture to guess that PROTON may suffer.
I agree with protectionist policies for PROTON in the first 10 years, but the plan should have been to alow it to compete less on price thereafter, but more on quality.
To be sure, PROTON is going in the right direction. The new plant, TUV affiliation, the CAMPRO (well, not fully CAMPROed yet), and other quality initiatives proves this.
Yet, trailing issues like incompetent vendors (despite brags to load them off), persist. And while PROTON moves both forward and backwards, other carmakers are moving ahead too.
So its a race against time for PROTON.
I feel just as patriotic as any man on this blog. But patriotism and national pride must be justified. Para-phrasing from GETAH in http://www.jeffooi.com; if you’re an American against the Iraq invasion, national pride in the presidency would be misplaced.
I want to see PROTON succeed. I want to see PROTONs on British, American and Australian roads as many as we see them in KL.
But my wants may not become a reality if we don’t check the rot.
If you say they bought MV Agusta because Tun DM wanted to try something new, heck. It’s not his company. It belongs to Malaysians. You cannot run it like it was yours.
Leadership is pivotal. TO BE A GOOD LEADER, FIRST YOU MUST BE A GOOD FOLLOWER.
December 29, 2005 @ 11:30 am
Ada gak untung sikit…
PROTON Holdings Bhd dianggarkan meraih keuntungan 38.2 juta euro (RM171.09 juta) daripada pelupusan pegangan ekuitinya dalam syarikat pengeluar motosikal terkemuka Itali, MV Agusta Spa kepada Gevi Spa.
Keuntungan berkenaan diperoleh selepas mengambil kira pelupusan itu yang turut membabitkan Gevi mengambil alih tanggungan Agusta berjumlah 139.44 juta euro (RM624.9 juta), ditolak pendedahan Proton dalam pengeluar motosikal itu sebanyak 101.3 juta euro RM453.5 juta).
December 29, 2005 @ 12:03 pm
So lets make it simple.. Proton acquired MGV agusta for the purpose of using its vendors all around europe and italy to sell proton cars..thats what they taught would work for a while.. But there’s something that one calls as “prediction “.In business if u were to venture into something new u must make sure that the new thing will benefit u..and u also predict that if something were to go wong u must still be able to stand on ur feet.. So the purchase of lotus might has seemed smart because if it didnt generate profit it cud still do R& D, something that every car industry should have…
Well from the PROTON side they maybe taught buying MGV agusta was more of a branding then a profit generating venture..well imagine a company from a country like malaysia buying an italian goverment protected company.what an impact it cud bring to the branding of Proton.
So,
at the end of the day it might just be another wrong venture or investment for proton.. besides thats all part of a business cycle..
December 29, 2005 @ 12:08 pm
Crash,
That’s called paper gain. It’s only a gain because they provisioned for losses earlier. If they provided less, they’d not gain, if they provided more, they’d gain more.
No real money. Great for accounting!
December 29, 2005 @ 12:42 pm
i wish some of you dumbass stop using the word potong, it doesn’t sound closely similar or clever. you might think it is clever because the meaning of potong but it’s irritattingly stupid.
December 29, 2005 @ 1:25 pm
too many negative thinking in this forum..
December 29, 2005 @ 1:30 pm
Hey MT,
Nice comeback. I agree with everything you said and more. I also think some of the “contributors” on this blog feels they have greater patriotism than Proton itself! What a travesty!
The problem with our automotive market is that it is entirely unfair for the consumers because we are “forced” via taxes and so on to buy P1/P2 cars and yet, the other makes are doing so well. Question is, if they can, even with an unequal playing field, what’s wrong with Proton? Is it just the quality? Or is there something else?
I think the rakyat is also fed-up with all the protection P1 is getting and wants to make it known. My entire family has disowned P1, with the exception of a 3yr old Waja just waiting to be retired anytime soon. Do we have any regrets? None whatsoever, except for my dad who’s still driving the Waja.
December 29, 2005 @ 1:31 pm
—–MutantTomato said,
4G93-SC, your logic is mind bogglingly stupid! Here’s what I mean
ello brader MutantTomato.
what 4G93-SC said is true not a logic from his brain……..
if we want 2 discuss/report about proton quality, better go direct to proton ma….. i dont think that paul can handle it……
December 29, 2005 @ 1:43 pm
——Marmitecrab said,
December 29, 2005 @ 1:30 pm
…..The problem with our automotive market is that it is entirely unfair for the consumers because we are “forced†via taxes and so on to buy P1/P2 cars and yet, the other makes are doing so well. Question is, if they can, even with an unequal playing field, what’s wrong with Proton? Is it just the quality? Or is there something else?…..
ello brader
if u think that your PURCHASING POWER is high, better buy others than P1 N P2….. if u want quality car which is MURAH, better stay at LANGKAWI or others free duty area…….. if U think that U dont 1 2 buy P1 or P2 N no money, i think just use public transport lo……
December 29, 2005 @ 1:50 pm
it amazes me that these proton bashers whink they know all about automotive industry. proton existence has help SMI industries in Malaysia to grow. we need heavy industry in this country, and not just importing cars. of course, major reforms must be made now, but destructive comments are just dragging down the process. give constructive comments, not just moans!!
December 29, 2005 @ 2:05 pm
Dear Muthu,
I’m agreed with you too brotha’…..
thnks
December 29, 2005 @ 2:16 pm
I agree with MUTANT TOMATO!!!!
I’m proud to be a Malaysian but certainly not proud at all talking about having PROTON…..living like a parasit worst than a cancer….
December 29, 2005 @ 2:20 pm
“Proton mampu raih RM171.09j
PROTON Holdings Bhd dianggarkan meraih keuntungan 38.2 juta euro (RM171.09 juta) daripada pelupusan pegangan ekuitinya dalam syarikat pengeluar motosikal terkemuka Itali, MV Agusta Spa kepada Gevi Spa.Firma penganalisis OSK Research berkata, keuntungan berkenaan diperoleh selepas mengambil kira pelupusan itu yang turut membabitkan Gevi mengambil alih tanggungan Agusta berjumlah 139.44 juta euro (RM624.9 juta), ditolak pendedahan Proton dalam pengeluar motosikal itu sebanyak 101.3 juta euro RM453.5 juta).
“Keuntungan ini mampu menampung semula peruntukan awal berjumlah 35.9 juta euro yang dibuat (Proton bagi Agusta) dan berpotensi menghasilkan masuk kira semula (ke dalam akaunnya) berjumlah 2.3 juta euro (RM10.3 juta).
“Justeru, kesan bersih daripada pelupusan itu dilihat sebagai positif kepada Proton, di samping menghapuskan keperluan Proton untuk menanggung lebih banyak tanggungan pada masa depan berikutan ketidaktentuan kedudukan MV Agusta,†kata firma itu dalam analisisnya berhubung pelupusan itu semalam.
Proton kelmarin mengumumkan anak syarikatnya Proton Capital Sdn Bhd sudah memeterai perjanjian bagi melupuskan 57.75 peratus kepentingannya dalam Agusta kepada Gevi pada harga 1 euro (RM4.47).
Pengambilalihan oleh Gevi itu meliputi hutang Agusta yang berjumlah 106.94 juta euro (RM478 juta), di samping keperluan modal kerja sebanyak 32.5 juta (RM145.3 juta).
OSK Research berkata, pendedahan Proton dalam Agusta berjumlah 101.3 juta euro itu meliputi hutang bersih 70 juta euro dan 31.3 juta euro modal kerja yang disuntik oleh Proton Cars UK.
Katanya, sehingga suku pertama tahun kewangan semasa, Proton sudah membuat peruntukan kira-kira RM161 juta untuk Agusta.
Sementara itu, pelabur menyambut baik keputusan yang dibuat Proton itu apabila sahamnya yang didagangkan semula semalam meningkat 15 sen kepada RM6.30 berbanding RM6.15 sesaham Jumaat lalu.
Urus niaga saham pengeluar kereta nasional itu digantung kelmarin bagi pengumuman pelupusan berkenaan…..”
PROUD TO BE MALAYSIAN
December 29, 2005 @ 2:36 pm
Antara Savvy dan Myvi
MESKIPUN Savvy bukanlah dalam kategori saiz yang sama dengan Perodua Myvi, pelancaran mereka pada tempoh hampir sama membuatkan orang ramai akan membandingkan kedua-duanya.
Savvy berada pada julat harga pertengahan antara Myvi 1.0 liter dan 1.3 liter (antara RM41,500 hingga RM51,500 seunit).
Proton Savvy ialah kereta kecil yang berorientasikan sport dan kepantasan manakala Myvi ialah kereta keluarga yang luas, cantik, sporty dan selesa untuk keluarga serta kualiti binaan dan kemasannya juga baik. Tambahan pula genetik Myvi ialah dari baka Toyota dan Daihatsu.
Myvi lebih selesa dipandu dalam bandar terutama dengan gear automatiknya, manakala Savvy untuk meredah lebuh raya dan memecut (jaga perangkap laju) pada kos rendah iaitu harga belian dan ciri penjimatan minyaknya.
Myvi yang disasarkan untuk yang bujang dan keluarga muda, terutama mereka yang upgrade dari Kancil atau Kelisa. Myvi mengketengahkan rekaan `cabin forward’ menghasilkan ruang lapang dan selesa. Kerusi belakang ada ruang kaki yang luas. Bagi mengoptimumkan keselesaan dalam perjalanan jauh, kerusi depan direka mengikut kontor badan dan ruang barang yang luas. Bumbung pula lebih tinggi berbanding kereta biasa menjadikan kereta ini terasa lapang manakala rekaan pintu yang boleh dibuka hingga 80 darjah memudahkan keluar dan masuk.
Mahu pilih Savvy atau Myvi? Tepuk dada tanya selera dan lihat duit di dalam poket.
December 29, 2005 @ 2:41 pm
(sigh)……..
Mutant tomato wrote..
“Here’s the clincher though… I drove a Proton Persona and a Satria Gti when I was in UK… Comment? They were excellent! No complaints! So now, let me ask you, who is fscking who over? Are we forking over Proton by not supporting them, or are they forking us over for giving us the “tak lulus†batch of Protons and sending the best ones overseas”
mm…u got some points there…..
SCREW u PROTON
i damn agree….
December 29, 2005 @ 3:08 pm
Buying Gen2 or Vios??
For those who wanted to buy a new car…If anyone interested in any of the above models please do make a study 1st before you spend your money…
(Compared between Gen2 1.6 High Line spec. with Vios 1.5G)
As we know the price of Gen2 1.6 are much lower than Vios 1.5G
Gen2 cost around RM 58,000 to RM63,000 while Vios cost around RM80,000 above.
What can you get from Gen2 1.6 HL compared to Vios 1.5G
Gen2 1.6 HL
ENGINE MODEL S4PH
VALVE MECHANISM DOHC 16V
BORE X STROKE 76.0 mm x 88.0 mm
TOTAL DISPLACEMENT 1597 cc
FUEL SYSTEM MPI
MAXIMUM POWER
110 hp (82 kW) @ 6000 rpm
MAXIMUM TORQUE
148 Nm @ 4000 rpm
PERFORMANCE
M/T A/T
MAXIMUM SPEED 190 km/h 185 km/h
ACCELERATION 0 - 100 KM/H 10.5 sec 13.0 sec
FUEL CONSUMPTION@ 90KM/H CONSTANT 5.8 L/100 km 6.2 L/100 km
FEATURES
HIGH-LINE:
Anti-Lock Braking System (ABS)
Electronic Brake Force Distribution (EBD)
Dual SRS Front Airbags
Leather Interior
STANDARD / HIGH-LINE:
Signature Intake Grille
Headlight Cluster
Moulded Bumper
Bee Sting Antenna
Hot Hatch: Compact Body Length
Alloy Rims
Wing Mirror
Wraparound Rear Light Cluster & High-Mounted 3rd Brake Light
Chrome Finish Exhaust
Spacious Luggage Area
Space Age Centre Console
Meter Cluster with Digital Display of Average Fuel Consumption, Distance to Empty and Journey Time Tracker
Steering Wheel with Audio Control Buttons & Drive-By-Wire System
Integrated Access Key
12V Power Outlet
Power Windows
Handy Hidey Holds
Door Trim
Audio System
Seat Design
CAMPRO Engine
Anti-Corrosion
Security with CAPTOR
Vios 1.5G
ENGINE
Model 1NZ-FE
Type In-line 4-Cylinder DOHC VVT-i
Displacement cc 1,496
Bore & Stroke 75.0 x 84.7
Compression Ratio 10.5 : 1
Max. Output EEC Net 80kW (109PS) / 6,000 rpm
Max. Torque EEC Net 142Nm ( 14.5kg-m) / 4,200 rpm
TRANSMISSION
Type 4-Speed Automatic with Super ECT
DIMENSION
Tread Front 1,455 mm
Rear 1,430 mm
Kerb Weight kg 980
Fuel tank capacity litre 45
Minimum Turning Radius m 5.3
Anti-lock Braking System (ABS) With
Electronic Brake-force Distribution (EBD) With
Front Fog Lamps With
High-mount Stop Lamp With
Shift Lock System With
Rear Window Defogger With
(Passive Safety)
GOA Body With
SRS Airbag Driver With
Passenger With
Side Door Impact Beams With
Head Impact Protection Structure With
Whiplash Injury Lessening (WIL) Front Seats With
Seat Belt Front 3-Point ELR x 2
Rear 3-Point ELR x 2 + 2-Point NR x 1
Adjustable Seatbelt Anchor With
Collapsible Steering Column With
Safe Brake Pedal With
Result, Gen2 performs better than the Vios.
Fuel consumptions Gen 2 1.6 HL Vios 1.5G
Full tank 40 L = RM65 45 L = RM73
RM 0.095 per/km RM 0.13 per/km
Engine CAMPRO VVT-i
(CAM Profiling System) (Variable Valve Timing)
+ intelligence
Which one better?
Both are in the same function
VVT-i
By optimising the timing of the valves, the engine promises performance whether you are accelerating, cruising or overtaking. The engine delivers solid torque through low-to medium rpms.
CAMPRO
The Campro engine is the first automotive engine ever developed by a Malaysian automotive giant, Proton. The name Campro is short for Cam Profile. This engine powers the Proton Gen-2 as well as Proton’s future models. The Campro engine is aimed to show Proton’s ability to make their own engines that produces good power output and meets newer emission standards
Basic DOHC engine
The basic Campro engine coded as S4PH is a basic DOHC 16-valve 1.6 L engine that produces 110 bhp (82 kW) @ 6,500 rpm of horsepower and 148 N-m of torque. This is the engine that powers the Proton Gen-2. The S4PH engine features the variable inlet manifold technology. Besides of this 1.6 L engine, Proton also plans to produce the 1.3 L version of the Campro engine.
Even though the engine seems to be quite powerful at higher revs, its performance is reportedly sluggish at lower revs and this is proven by driving the Gen-2 uphills where drivers who drive the manual transmission version have to shift a lot between 2nd gear and 3rd gear. This is due to its poor low-end torque especially between 3,000 ~ 3,5000 rpm where the turque decreases slightly before picking up back to the maximum torque at 4,000 rpm. Proton should remap the ECU to give more torque at low revs.
Before the engine is ready to be installed in the Gen-2 cars, Proton installed the engine in the Waja specialized for on-road tests.
Currently the Campro engines installed in the Gen-2 has none of the promised cam-profiling and variable inlet manifold technologies. No date nor any information has been known as to when Proton will equip its models with the promised full-spec engine, if ever.
Campro CPS engine
In addition to the basic DOHC engine, Proton developed its own variable valve timing technology that works similar with other variable valve technologies such as Honda VTEC and Toyota VVTi, named as CPS (Cam Profile Switching) technology. The usage of CPS tehnology will raise the maximum power up to about 127 bhp and will improve the low-end torque to its maximum value which will maintain until about 5,000 rpm. The technology is said to be applied to newer Gen-2s and future models starting from the end of 2005, but currently the CPS technology is still under testing.
Campro GDI engine
Recently, Proton is developing their own gasoline direct injection version of Campro engines which will be used in the future. Currently, the Campro GDI engine is still under research and development, therefore very little information available for the Campro GDI engine.
Supercharged Campro engine
Recently, Proton has announced to collaborate with Kleemann, the company that supplies superchargers for Mercedes Benz Kompressor models for the coming Proton Satria replacement model. Little is known about the engine, but the engine is rumored as a 1.8L engine equipped with a supercharger supplied by Kleemann.
Dear Buyers, as the details delivers to you….Hopes you guys can make your decision for buying your new car…
tHANKs
December 29, 2005 @ 3:24 pm
My buddy Mutant Tomato,
Now you can see the development of Proton compared to others….
Mutant tomato wrote..
“Here’s the clincher though… I drove a Proton Persona and a Satria Gti when I was in UK… Comment? They were excellent! No complaints! So now, let me ask you, who is fscking who over? Are we forking over Proton by not supporting them, or are they forking us over for giving us the “tak lulus†batch of Protons and sending the best ones overseasâ€
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Yes its true that the UK specs are much better but P1 have to suit according with their weather… Other CBU cars also like that too ma…..For example the one CKD in Thailand and Indonesia (Toyota) not all that car 100% perfect that been brought in here….
What technology can u get from others CBU cars compared you can gained from P1. Can u get an ABS, EBD & Dual Air Bag for just RM 60k??? Hw bout the interior design??? Can you get a leather with semi bucket seat with just that amount??? What else u expect from P1 to do…? Do you realize their margin and profit for giving all the technology to us…..To make Malaysian feel the technology likes other CBU cars (Merc, BMW and Volvo….) We can’t expect the $$$ of P1 to be super lower likes other CBU cars in their home country….Because Merc, BMW etc started their automotive industry since WW1… Ours in 1980s….What else do u expect…?? Look, at least we can proud of P1 thats we have the CAMPRO (own design engine) compare to Koreans car which still using Japanese engine and FORD engine.
“I’M A PROTON OWNER”
“LOVE TO BE PROTON”
“PROUD TO BE MALAYSIAN”
December 29, 2005 @ 3:51 pm
aiyoh why never write about your satria anymore, paul?
December 29, 2005 @ 3:54 pm
Pretty obvious proton kena con already lah! What can we do if we don’t have sharp business man in proton?????
December 29, 2005 @ 4:14 pm
ello brader 4G93-SC
gua tabik spring 10X lagi sekali…… ahak ahak ahak….. if others think 4G93-SC merepek or use logic, better cq the manual(savvy, G2, VIOS, myvvi). all the statement is true(2nd da motion)……
——–Mutant tomato wrote..
“Here’s the clincher though… I drove a Proton Persona and a Satria Gti when I was in UK… Comment? They were excellent! No complaints! So now, let me ask you, who is fscking who over? Are we forking over Proton by not supporting them, or are they forking us over for giving us the “tak lulus†batch of Protons and sending the best ones overseasâ€
i’ve been told that all proton either local or Xport R the same quality……(inform by 1 of analyst from smithzain securities-sub merill lynch).
PPPPPPPPPPPRRRRRRRROOOUUUDDDDDDDDD 2 BBBBBBB MMAAAALLLLAAAYYYYYYYSSSSSSSSSIIIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNN
December 29, 2005 @ 4:15 pm
Gen-2 vs Vios ?
malulah nak cerita.
December 29, 2005 @ 4:18 pm
Just see when new chief report to work next week ….
December 29, 2005 @ 4:34 pm
Dear 4G93-SC,
R u sure Gen 2 Fuel consumption is RM0.095/KM???? Better than Kancil???
I think RM 0.15-0.17/KM is more like it……BTW, Vios fc is RM0.10-0.11/KM.
December 29, 2005 @ 4:40 pm
Proton (company)
Proton, short for Perusahaan Otomobil Nasional (Malay for National Automobile Enterprise), is a Malaysian car manufacturer initiated in 1983 by Prime Minister Mahathir Mohamad. The old plant is located in Shah Alam and the new plant is located in Tanjung Malim, Perak. The architectural design on the building facade depicts an image of a gull wing. The Proton Tanjung Malim Plant (PTMP) is part of a mixed delelopment town project, Proton City where the PTMP makes 30% of Proton City.
Based on technology and parts from Mitsubishi, production of the first model, the Saga, began in 1985. Until the end of the 1990s, the car’s logo featured the crest from Malaysia’s coat of arms, featuring a crescent and a fourteen-pointed star. The new Proton logo features stylized tiger head.
Initially the components of the car were entirely made of parts manufactured by Mitsubishi but slowly local Malaysian parts were being used as technology is transferred and skills are gained. With the acquisition of Lotus technologies in 1996 from Bugatti, Proton has gained an additional source of technologically challenging parts.
By 2002 Proton held a market share of over 60 per cent in Malaysia, which was reduced to barely 30 percent by 2005 and is expected to reduce further in 2008 when AFTA mandates reduce import tariffs to a maximum of 5%. Proton cars are exported to the United Kingdom and Australia and is aggressively marketing their cars in several other countries including the Middle East.
In December 2004, Proton purchased a majority share in MV Agusta of Italy. MV Agusta is the manufacturer of MV Agusta, Husqvarna, and Cagiva motorcycles. A year later, Proton sold off its 57.7% share in MV Agusta to another Italian company for a token of one Euro. MV Agusta suffered heavy debt and the selling enabled Proton to write off the losses off its book.
Proton is listed on the Bursa Malaysia.
History
The first Proton car model, Proton Saga, rolled off the assembly line in Shah Alam in September 1985. The 100,000th Proton Saga was produced in January 1989. [1]
In 1993, a model called Proton Wira was introduced based on the Mitsubishi Lancer/Colt. More than 220,000 units were sold between 1996 and 1998 [2]. Proton Perdana based on the Mitsubishi Eterna, was first produced in 1994, intended for higher end market. Proton Waja is the first car model designed internally by Proton. It is called Proton Impian in the UK market. The second generation, replacement model for Proton Wira is called Proton Gen-2. It was launched on February 8, 2004. On June 8, 2005 Proton introduced a 1,200 cc, 5-door compact car called the Proton Savvy.
In 1996, Proton bought Lotus Cars.
In October 2004, Proton announced that an understanding has been reached with Volkswagen AG of Germany to establish a strategic partnership. Under the tie-up, the two carmakers are expected to exploit each other’s strengths. Proton would gain access to Volkswagen’s superior technical capabilities and technology. In return, Volkswagen may utilise Proton’s spare capacity at the latter’s Tanjung Malim to assemble cars for export to the South-East Asian market, where the German auto giant has a weak presence. Furthermore, the tie-up may see Volkswagen assist in distributing Proton vehicles in China while Proton does the same for Volkswagen in South-East Asia. Nonetheless, at this juncture both parties have yet to announce detailed and concrete plans for the partnership.
Exports
The company first began exports to other right hand drive markets like New Zealand in the late 1980s, but it was much more successful in the United Kingdom where it was introduced in 1989. Advertised with the slogan Japanese Technology, Malaysian Style, Proton cars proved popular among budget-oriented motorists, and like Japanese and South Korean models before them, led to the demise of Eastern-bloc manufacturers such as Lada and Zastava. By the 1990s, Proton had already withdrawn from the New Zealand market after offering only the Saga four-door and Persona five-door models.
Proton also exports cars to countries in Southeast Asia and Australia, and now produces models in left hand drive, for export to continental Europe. An entry into the US market was considered, following Hyundai’s successful launch in the mid 1980s. However, exports to the US never materialised, as the cars required hundreds of changes to meet American safety standards.
It is a company that can be used as a case study for rent seeking as tariffs on imported